10-05-1999 07:08									#1
	Multiplay diplomacy question Support Apolyton, buy Galactic Civilizations: Deluxe Edition

Hey, is there anyway to set a multiplayer game up so that human players cannot diplomasize (heheh newwww verrrb) until they have actually met? It's kinda annoying and unrealistic to be able to trade tech and stuff before we have even seen each other.

-Deathstar4

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That's no moon......
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	10-05-1999 07:24									#2
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nope. just resolve with yourselves to show restraint.

cousLee

Thats no moon... IT'S A MEATBALL!!!

	10-05-1999 07:32									#3
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Actually, there are two settings in ALPHA.TXT in the #RULES section (close to the end) that might hold the key:

code:

1, ; If non-zero, humans can always contact each other in net games
1, ; If non-zero, humans can always contact each other in hotseat/email games

I stumbled over these the other night, but I haven't fiddled with these yet. If they work as advertised then CMNs and Hosts could set up an MP net or PBEM game to be W&W (Wild and Wooly) or NED (No Early Diplomacy).

Looks interesting, no?

SMAC n ... Ted S.

	10-05-1999 10:03									#4
	Lose 30 kilos (of popups)

very interesting. let us know what you find out.

if it works, then no reason not to include it as an option in the next patch.

	10-05-1999 16:31									#5
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Yeah, that's cool. I really ought to check those .TXT files more !

So much to SMAC, so little time

Aredhran

	10-05-1999 17:01									#6
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I found out the same on Sunday.
No use tho, if you see it as an enforcement method:
each time you load a PBEM game, it reads the setting in alpha.text, so if some player leaves (or resets) it on, he sees all the commlinks again.

OTOH, if you use it as an handy reminder, so that you have no doubts and can't err, then it can prove quite useful!

MariOne

	10-05-1999 19:00									#7
	Lose 30 kilos (of popups)

If you play a moderated game where a neutral party gets the game sent to them at the end of every year then you can go through the next cycle of turns to see if there is illicit diplomacy or not, and then take agreed upon measures if necessary.

	10-05-1999 22:46									#8
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Thanx Goob, I knew it and agrre.

I was just pointing out that editing the alpha.txt option can be a handy doubt-wiping reminder for the player, but not an alternate mean of control for the CMN.

	10-05-1999 22:53									#9
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Did you notice that when you right click on a commlink, you get the demand withdrawal option also in PBEM?
And that the reaction is taken straight away by the game, and not next turn by the player?
I used it in Glak's BloodFest when I saw a Gaian unit two squares away from my base: the game answered vendetta! Actually the opponent's unit didn't came in contact yet whit a base or unit of mine, so I overlooked the fact that it might have been considered cheating! The next turn Gaians offered a treaty anyway...

I should be making some testing at home, and this should be examined between we CMNs

MariOne
-Civer? Civer? Out of the cradle!

	11-05-1999 06:57									#10
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No I ask you: what is the point of putting multiplayer options like that in ALPHA.TXT if they can be circumvented after the game is started (and therefore be altered on each player's machine)?

Am I just whining or does it seem silly?

Also, wouldn't it make more sense that once a game is created that all of the options/factions/rules/whatever stored in the .TXT files would be "cast in stone" and placed in the .SAV file for the rest of a game?

Can anyone think of a customizable setting for which this would not be appropriate?

Oh well ... And I thought I had found something really cool!

SMAC n ... Ted S.

	11-05-1999 15:13									#11
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And I must add (since MoSe also "withdrew" some of my units from his territory in Goob's Challenge), that this thing sucks, since I did not get any warning... I just found the unit sitting in the base, instead of the patch of fungus where I expected to find them.

When this happens, I think an e-mail message should be sent to the player whose units were withdrawn, explaining what happened.

Aredhran

	11-05-1999 16:13									#12
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You're right Aredhran, I couldn't know you wouldn't get any warning.

btw, I did it again

In Single Player you have both the options, from the right-click commlink pop-up, and from inside the diplomatic widows, in which case the AI player answers immediately as well.
In PBEM using the right-click, you can have the offendig units withdrawn immediately, but is the game taking the decision instead of the player (it could also go Vendetta tho!).
But if you let the player decide for himself, there are two tradeoff downsides:
1. the effect takes place only after the next turn.
2. (major) you don't have the withdraw button in the PBME diplomacy window! So, even if the offender is willing to retreat, he simply can't make his unit(s) jump in his nearest base (or even just behind the border): he'll have to normally move his units away from opponent's territory! and that could take several turns!

It's similar but not equal to the "probing the ally" bug: there you could at least choose and take the action on probed's behalf, if he informed you of his preferences, here you'd have to do with the game's choice.

Since this would be applicable to every player (and to the AIs too), I keep a slight preference with permitting the commlink popup option, but very slight indeed.

MariOne
-as a player and as a CMN

	28-06-1999 09:08									#13
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here's where it started