23-09-2005 00:11									#1
	Naughty Vatican (gay thread) Browse Apolyton AD-FREE

I'm too lazy to look it up in English, so do it yourselves.
It seems that the new pope or someone else got to the point that the only way to fight paedophilia among priest is fighting gay priest. It was decided so because 80% of victims of paedophilic priests were boys.
It is thought, though, that this high percentage of homosexual paedophilia among priests is caused by
a) easier access to boys (altar boys etc)
b) high percentage of gays among American catholic clergy (some estimate it on 60% - and claim it is because gay priests were less likely to leave their mission for marriage).
Another reason given for anti-gay action is that "a gay in seminarium is like a young heterosexual in female hostel" - but keeping people in one-sex enviroment ends up in homosexual behaviour even in people not inclined to it by nature!
Anyway: it is good that they are trying to do something about the problem. But their idea how to solve that is completely idiotic. I hope they will realise that.
I think that church should support gays for priests - after all, according to the doctrine, they should live in celibate anyway.

	23-09-2005 00:40									#2
	Support Apolyton, buy GURPS/ Alpha Centauri

Heresson

I just think it's ridiculous. Priests are supposed to be celibate. A priest that pines over men is no different from one that pines over women because NEITHER is supposed to do anything about it.

And equating homosexuality with pedophila is just wrong.

	23-09-2005 01:19									#3
	Support Apolyton, buy Civilization 2

It makes sense to me. If you put a celibate straight person in a nunnery, that's the same as putting a celibate gay person in a monastery. You enforce the separation between the men and women, in order to make celibacy easier to acheive.

	23-09-2005 01:20									#4
	Full PM-box? Change here!

quote: Originally posted by Ben Kenobi It makes sense to me. If you put a celibate straight person in a nunnery, that's the same as putting a celibate gay person in a monastery. You enforce the separation between the men and women, in order to make celibacy easier to acheive.

I didn't know that people of faith were that easily fallen to temptation. Better just fold up the whole religion if the most faithful can't cut it in their roles.

	23-09-2005 01:28									#5
	Help yourself to an AD-FREE life

quote: I didn't know that people of faith were that easily fallen to temptation. Better just fold up the whole religion if the most faithful can't cut it in their roles.

Who ever said that even the most faithful live a life in total accordance with Christ's? Everyone sins, no one is exempt.

	23-09-2005 01:31									#6
	Lose 30 kilos (of popups)

quote: Originally posted by Ben Kenobi Who ever said that even the most faithful live a life in total accordance with Christ's? Everyone sins, no one is exempt.

But shouldn't the most faithful be stronger than that? Does being thrown into a room with members of the gender that arouses them turn Churchmen into raving orgy seekers?

I think Heresson wouldn't see it that way.

	23-09-2005 01:32									#7
	Support Apolyton, buy GURPS/ Alpha Centauri

Yeah, but we expect priests to sin by boozing and cheating at golf, not by breaking their vow of celibacy.

	23-09-2005 01:35									#8
	Enter the AD-FREE zone

quote: But shouldn't the most faithful be stronger than that? Does being thrown into a room with members of the gender that arouses them turn Churchmen into raving orgy seekers?

Monasteries are somewhat different. You spend your entire life with the other monks, and so any temptation will be heightened since you will be constantly exposed.

	23-09-2005 01:37									#9
	Support Apolyton, buy Civilization 2

quote: Originally posted by Ben Kenobi Monasteries are somewhat different. You spend your entire life with the other monks, and so any temptation will be heightened since you will be constantly exposed.

So? If they can't handle such temptation, then you can kick 'em out. If a guy CAN handle the temptation, you want him kicked out too?

	23-09-2005 01:40									#10
	Enter the AD-FREE zone

quote: So? If they can't handle such temptation, then you can kick 'em out. If a guy CAN handle the temptation, you want him kicked out too?

Why not put women together with the men? The point is that avoiding temptation in the first place is better then trying to clean up the mess after.

	23-09-2005 01:41									#11
	Support Apolyton, buy Call to Power 2

So non-practising religious folk can get into heaven, but non-practising gay people can't?

	23-09-2005 01:44									#12
	Got spare money?

Another thing to consider is that alot of these priests are closeted/self-loathing homosexuals, and are attracted to Catholic priesthood (because of the celibacy) as means to regulate their sexuality and be "normal". Of course this doesn't work and you end up with these seminary orgies we're seeing.

Its probably a similar thing with pedophiles. Especially so considering what a taboo it is in western society.

	23-09-2005 01:47									#13
	Increase Your PM Length

quote: b) high percentage of gays among American catholic clergy (some estimate it on 60% - and claim it is because gay priests were less likely to leave their mission for marriage).

