18-12-1999 12:01									#1
	Will creationists buy/play this game? Support Apolyton buy from Amazon

Is Sid cutting out a part of the market? Any thoughts? Anybody angry over this game? Even if you hold creationist beliefs, would you play it? Just wondering..

	18-12-1999 12:03									#2
	Support Apolyton buy from Amazon

Hey Tree,

I'm a creationist and I'll sure buy it. It looks fun and great. SMAC and Civilization mixied with Jurassic Park. Yeah !

Dinos, Grrr

	18-12-1999 15:47									#3
	Support Apolyton, buy Civilization: The Boardgame

Hey, let's just say Noah forgot them when he packed the Ark, ok !

	18-12-1999 16:14									#4
	Support Apolyton, buy Civilization: The Boardgame

Well What has Sid over the years?

Changed direction a few times, this just one moore. Like it or not it's a fact.

I love many of Sid'd games, but there are also games by Sid I have never played. (Ex. Gettysburg)

So cutting out a market? (Well if I understand it the same as you meant it) Yes, Sid is not trying to do a game for all. It doesn't make him a less good game designer. No, it just proves that Sid has a wider area of interest than you.

In my opinion Sid is to what he is doing. Games that he think is interesting and fun. I buy those games I like. Will I buy Dinosaurs? Don't know - yet.

Jeje2

	18-12-1999 20:29									#5
	Avatar Enlargement: We've got the solution

Hey, Hugo, you hit it on the head.

I was born dinosaur lover. Even did a science project in school on them. Then turned to creationist but realized that dinosaurs ARE mentioned in the Bible. Therefore, Noah DID leave them off of the ark and the flood did them in.

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Frodo lives!

Better dead than "Red"... or green... or blue... or yellow... or orange... or purple... or white.

	18-12-1999 20:35									#6
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*Where* Are Dinosaurs mentioned in the bible. Is it like T-Rex 3 6:8 "And the Lord said unto Moses "Thou shalt diggest the the Utah desert and thou shalt findeth Bones. These thou shalt calleth Dinosaur bones that used to be attached to Dinosaurs."

Well, It was just a though

	18-12-1999 20:47									#7
	Got spare money?

But even is Creationists and Darwinists may agree that dinos existed, won't the groups disagree on how they were wiped out?

If the game kills them off by comet, the creationists will complain. If the game kills them off by god inspired flood, the darwinists will complain.

	18-12-1999 21:19									#8
	Lose 30 kilos (of popups)

Thats not the point NLT :
If ANYTHING destroy my mighty dino empire, I will be pissed and complains

But, seriously, darwinist and creationist aren't the only views, and I am far from religious, but I actually do think that creationist is more plausible than darwinist... only the strong survive and evolve... yeah sure, all those useless animals out there were strong to survive? Not sure about that. Actually, I'm more with a scientist(forgot his name =() that was discredited because of trickery when he proved that ANY species can evolve(he showed that frogs he took evolved to live COMPLETLY under water), not only the strong. Years laters, we found out that he actually might be right, as the Darwinist sabotaged his experience and they tricked it, but it was too late, the scientist was dead for a long time and he had all the proof with him. But the point is, who knows which is right? This example shows that the TRUTH is just beliefs and that it can be manipulated easely by extremist on each side. These people DONT want to listen to something different than they think and actually hinder more than they help. Be open minded, even if you are creationist, buy this game, it will be lot of fun!

And, I don't think creationists will not buy this game. They actually bought SMAC, right? This is an encouter with another form of life in space. I don't think that the computer world would be that developed if creationist wouldn't buy games like that. Look at everything on the shelves, and try to find semthing with no aliens, differents evolution, non-religious stuff, etc. Only extremist that aren't open minded don't buy those games.

-Karhgath

	18-12-1999 21:26									#9
	Remove this text

What is a creationist?

	18-12-1999 21:49									#10
	Increase the size of your Attachments

Someone that believe that humans and earth were created by God, and believe in the Garden of Eden, Noah, etc.

-Karhgath

	19-12-1999 10:56									#11
	Increase the size of your Attachments

Created, yes. By god, maybe. Noah et al, not necessary.

Don't forget that there are other religions that Christianity out there, and most have their own, differing creation stories.

	18-12-1999 23:01									#12
	Help yourself to an AD-FREE life

I know, I thought about that not long after, but I was too lazy to edit my post

-Karhgath

	18-12-1999 23:31									#13
	Avatar Enlargement: We've got the solution

quote: [...] fresh knowledge has led to the recognition that evolution is more than a hypothesis. It is indeed remarkable that this theory has been progressively accepted by researchers, following a series of discoveries in various fields of knowledge. The convergence, neither sought nor fabricated, of the results of work that was conducted independently is in itself a significant argument in favour of this theory.

