06-09-2005 07:52									#31
	Avatar Enlargement: We've got the solution

Either nye's first proposal or Master Zen's is fine with me.

EDIT - From the chat, I realized that the treaty doesn't say anything about taking units out.

On turn 26, the nations of Brazucas and Apolyton will trade unaltered screenshots of all explored lands which includes the land inside of each nation's borders, but doesn't include units, combat and non-combat. All resources and terrain improvements shall be shown, but the production, current research and time, treasury (current gold and gold per turn), and slider settings shall not be shown, either cut out in a screenshot program or blacked out.

Last edited by RegentMan on 06-09-2005 at 08:00

	06-09-2005 10:46									#32
	Support Apolyton, pre-order Civilization IV

Copied from the CBR diplo thread.

quote: I got no gas left for tonight, but we have to get that treaty finalised and sent tomorrow evng. I think we should add a no trade clause for screen shots and techs.

	06-09-2005 18:35									#33
	Got spare money?

nye, what do you mean by a no trade clause? That they won't trade CDZ techs and screenies? Or under what circumstances do we not trade those with CBR?

Also, did you ever figure out if CBR already acquired bronze working?

In order to formalize our friendship and our desire to maintain peaceful relations, the nations of Brazucas and Apolyton hereby agree to the following treaty:

• Alphabet and bronze working shall be traded between our two nations. On turn 25, Brazucas will send alphabet unaccepted to Apolyton. Apolyton will put bronze working on the table and accept the deal. On turn 26, Brazucas will accept the deal, thus completing the trade.
  
  
• As of turn 25, a fifty turn non-aggression pact between the nations of Brazucas and Apolyton shall go into effect. Neither team shall attack the other, and no unit (except for the curragh) may enter within one tile of the other nation's cultural borders without their consent.
  
  
• On turn 26, the nations of Brazucas and Apolyton will trade unaltered screenshots of all explored lands which includes the land inside of each nation's borders, but doesn't include units, combat and non-combat. All resources and terrain improvements shall be shown, but the production, current research and time, treasury (current gold and gold per turn), and slider settings shall not be shown, either cut out in a screenshot program or blacked out.
  
  
• Information as to the whereabouts of the other nations on this world shall be issued to the other party once the foreign nations have been met.

	06-09-2005 20:27									#34
	Got spare money?

A no trade clause states that whatever we trade to CBR is never to be traded to another team.

	06-09-2005 21:18									#35
	Support Apolyton, buy Civilization III: Complete

quote: Originally posted by Krill A no trade clause states that whatever we trade to CBR is never to be traded to another team.

For a specific number or turns, right? And how many turns it's desirable? 10, 20 turns?

	06-09-2005 21:46									#36
	Suffering from ads?

It can be for a specific number of turns, or just forever.

I think that for 20 turns is about right for the tech. It will give us time to reach CDZ, hopefully, and trade it to them, if we wish to. But if we don't want to trade with CDZ, then we had better put a forever NTC on the trade.

For the Screenshot, however, we should have a eternal NTC, to stop CDZ from getting it (providing that CBR don't backstab us)...

	06-09-2005 22:31									#37
	Support Apolyton, buy Alpha Centauri

Would be easier, of course, if we decide who we'll going to kill first.

As E_T said in another thread (here), this continent will be submerged in blood (how poetic! ) in 70~80 turns. Or less.
So, who will be our choice?
CBR has an excellent (defensive) unit, IF they manage to survive 50~150 turns
CDZ has mounted warriors. Wow! Great unit, but they have to use it in ancient times. In the next 50~100 turns...

So, CBR NEEDS peace, and CDZ WANTS war.

IMHO, of course


Btw, are Iroquois expansionist and militaristic?


To the experienced diplomats here: don't mock on me just because my ideas are too naif!

Last edited by Aro on 06-09-2005 at 22:39

	06-09-2005 22:38									#38
	Inflate your Upload Space

Iro are Agri and Commercial. And that is the civ that is, out of all picked, the best suited to war.

	06-09-2005 22:53									#39
	Put an end to popups!

