04-08-2005 13:40									#1
	Reign of Meadishi II Increase the size of your Attachments

I apologise for the slow motion of this game.

The empire is growing. We're lagging in techs. Joncnunn explained his strategy of fighting a big neighboor (Urakami) to have them sign peace at the expense of some techs. At the moment, the best we can get is 1 gpt. Meanwhile the Matsunaga are a small neighboor, we could easily take over.

I understand Joncnunns point of view, but I also see the risk of having to fight a hard war and suffer quite a few losses. For that matter I would prefer to turn our eyes on Matsunaga to acquire their cities. This growth will allow us to have more economical strength as well as more capacities in training new units. We'll also be able to have 1 border less, so would be less vulnerable to suprise attacks.

I see some great city spots:
111 from Noriko's Seaview
333 from Gems r Us

Rather than play and teach, I'd like to have some input on the idea's of you all.

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	04-08-2005 13:49									#2
	Reign of Meadishi II Increase Your PM Length

double post for some reason

Last edited by McMeadows on 04-08-2005 at 16:22

	04-08-2005 13:52									#3
	Remove this text

I like the idea to crush Matsunaga once and forever. But we need to be at war with only one neighbour at any time.

I guess the Urakami have yamabushi monks and it will be very hard for us to attack them. If possible, make peace and some gold, maps, techs from them.

	04-08-2005 13:55									#4
	Re: Reign of Meadishi II Support Apolyton or Terrorists Win

quote: Originally posted by McMeadows At the moment, the best we can get is 1 gpt.

	04-08-2005 14:13									#5
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sorry, idn't see it

	04-08-2005 15:18									#6
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Agreed on Matsunaga being the first to go

then maybe hop across to the small Island ?

	04-08-2005 16:21									#7
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quote: Originally posted by Platypus Rex then maybe hop across to the small Island ?

As far as I remember correctly, it's a peninsula.

	04-08-2005 16:33									#8
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Welcome back Meadishi the II

	04-08-2005 20:44									#9
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We currently have a cease fire agreement with the Matsunaga that they gave us four techs from.

I'm all for pointing sticking the Matsunaga, but not until that agreement expires so we can honorably do so.

On the Urakami, dispite being bigger, they aren't seriously threatening us, so they're no need to rush into a cease fire yet.

Granted we don't have enough units on the front line with the Urakami to go after a city yet, but we can still kill the weak units in 1 and 2s they keep sending over.

	04-08-2005 20:47									#10
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I think a naval invasion is kind of out of the question for the near future. In addition to needing more miltary units for a naval invasion due to distance from reinforcements, it also requires a significant investment in Galleys.

	04-08-2005 20:49									#11
	Support Apolyton or Terrorists Win

Our Army when completely healthy can kill one Yamabuski Monk on flat terraign easily. Armies can heal in enemy territory as well.
So far I haven't seen any Yamabuskis outside of cities.

	04-08-2005 20:52									#12
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On future city spots, there is currently a Matsunaga unit-pair on 3-3-3 Gems R Us, so they may found that city for us on their turn.

	04-08-2005 21:15									#13
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quote: Originally posted by joncnunn We currently have a cease fire agreement with the Matsunaga that they gave us four techs from. I'm all for pointing sticking the Matsunaga, but not until that agreement expires so we can honorably do so.

Against the AI I don't give a -bleep- about the rep normally, but this is a team game. So keep speaking up.

	05-08-2005 02:36									#14
	Support Apolyton

With the combo of DemiGod and AP, our reputation is extremely
important so we can buy techs with GPT.

We can't pointly stick them all. And indeed buying two techs in my reign first (with GPT) allowed much better techs to be gotten from the Matsunaga. Neither of these deals would have been possible in a reasonable timeframe if I had to pay the entire amount in upfront cash.

There are also 17 other civs in this game.
If we ruin our rep, we can't trade easily except with those at war with the same civs we are.