-the pope (from here)

Even the pope believes in evolution. When are the rest of you going to give up?

	19-12-1999 00:20									#14
	Get a bigger avatar today!

As a Creationist (though not a strict Creationist), if the game is any good, I will probably buy it. Dinosaurs are fun.

Anyway, I do have the ability to entertain the concept of evolution even if I don't believe in it. At the very least I can say that "In this fantasy world, let us ASSUME that evolution really works" and just play on from there. I can read Tolkein's work without believing in elves or magic, I can enjoy Star Trek without believing that there are Klingons and time travel and I can appreciate the Iliad without believing in Greco-Roman religion. I can deal with Dinosaurs even with evolution. In addition, I wouldn't be the least bit surprised if the game included aspects from many different theories (including creationism, evolution and some less accepted theories) for both fairness and entertainment value.

Anyway, considering the highly insulting way that Firaxis treated religion in general and Christians in particular in SMAC, anyone who was going to be offended has already left the building. And I don't blame them.

	19-12-1999 00:33									#15
	Support Apolyton, buy GURPS/ Alpha Centauri

P.S. There was an evolution mod pack for Civ2 that I played. Despite the fact that I am skeptical about evolution, I enjoyed it immensely. There is nothing like having an attack Amoeba or engineer Beavers and the included map was top notch. The mod pack did have some serious problems: there were defensive naval units which the computer totally misused (ironically, Clams were undone by the dreaded *Pearl* Harbor bonus), the T-Rexs were better defensive units than the designated "best" defensive unit, the Axlyasaurus, and the air units were near useless for anything but scouting. But overall, it was a fun game.

P.P.S. Take the evolution debate over to off-topic.

	19-12-1999 03:06									#16
	Full PM-box? Change here!

I think a better question is whether existing fans of Civ/SMAC will buy the game?

Creationists often indulge in fantasy (ala Jurassic Park), but die-hard TBSers will probably pass on a RTS dinogame.

Dino on? ... Ted S.

	19-12-1999 03:11									#17
	Support Apolyton, buy GURPS/ Alpha Centauri

I'm sure Creationists will buy it. After all, how many atheists have decided not to buy "god games" like Populous?

	19-12-1999 08:21									#18
	Put an end to popups!

If the game kills them off by god inspired flood, the darwinists will complain.

What kind of a lunatic would actually believe that dinosaurs went extinct due to a flood? Last time I checked, most Creationists had already given in to the fact that the Earth is 4.5 gigayears old.:-)

yeah sure, all those useless animals out there were strong to survive?

Name one such animal.;-)

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St. Leo
http://ziggurat.sidgames.com/
http://www.sidgames.com/forums/

	19-12-1999 08:37									#19
	Lose 30 kilos (of popups)

'Tis a game, after all. Presumably belief (of any sort) doesn't stop anyone creating and even customising a world to play in?

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finbar
Mono Rules!
#33984591

	19-12-1999 09:07									#20
	Remove this text

I'll buy it and I'm Creationist.

Just cause I buy a game about evolution doesn't mean I am an evolutionist.

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The Brain: Weirdo who stands on your lawn at 3 AM staring at you
-Guy who runs around with a Hydrochloric Acid Super Soaker
-The person who plumps when you cook him
-Parodist (Real Word?)
-The man with a rabid wolverine in his pants (Ow!)
-The cause of global warming
-Owner of George Washington's skeleton
-ExLax food inserter
-Wakka Wakka Doodle Yea!
-Annoyer of the Amish
-Buyer of The Tacos Sold by The Taco Selling Space Cowboy
-This is a figment of your imagination...

	19-12-1999 10:32									#21
	Support Apolyton, buy Call to Power 2

St-Leo, here's a quick list :

The Philippine's Tarsier - A small 45 millions year old kind of monkey.

Bradypus tridactylus - Dunno whats his name in english(Un Paresseux in french), but thats the kind of monkey that is VERY VERY SLOW and usually have fongus developping on them since they don't move much. It can take them 4 hours to climb a medium sized tree.

The Australian Ornithorhynchus anatinus - That weird looking animal from australia(damn, there's lot of useless animals over there =)

And a lot more(i'll send you a list if you give me time) Think about it, there's over 200 species of monkeys alone... if only the strongest would survive, not sure that there would be that much diversity in the world. That 'strong=survive' thing doesn't apply well for our race anyway, hehe.

