06-09-2005 22:44									#1
	When we talk about celeron Support Apolyton, buy Civilization: The Boardgame

if there is a speed, let's say 1,5 Ghz, that's the speed right?
it doesn't matter if it's a celeron? or is there a 1,5Ghz pentium which is not a celeron but it's faster?

isnt the speed the real speed?


can i have stated the question more badly?

	06-09-2005 22:46									#2
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No, that's the clockrate.

	06-09-2005 22:52									#3
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The Celeron laptops confuse me a bit, 1.5GhZ laptop same price as a P4 3.2GhZ. I guess it;s just power use but I found it odd.

	06-09-2005 22:53									#4
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quote: CPU speed is not a reliable indicator of CPU performance. Many factors inside and outside of the CPU exert a significant impact on CPU performance, and on overall system performance. The CPU CPU speed is measure in megahertz. A 1Mhz CPU can accomplish one million CPU cycles in one second. Does this mean that a 2Mhz CPU is twice as fast as a 1Mhz CPU? Not necessarily. This depends on how much work each CPU accomplishes in each clock cycle. The 1Mhz CPU might very well be faster, in practice, than the 2Mhz CPU - if it is more efficient or can process more tasks in each CPU cycle. The Cache The purpose of a cache is to enable the CPU to access recently used information very quickly. A cache will significantly affect CPU performance. However, caches also are represent some difficulties in simple comparison. Some caches are bigger than others. A typical L1 cache is 256Kb and a typical L2 cache is 1MB. Generally speaking, the larger the cache, the better the system performance boost. However, this is not always the case. A cache operates at a certain speed, just like the core of the CPU. Some caches operate at the full speed of the CPU, while others operate at half that speed or less. A small cache which operates at full speed may be much more useful than a cache which is twice as large but operates at only half the speed of the CPU. Even comparing cache sizes can be difficult. Some CPU's utilize inclusive caches. In a CPU with an exclusive cache, the data stored in the L1 cache is often duplicated in the L2 cache. Only CPUs which employ exclusive caches will have the full capacity of their L2 caches available. The Front Side Bus The Front Side Bus (FSB) is the connection between the CPU and system memory. The Front Side Bus operates at a speed which is a percentage of the CPU clock speed. The faster the speed at which the Front Side Bus allows data transfer, the better the performance of the CPU. System Memory RAM has an access speed. Faster RAM will mean the CPU has to wait less often for data. This will, effectively, make the CPU faster. The Rest of the System Everything in the system affects total system performance, from the rotational speed and access time of the hard disk drive to the speed of video RAM. Benchmarking The next possible answer for measuring CPU speed and overall system performance is benchmarking. Unfortunately, benchmarks are necessarily flawed. A benchmark can only prove how quickly a system runs the benchmark. A benchmark cannot show how quickly a system will run your mix of applications in the real world. The Good News The good news is that almost any new PC that you can buy today will be fast enough to run most applications reasonably well. If you believe that your application has special requirements, read your application documentation or contact your application vendor.

	06-09-2005 22:53									#5
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you mean a desktop P4 3,2?

	06-09-2005 22:55									#6
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thanks nostromo

	06-09-2005 22:57									#7
	Inflate your Upload Space

No a laptop with a P4 chip.

	06-09-2005 22:58									#8
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quote: Originally posted by lightblue No a laptop with a P4 chip.

i found those to be more expensive than the laptops with the celeron. maybe you mean a mobile technology celeron against a "typical" P4?

	06-09-2005 23:00									#9
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Is that what the M is for? Means it's lower power use right?

	06-09-2005 23:00									#10
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The difference between Celerons and Pentiums lies largely in the cache size; in actuality, the processing parts of the cores are largely the same.

These days, desktop Celerons are based off of the P4 architecture, while the laptop ones are based off of the Pentium M core.

Pentium Ms are derived from Pentium IIIs, as an evolution, whereas Pentium 4s use an entirely new architecture (NetBurst).

What this means is that you oughtn't compare laptop and desktop chips directly, as performance wise, the laptop chips do, more or less, match up with the desktop ones without going to the high clock rates.

	06-09-2005 23:01									#11
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M chips do use less power, but M probably derived from the fact that it was meant as a Mobile chip.

	06-09-2005 23:01									#12
	Put an end to popups!

how i explained it to QOTM when we bought our first PC.

ok, the chip is like a little man working at a desk. The generation of chip, P3, P4, etc shows you how smart the little man is, while the speed shows you how fast he moves. You want a worker who is smart AND fast. The RAM shows hows much room he has on his desk to work. If he doesnt have enough room, there are things he cant do. The HD is the drawers where he keeps things hes not currently working on. If he doesnt have enough room on his desk, he will have to go more to the file drawers, and that will slow him down. Storing something on a floppy, CD, etc is like putting something in the archives offsite - lots of space, but harder to retrieve.