	05-08-2005 15:34									#15
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its those small pesky details that I gota remember

thanks joncnunn

	06-08-2005 04:30									#16
	Increase the size of your Attachments

Forgot to mention, even if the Matsunaga found a city in the desirable location [3-3-3 Gems R Us], if it expands culture once or grows too big, it would have to be raized and replaced.

But every currently existing AI city that's in that screen shot would have to be raized. We simply have no culture because we'd been rightfully focusing on military units.

But it's kind of questionable as to weather Meadishi should be focusing on what to produce. If I recall corectly, his term ends right before the anarchy ends and there's no active forest chops.

Meadishi will istead be focusing on using the units we already have efficently and balancing growth with happiness management / income.

	06-08-2005 06:33									#17
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then lets get things in line for our next glorious leader

	06-08-2005 09:16									#18
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Meadishi should play 10 turns IIRC. There is no way the anarchy to be 10 turns.

So, two choices here:
1. The anarchy is started during his reign
2. jon is wrong

	06-08-2005 22:01									#19
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Ormuzd, we are now in the second era and so Meadishi [and all that follow] only get 5 turn reigns.

The anarchy started two turns ago. I prorated my just completed reign which crossed the boundary between 10 turns and 5 turns.

	07-08-2005 10:00									#20
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yep, you are right and I am sooo stupid

	07-08-2005 13:10									#21
	Inflate your Upload Space

When will we get an update?

	13-08-2005 02:46									#22
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Sightings of the Daimyo have been confirmed.

He should be back any day now

	21-08-2005 15:38									#23
	reign report July 1490 - January 1495 Support Apolyton buy from Amazon

Finally I got to it and I started enjoying it as well. As I have only played 5 turns in the first reign due to misinterpretation and my predecessor had brought Anarchy to our clan, I took the opportunity to make up for the delay and play 10 turns.

With some mocking I decided to follow Joncnunn's advice and to pursue the war with the Urakami instead of moving in on the Matsunaga. The objective is to gain a few techs from them.

Battle reports are written from our perspective considering win or loss.

1490-2
Changed the mining on the cow for irrigation. The cow can be shared between Bull Wheat and Noriko's Seaview to beef them up with pop.
AI
A 4/4 Urukami Samurai Archer (U.SA/6(3).3.1) attacked our 3/3 Stone Crossbow (SC/2(1).1.1) not fortified on a mountain - WON, SC 2/3.
Still 3 U.SA in sight

1491-1
-
AI
4/4 U.SA vs our 4/4 Bushi (B/3.2.1), mountain, f - LOST, U.SA 1/4

1491-2
Our 12/12 Army vs 3/4 U.SA - WON 6/12
Our 4/4 B vs 3/3 Urukami Ashigaru (U.A/1.1.1) - WON, B 2/4
AI
4/4 U.SA vs our 4/4 SC, mountain, f - LOST, U.SA 2/4
7 U.SA in sight

1492-1
gems connected
AI
2/4 U.SA vs our 4/4 Bushi - WON, B 4/4
The Matsunaga moved in 2 M.SA and a M.SC next to our border. The Mori seem to be at war with the Urukami as well.

1492-2
The anarchy is over and we switch to feudalism.
Kyujutsu @ 90% science, 5 turns, -10 gpt
AI
3 4/4 U.SA vs 3 (5/5, 5/5, 4/4) B, mountain, f - 3x WON (with cat and SC support), 2/5, 2/5, 3/4

1493-1
Hiyoshi finishes B training, started on Yambushi (Y/2.5.1), 8 turns
Obama Haights finishes temple, started on Archives a prebuild to be readjusted by the next ruler.
AI
-

1493-2
Our 12/12 army vs 3/4 U.SA - WON, 11/12
And here's where I should have made peace with the Urukami. We would be able to acquire Kenjutsu + 2 workers for peace
AI
3/4 U.SA vs 5/5 B, mountain, f (SC support) - WON 3/5
The Matsunaga retreat after the border has been sealed off with several SC.