Anyway, I'm off-topic now... And BTW, i'm not creationist nor darwinist, just a guy who have his own beliefs Lets talk about new Sid's game please!! hehe

-Karhgath

	19-12-1999 10:52									#22
	Tired of ads?

I think that the problem that a lot of you are having is that you assume that an animal has a USE. Also, that they must be strong to survive. Darwinism merely states that a life form must be able to survive and reproduce; those that do so better are more successful.

To Karhgath: A tarsier is not a monkey, it is a prosimian, and the several species of them are fairly successful at filling their specialized niche, thank you very much!

Bradypus Tridactylus is the three-toed sloth, which isn't even a primate, and is again successful at being a three-toed sloth!

The biggest problem with creationists is that they don't know enough biology to have an educated opinion on the subject.

Sorry for the rant....

	19-12-1999 12:22									#23
	Support Apolyton, buy Galactic Civilizations: Deluxe Edition

The problem I see is that some people think dinosaurs had a complexed society. (Is diplomacy going to be a selection of roars?) hehehe...
They were not very complexed. They all lived on just basic survival animal instincts. Hunt for food , sleep and reproduce. How do you make a good strategy game out of that ?
While the Dinosaur scenario for CIV2 was "cute" to look at, I found it uninspiring and simple.
Maybe Sid's game is just going to be real-time eye candy for dinosaur lovers. If you into that, you'll buy it

	19-12-1999 14:06									#24
	Support Apolyton or Terrorists Win

Wow, there are people out there who believe humans were created by god??

Ata

	19-12-1999 19:36									#25
	Avatar Enlargement: We've got the solution

If someone is foolish enough to belive in the concept of a flying, invisible diety (AKA god ), he is probaly not intelligent enough to understand the concept of computer ( above the description of: "big white box", or in case of an IMAC "big, colorful, useless water vase" ).

So who cares whatever they wish to buy the game or not?

But, ofcourse, we must all agree that the dino idea is totaly silly: i was waiting for a competitor with imperium-galatica II as a good replecement to master of orion II...

	20-12-1999 10:11									#26
	Got spare money?

St Leo: A giant flood is not that ridiculous an idea. If the Ice Age can lower water levels to the point where Asia and North America are joined, it is possible for the ice caps to melt and raise ocean levels abruptly.

With floods, asteroids, volcanic eruptions, climate changes and continents crashing into each other, breaking apart and moving around, it could be one interesting game.

	20-12-1999 04:19									#27
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I see quite a few people have some mixed up ideas both about creation and the flood, what actually happened, and what intelligent people belive actually happened, etc, etc. .

anyway, im not interested in discussing that on this thread. .

To answer the question: Umm. . yes, and please, try to lay off the sterotype, however accurate it may be most of the time. MANY MANY creationists have no brains at all. . but some of us do ya know Those with no brains (or very week and feeble brains) and do not know how to think for themselves might not play that game, but i think that most people are fully capable of thinking for themselves. Its quite insulting that you'd think otherwise actually, especially to me. Anyway, im a nice chap, so i'll get over it though lol.

	20-12-1999 05:47									#28
	Avatar Enlargement: We've got the solution

St Leo: A giant flood is not that ridiculous an idea. If the Ice Age can lower water levels to the point where Asia and North America are joined, it is possible for the ice caps to melt and raise ocean levels abruptly.

The highest value I ever heard is 70-meters above present (most are in the 30s) and that is not enough to cause a major extinction.:-) For reference to imperialists, Mount Everest is about 8000 meters tall.;-)

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St. Leo
http://ziggurat.sidgames.com/
http://www.sidgames.com/forums/

	20-12-1999 08:06									#29
	Support Apolyton

I am a creationist. And the reason I'm not going to waste my time with this game is not because of my beliefs, but because it sounds pretty lame. And the companies that make the civ-like games, microprose and activision, have done lame jobs with everything since fantastic worlds, like ctp, mge, and smac. Why would this dinosaur game be any different?

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Canada sucks
France is worse

Assassin of the Anarchist Supreme of the Disgracefull PROT!

	20-12-1999 08:09									#30
	Support Apolyton, pre-order Civilization IV

And after reading some comments in this thread, its amazing that atheists still label themselves as "free thinkers" with open minds.

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Canada sucks
France is worse

Assassin of the Anarchist Supreme of the Disgracefull PROT!