Wow! We all are agricultural around here? War is unavoidable.
I agree, Krill. They have the right unit, they’ll have money and they’ll have workers and pop rush.
They probably are settled in fertile land, just like us. I would just hope they don’t have horses (I’m pretty sure they have it – this is a human made map )

We should be prepared for the worst scenario, an early war against mounted warriors. That’s why CBR was considering a MPP as a logic thing… And we should do the same.

In a certain way...
Jacta alea est! (the dice is cast )

	06-09-2005 23:36									#40
	Enter the AD-FREE zone

given the civs CBR and CDZ have picked, I see war as inevitable as a hot day in the Sahara. Now, what do we want in this war?

Well, our best interest is a war in which both of them bloody each other with no discernible winner. Have CDZ attack CBR, make them squander their GA, have CBR lose a couple of cities, and we interverne merely if the balance of power is permanently threatened.

That does mean, however, that we must be ready for any eventuality.

	07-09-2005 00:07									#41
	Support Apolyton buy from Amazon

...And that does mean, however, a lot of FAM extra-work... More lies to tell, more sugar to cover our words, more smiles and even more truth, in controlled doses.



I'm a Diplomat: I'm a liar and proud of it!

	07-09-2005 04:12									#42
	Lose 30 kilos (of popups)

On trading screen shots, we can send instructions like these to CBR :

Screen Shots Instructions

Turn Grid On.
Main Menu > Map > Clean Map Preference
Select as follow


The eventual Screenshot would look like this :

Last edited by rush on 07-09-2005 at 04:19

	07-09-2005 04:21									#43
	Support Apolyton, buy GURPS/ Alpha Centauri

In order to formalize our friendship and our desire to maintain peaceful relations, the nations of Brazucas and Apolyton hereby agree to the following treaty:

• Alphabet and bronze working shall be traded between our two nations. On turn 25, Brazucas will send alphabet unaccepted to Apolyton. Apolyton will put bronze working on the table and accept the deal. On turn 26, Brazucas will accept the deal, thus completing the trade.
  
  
• As of turn 25, a fifty turn non-aggression pact between the nations of Brazucas and Apolyton shall go into effect. Neither team shall attack the other, and no unit (except for the curragh) may enter within one tile of the other nation's cultural borders without their consent.
  
  
• On turn 26, the nations of Brazucas and Apolyton will trade unaltered screenshots of all explored lands which includes the land inside of each nation's borders, but doesn't include units, combat and non-combat. All resources and terrain improvements shall be shown, but the production, current research and time, treasury (current gold and gold per turn), and slider settings shall not be shown, either cut out in a screenshot program or blacked out.
  
  
• Information as to the whereabouts of the other nations on this world shall be issued to the other party once the foreign nations have been met. However, the nations of Brazucas and Apolyton may not trade items traded between themselves with any foreign nations without prior consent.

	07-09-2005 07:04									#44
	Support Apolyton

Excellent, RM!

	07-09-2005 10:03									#45
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quote: Originally posted by Aro ...And that does mean, however, a lot of FAM extra-work... More lies to tell, more sugar to cover our words, more smiles and even more truth, in controlled doses. I'm a Diplomat: I'm a liar and proud of it!

:roflmao:

atleast your a Diplomat and not a doctor.... hehe

Aro, you've learned a lot in the last month or so. Now you just have to learn the art of the Evil Plan (tm)....

E_T

	07-09-2005 10:11									#46
	Support Apolyton, buy Call to Power 2

quote: Originally posted by RegentMan In order to formalize our friendship and our desire to maintain peaceful relations, the nations of Brazucas and Apolyton hereby agree to the following treaty: Alphabet and bronze working shall be traded between our two nations. On turn 25, Brazucas will send alphabet unaccepted to Apolyton. Apolyton will put bronze working on the table and accept the deal. On turn 26, Brazucas will accept the deal, thus completing the trade.