1494-1
Noriko's Seaview finishes temple, started on settler, 2 turns
Takatsuki Lake View finishes barracks, started on SC, 3 turns
Our 11/12 army vs 4/4 U.SA - WON 5/13
science @ 60%, 2 turns, +9 gpt
AI
-

1494-2
Bull Wheat finishes aquaduct, started on temple, 3 turns
Kasuga finishes temple, started on catapult, 2 turns
AI
-

1495-1
discovered Kyujutsu, started on Heihojutsu
Noriko's seaview finished settler, started on granary, 5 turns

In conclusion, 10 turns played and a great point to have a start for my succeeder. 2 units were lost, a bushi and a stone crossbow, 8 (superior) samurai archers and 1 Ashigaru were defeated. If I may raise some points of discussion/ consideration:

1. @100% science Heihojutsu in 4 turns, -22 gpt
2. upgrading a SC 2(1).1.1 to a SA 6(3).3.1 costs only 30 gold
3. 90 gold in cash
4. sake available next turn on establishment of the next town (111 from Noriko's Seaview, I'd like to propose to call it Meadishi Delerium)
5. We can get Heihojutsu or Literature in return for peace with the Urukami, unfortunately not Kenjutsu anymore. Pressure from our (healed) army on their cities might change that. However, it might be that their attention is required on our Southern border as well. It seems to be not that easy to get more than 1 tech from the Urukami.
6. only 1 other clan is lacking techs we have, but doesn't have any gold.
7. I think there are 7 turns left on the peace deal with the Matsunaga.

(save will follow shortly, as well as screen shots).

Last edited by McMeadows on 21-08-2005 at 15:49

	21-08-2005 16:32									#24
	January 1495 Suffering from ads?

state of the empire

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	21-08-2005 16:34									#25
	sacred save Support Apolyton, buy Alpha Centauri

For succession and investigation...

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	21-08-2005 22:37									#26
	Got spare money?

Uh, McMeadows, you seem to have made twince as many turns as you were supposed to.
But considering the inherted anarchy in the first half of your reign, I don't think anyone will seriously object.

	21-08-2005 22:41									#27
	Support Apolyton or Terrorists Win

On the science reserach, I find it unlikely that techs cost less to research than buying via GPT. But I'm very pleased we can now build Sam Archers.

So, I strongly urge the next Shogun to see if Heihojustsu can be bought for less than the amount of gold it would cost to complete.
We can use the gold to upgrade stonebow crossbows to Sam Archers.

In addition, the archives build should be vetoed. Maybe a Geskia House or Sam. Archer

And the Temple build in the capital should probably be vetoed in favor of the Geskia House that acts as a factory and makes 2 citizens content.

	21-08-2005 22:43									#28
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quote: Originally posted by joncnunn Uh, McMeadows, you seem to have made twince as many turns as you were supposed to. But considering the inherted anarchy in the first half of your reign, I don't think anyone will seriously object.

Maybe you should have first read my post...

quote: Originally posted by joncnunn On the "mistake" of not making peace with the Urak in exchange for peace, it really isn't. While a surendered cities nationals instantly convert, the culture does not and the city may well have evenually culturaly revolted back anyway.

I don't have a clue what you're saying here. "Mistake" might refer to my note to at which moment it seemed to have been most rewarding to make peace with the Urukami.

	21-08-2005 22:50									#29
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Looking at the list, Masuro is up next.

	21-08-2005 22:51									#30
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quote: Originally posted by joncnunn On the science research, I find it unlikely that Heihojutsu could have been aquired cheaper via paying one of the many civs with it a GPT payment. I strongly urge the next Shogun to see if Heihojustsu can be bought for less than the amount of gold it would cost to complete.

Like I tried to point out: point of attention. I'd rather spend some gold on upgrading SC's to SA's too. That seems to be far more rewarding, seeing the attack capacity. However I tried to give the next shogun some points he could start discussion with or even start some polls again. Like the Roman days..

quote: Originally posted by joncnunn In addition, the archives build should be vetoed.

A prebuild is not really requiring a veto. Again a note for the next shogun, or the whole community to decide over.

A bit more constructive way of posting and less lecturing way will be appreciated by me.