15-08-2005 01:27									#1
	Napolean scenario Support Apolyton, buy Civilization: The Boardgame

this scenario doesn't seem balanced. What are your thoughts.

I had a much easier time as Russia than France. You could argue I'm a better player now, than then, but I don't think that's it. The France ai couldn't do anything. In fact I think they ended up losing 1 city net, despite gaining 2 cities early.

Russia on the other hand was easy. First I attacked sweden, then Denmark (though France didn't like this- I eventually made peace with them). then I took out the Ottoman empire. Then the Austrians. At this point I reached 40% population and 43% land area. Though I admit I played the diplomacy much better this time. I tried to make sure I was with war with only 1 or 2 countries at a time, unlike my game with France.

I guess the scenario is balanced well for multiplayer play. But it makes it difficult for france to do what it did historically.

	18-08-2005 00:14									#2
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I haven't played as the Russians so I can't comment on them. As the French, you have the best units in the game and 2 MGLs. Unfortunately you are situated near England which has the second best units in the game (no MGLs). You also have Kingdom of Naples, Prussia, Austria, Spain and the Dutch as neighbors. In other words, France is effectively surrounded by civs on all sides.

The English are so annoying that you end up having to leave a good portion of your army near the coast to fight off invasion. France is stuck in Republic and starts with a fair amount of WW, most of which is caused by England against whom they are locked into a permanent war. Because of all this, I usually forget about going after continental Europe and just go after the English. Not very historical, is it?

The English UU at the start is the d=6 Redcoat so odds are you will trigger their GA soon. England is one tough nut to crack. You don't get decent artillery for a while so your battles will be bloody, adding to your WW problems.

Even after you take over the British Isles there is Gibralter way down at the bottom of Spain taunting you. Forget about bribing the Spanish to take it out. The entire Spanish army is incapable of taking it. All they'll end up doing is promoting the British defenders. You have to get a ROP and do it yourself.

With England defeated plus the defeat of the wimpy Kingdom of Naples and the OCC Dutch, you will usually have enough VPs or a win.

This scenario was the first game where I needed to do a lot of drafting. Because you are surrounded as the French, you can't realistically deploy enough units to defend all your borders. You have to depend on the draft to fight off and defend against sneak attacks.

Last edited by gunkulator on 18-08-2005 at 00:32

	19-08-2005 01:35									#3
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glad I wasn't the only one who had problems as the french.

Yes I forgot about them being in a republic. I do remember WW problems. As russia you are in a monarchy. While corruption is higher, there weren't many ww problems. I established a colony to the east (you can't build new cities) to get some silks. I think I had 3 luxeries, and I did okay (on regent- lower than I usually play- but I don't do so well on this scenario- at least as france). And I had a ton of furs I could sell to other nations.

I thought about hitting England after I wiped ot Naples when I played as France. But then I let my diplomacy slip and got into wars with Prussia and Russia. And brief wars with the Austrians and Ottomans. It's tough fighting everyone at once. And yeah I usually had to leave some units up on my coast. Even more annoying is England will sail around to your southern coast on the Mediterranean and attack weak cities down there with 8 units. And developing a navy as france just didn't seem possible. Frigates really suck in battle. So I couldn't take out their fleet.

which leads to the question. Should all the nations be balanced perfectly for multiplayer. Or should it be balanced to allow France to have at least a chance to recreate what it did historically. Which leads me to ask. Just how did France conquer all that territory in fairly modern combat situations?

Or maybe I just suck. If anyone has any screenshots of France barking down Russia's door by the end of the game, I'd like to see them.

	20-08-2005 05:55									#4
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conquering half of europe without france lifting a finger doesnt sound realistic in any way

	20-08-2005 13:18									#5
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quote: Originally posted by Datajack Franit conquering half of europe without france lifting a finger doesnt sound realistic in any way

They went to war with me (after I attacked and conquered Denmark). They sent a few units my way. But they were tied up in other wars (England/portugal, Italy etc). That's my point though. France is too weak in this scenario. Esp. in the hands of the AI.

And I only conquered 1/3 of europe. I believe the domination victory kicks in at 35%. Or maybe it was 40%, I can't remember. I conqured Sweden, Denmark, Ottoman empire and most of Autria. Everyone else had their original territory.

	22-08-2005 15:04									#6
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get into the editor and make some changes

well worth the effort

	02-09-2005 23:49									#7
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France also has one additional major advantage: Monopoly of Nationalism tech, which gives you a few turns in which everyone else is building very lousy inf units. (But quite a few civs start with a few of their "normal" inf-type unit and everyone has the tech to build their calvary unt.)

Also, in this conquest, the UK can trigure their GA by using their Man of War. I did that on turn 2 of mine because I started with a couple of them and the dumb French AI sailed a few boats into the channel within range on turn 1.

The French disadvantages are the extreme amount of low WW. (Max WW a low WW can feel, each new citizen born in addition to being unhappy by default itself, makes a pre existing citizen by default unhappy.)

The Russian advantages are that they start as #1 in area and population, aren't in a locked war, and are on the edge of the map, and have the 3rd best units.

	05-09-2005 06:32									#8
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Hi, I'm new here but I played civ for a couple of years now. I just love this game and the Napolean scenario is myfavourite conquest.

Nice site you have here.