Insert no tech retrade agreement here. Timed release (I suggest 25 turns) or never retrade (which would be better, IMHO).

quote: As of turn 25, a fifty turn non-aggression pact between the nations of Brazucas and Apolyton shall go into effect. Neither team shall attack the other, and no unit (except for the curragh) may enter within one tile of the other nation's cultural borders without their consent. quote: Do we want to have something, dealing with Galleys, if CBR gets Philo & then MM within timeframe?? of is that something for next treaty?? On turn 26, the nations of Brazucas and Apolyton will trade unaltered screenshots of all explored lands which includes the land inside of each nation's borders, but doesn't include units, combat and non-combat. All resources and terrain improvements shall be shown, but the production, current research and time, treasury (current gold and gold per turn), and slider settings shall not be shown, either cut out in a screenshot program or blacked out.

This needs a clause that states that all traded screenshorts are NOT to be retraded to ANYONE, at any time!

quote: Information as to the whereabouts of the other nations on this world shall be issued to the other party once the foreign nations have been met. However, the nations of Brazucas and Apolyton may not trade items traded between themselves with any foreign nations without prior consent. To this end, Brazucas and Apolyton humbly wish that this treaty is the beginning of a fantastic friendship, where the world hides in fear of the combined might of Brazucas and Apolyton!

Looks good otherwise.

E_T

	07-09-2005 10:15									#47
	Inflate your Upload Space

Aro, I hope to see one of your slendid maps, combining the CBR map to ours, once we get it.

just make sure that you use a secure site to put them up, if not using poly upload....

E_T

	07-09-2005 18:35									#49
	Browse Apolyton AD-FREE

@E_T - I thought that the italicized part towards the end took care of the no trading techs and screenies clause.

	08-09-2005 06:46									#50
	Support Apolyton, buy Civilization: The Boardgame

I propose we send the following to CBR immediately.

quote: In order to formalize our friendship and our desire to maintain peaceful relations, the nations of Brazucas and Apolyton hereby agree to the following treaty: 1.Alphabet and bronze working shall be traded between our two nations. On turn 25, Brazucas will send alphabet unaccepted to Apolyton. Apolyton will put bronze working on the table and accept the deal. On turn 26, Brazucas will accept the deal, thus completing the trade. Apolyton agrees not to trade Alphabet to any other nation or team. Brazucas agrees not to trade Bronze Working to any other nation or team. 2. As of turn 25, a fifty turn non-aggression pact between the nations of Brazucas and Apolyton shall go into effect. Neither team shall attack the other, and no unit (except for the curragh) may enter within one tile of the other nation's cultural borders without their consent. 3. On turn 26, the nations of Brazucas and Apolyton will trade unaltered screenshots of all explored lands which includes the land inside of each nation's borders, but doesn't include units, combat and non-combat. All resources and terrain improvements shall be shown, but the production, current research and time, treasury (current gold and gold per turn), and slider settings shall not be shown, either cut out in a screenshot program or blacked out. Both nations agree not to pass on traded screen shots to any other nation or team. 4. Information as to the whereabouts of the other nations on this world shall be issued to the other party once the foreign nations have been met. 5. This treaty comes into effect upon being ratified by both nations named herein. To this end, Brazucas and Apolyton humbly wish that this treaty is the beginning of a lasting friendship, where the world hides in fear of the combined might of Brazucas and Apolyton!

I changed only 'fantastic' to 'lasting'. I don't think these guys are going to buy effusive language.

I made the no trade clauses explicit in what they apply to.

	08-09-2005 06:54									#51
	Put an end to popups!

Aro, it would be explained to CBR that we need to know that they are making their decision on a final document before we can ratify the treaty. We can't ratify it yet, as we do not know if they will propose changes.

Once we both have the same document to submit to our respective peoples, then Apolyton can proceed to ratify it in a poll.

They may consider that document to be signed by a Consul of Apolyton, and I will play turns in accord with what is written there.

	08-09-2005 07:13									#52
	Support Apolyton

Understood, mon capitain!

	08-09-2005 18:33									#53
	Increase the size of your Attachments

Could you put a space between "1." and "Alphabet?" Also, we'll need to change the turn numbers before we send it, how about turn 30 for starting everything?

In the tech trade, it says that they can't trade bronze working, but nothing of our ability to trade alphabet. Think they'll notice?

In the screenshot trade, I've used it as one word. You use "screen shot" in the no trade clause. I suggest changing it to one word to maintain the same type of language throughout the document (argh... I forgot the word! ).

Other than that, it looks fine!