	06-09-2005 23:01									#13
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quote: Originally posted by lightblue Is that what the M is for? Means it's lower power use right?

i think so

qcube thanks too and lotm

	06-09-2005 23:02									#14
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Personally, I suggest looking for ones labelled as Pentium M, not Pentium 4 or Celeron; however, Celeron/Celeron Ms are all right, if you're on a budget.

Avoid Pentium 4s.

	07-09-2005 00:33									#15
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Maybe im confused (i hope im not, i studied this kinda thing for years) but I think many of you are using the word "Celeron" in the place of "Centrino"

Centrino

Celeron

I have owned a couple of Celerons in my time, and they made me want to murder something. I always advise against them.

Centrinos are awesome tho.

	07-09-2005 00:38									#16
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Beat me to it Ninot!

	07-09-2005 00:41									#17
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quote: Originally posted by lightblue The Celeron laptops confuse me a bit, 1.5GhZ laptop same price as a P4 3.2GhZ. I guess it;s just power use but I found it odd.

Simply put, clockrate is but one factor in processor speed. The other one is an aggregate figure called IPC, or instructions per clock.

Performance = MHz * IPC

The Pentium 4/Celeron has much less IPC than Athlon 64s and Pentium M/Celeron M/Centrino chips.

While a 3.2GHz Pentium 4 seems faster than a 2GHz Athlon 64 3200+, the 2GHz Athlon will spank it in performance in most cases.

Similarly, a 2GHz Pentium M pretty much spanks a 3.2GHz Pentium 4 as well.

Celerons differ from Pentiums in that they're feature-reduced, which hurts performance -- they'll have less cache, less memory bandwidth, or both...which reduces IPC and hence performance.

	07-09-2005 00:43									#18
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And Centrino/Pentium M/Celeron M chips use much, much less power than Pentium 4s and regular Celerons do.

The Pentium 4 architecture is being retired, and new chips are being derived from the Pentium M/Centrino -- on desktop and laptops.

	07-09-2005 00:55									#19
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quote: Originally posted by Ninot Maybe im confused (i hope im not, i studied this kinda thing for years) but I think many of you are using the word "Celeron" in the place of "Centrino" Centrino Celeron I have owned a couple of Celerons in my time, and they made me want to murder something. I always advise against them. Centrinos are awesome tho.

Centrino refers to the entire chipset, which includes:
Pentium M
Intel PRO Wireless
...among other things.

Centrinos are NOT processors; that's what the Pentium M/Celeron Ms are.

	07-09-2005 00:57									#20
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Centrino is the name for the Intel platform for wireless laptops.

They've recently announced a new brand, "Viiv", for home theatre desktops: http://www.intel.com/personal/desktop/viiv/

quote: Intel® Viiv™ Technology Arrives Early 2006 Get ready for a new kind of consumer entertainment PC that will change the way you enjoy entertainment at home. Intel's new platform for digital entertainment—Intel® Viiv™ technology—will launch in early 2006 with the multitasking power of a dual-core processor-based PC and sleek new designs that fit your lifestyle. An Intel Viiv technology-based PC: * Features remote control operation from the comfort of your couch, and instant on/off functionality like a TV (after initial boot) * Has cutting-edge technology, including a dual-core processor and advanced graphics and sound capability for an amazing audio/visual experience * Offers content on demand with easy Internet access to movies, music, pictures and games * Has the ability to record, pause, and rewind live TV programs (with optional TV tuner card) * Includes special software that makes it easier to set-up a home network and connect to other wireless devices * Comes in different shapes and sizes to fit any style home, including small consumer electronics-type designs that look like DVD players to more traditional desktop designs * Provides state-of-the-art PC performance including support for up to 7.1 channel surround sound for a home theater-quality entertainment experienceΨ With an Intel Viiv technology-based PC and supporting devices, you can enjoy a growing universe of digital media content—both directly at the PC and in other rooms throughout your home. Plus, the power of Intel dual-core processors means that multiple family members can use the same PC to enjoy content in different rooms at the same time. For example, one family member can download a movie on the Intel Viiv technology-based PC in the family room, while another enjoys music being streamed from the same PC to the living room stereo.

	07-09-2005 03:03									#21
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Thanks guys, I think i kind of understand it now Also seen a few Athlon laptop chipsets, they any good?

	07-09-2005 03:14									#22
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No.

Unfortunately, the current breed of Athlon chipsets for laptops lag far behind those of Intel's.

	07-09-2005 03:16									#23
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I won't get a new machine for at least another 2 years, so bollocks to all of this!

	07-09-2005 10:12									#24
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Athlons are power gobblers, just like P4s. However there is a line of Sempron processors that use only 25W according to AMD.

	07-09-2005 12:11									#25
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Bollocks I say!