Seems a bit high, but I might believe it. I was talking to my mom recently about the church (Catholic) I used to attend growing up. I was shocked to learn that at least half of the priests I could remember have boyfriends (all rumor of course) and are still practicing priests.

I don't know if any are/were pedophiles though. I tend to doubt it since homosexuality and pedophilia are two entirely different animals.

	23-09-2005 01:47									#14
	Put an end to popups!

quote: Originally posted by Ben Kenobi Why not put women together with the men? The point is that avoiding temptation in the first place is better then trying to clean up the mess after.

Then what's the point of taking a vow of celibacy! If you are insulated from women, it really isn't anything big, is it? You aren't facing temptation and winning, you are cheating to make it absurdly easy.

Yes, put them together, then we'll see who the true faithful are and who are lying through their teeth!

	23-09-2005 01:50									#15
	Support Apolyton

The priest at the church round the corner from where I grew up was "moved on to another parish" (far, far away) for "unspecified allegations" of kiddy fiddling.
But I don't think it is that common. Too common, sure, but then one is too many. There are often several churches in even the smallest towns, and only in the deepest country does one priest have to travel around to say mass. Mind you, numbers are falling, which will only make people think that paedophilia is rife.

	23-09-2005 01:50									#16
	Get a bigger avatar today!

quote: Originally posted by Imran Siddiqui Then what's the point of taking a vow of celibacy! If you are insulated from women, it really isn't anything big, is it? You aren't facing temptation and winning, you are cheating to make it absurdly easy. Yes, put them together, then we'll see who the true faithful are and who are lying through their teeth!

Because without the vow of celibacy, you're just the navy with less gay clothing.

	23-09-2005 01:51									#17
	Get a bigger avatar today!

And less sailing of the seven seas.....

	23-09-2005 01:51									#18
	Got spare money?

quote: Then what's the point of taking a vow of celibacy! If you are insulated from women, it really isn't anything big, is it? You aren't facing temptation and winning, you are cheating to make it absurdly easy.

Then I suggest you try living in a monastery and dealing with the temptation before gaging the vow to be absurdly easy. I spent a weekend in a monastery, which I did enjoy for the peace and quiet structure, but I could not take such a vow, without quitting the monastery.

quote: Yes, put them together, then we'll see who the true faithful are and who are lying through their teeth!

Yes, let us flay them and see if they renounce Christ!

	23-09-2005 01:53									#19
	Support Apolyton, buy Alpha Centauri

quote: I tend to doubt it since homosexuality and pedophilia are two entirely different animals.

80% of the abuse victims are boys. If there were no such connection, one would expect to see a less skewed ratio.

	23-09-2005 01:54									#20
	Support Apolyton, buy Galactic Civilizations: Deluxe Edition

And how many altar girls are there? As a proportion?

	23-09-2005 01:54									#21
	Avatar Enlargement: We've got the solution

quote: Originally posted by Ben Kenobi I spent a weekend in a monastery, which I did enjoy for the peace and quiet structure, but I could not take such a vow, without quitting the monastery.

Too many hot strapping monks for you there, Ben?

	23-09-2005 01:56									#22
	Support Apolyton, buy Alpha Centauri

quote: Too many hot strapping monks for you there, Ben?

No, I missed the women.

	23-09-2005 01:57									#23
	Put an end to popups!

quote: And how many altar girls are there? As a proportion?

Since they permit them? I honesty don't know.

	23-09-2005 01:58									#24
	Avatar Enlargement: We've got the solution

You just said you couldn't take a vow of celibacy without leaving the monestary. The clear implication there is that it would be too hard to maintain your vow in that environment.

	23-09-2005 02:05									#25
	Increase the size of your Attachments

We could force gay priests to wear an upside down triangle and then compel them to live in ghettos for um . . . . . future "relocation."

	23-09-2005 02:06									#26
	Lose 30 kilos (of popups)

Yeah, I'd hate being cloistered from the women.

	23-09-2005 03:15									#27
	Increase the size of your Attachments

quote: Originally posted by Ben Kenobi Then I suggest you try living in a monastery and dealing with the temptation before gaging the vow to be absurdly easy. I spent a weekend in a monastery, which I did enjoy for the peace and quiet structure, but I could not take such a vow, without quitting the monastery.

I haven't had sex this week

If I was truly faithful and wanted to take a vow of celibacy, I think a better test would be in the world with many women around rather than shielded. They aren't fighting their temptation, they are outsourcing it to the structure of the monestary .

quote: Yes, let us flay them and see if they renounce Christ!

Ah strawmen... how Christian of you .

	23-09-2005 04:35									#28
	Inflate your Upload Space

Oh yeah Imran? Well I haven't shtupped in months - so there!!!