22-11-1999 20:16									#1
	Second best defensive unit? Support Apolyton, buy Civilization: The Boardgame

There seems to be near-universal agreement that Mechanized Infantry is the best unit in the game to have defending your cities. But I see lots of references to Alpine Troops or Marines as city defenders.

For my money, the second-best defensive unit is Armor. Its defense factor is equal to the best of the ground pounders, and its 3 hitpoints make it 50% better on defense in my book. In fact, Armor may be the best unit to station in cities, because it is more capable of a counter- or preemptive attack than Mechanized Infantry.

	22-11-1999 20:41									#2
	Lose 30 kilos (of popups)

I agree with you on all points, DaveV. Because I usually don't get far enough in to the tech tree to build Mechanized Infantry on a consistent basis (I tend to go for the space race and target my $ and efforts toward that goal), I think Armor may be the best or 2nd best unit to defend a city.

You said it all...counter or preemptive combat is very important in some stages of the game. Armor's defense is what makes it so valuable. Who wouldn't love to roll up on the Mongol capital with 20 Armor? I mean, 20 Howitzers will do the job quicker and cleaner, but can they hold their defense within the city once they get there? No.

Armor is the way to go for overtaking and defending cities. The 3 hit points, movement ability, and counterstrike ability of Armor are huge.

	22-11-1999 21:13									#3
	Lose 30 kilos (of popups)

I agree with both points, but the best defense is city walls. With walls, any defense of 4 or better(rifleman,fanatic,etc.) will survive against any land based attacker except howitzers, assuming equal vet status.
If you are going to build defenders that are expected to be in combat, then take the time to build barracks and vet defenders. For the 80 shield cost of a non-vet armor, you can build a barracks and a rifleman which will defend as well. Two fanatics is even better.
If cost is no object, how about a battleship?

	22-11-1999 21:32									#4
	Put an end to popups!

if cost is not important, then just have 10000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000
0000000000000000000000000000000000000000 nukes and nuke the pople coming at you. of course then you will need 40000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000
0000000000000000000000000000000000000000 engeneers to clean up the pollution.

actually i defend with rocket launchers
8 attack 6 defense 3hit, 3 fp move 2

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Alien Infiltrate

	23-11-1999 01:58									#5
	Support Apolyton, buy Civilization III: Complete

Against the ai I never see them with anything that is a real threat later on.I'm usually way ahead by then.So I'll go with "effectiveness" and there, vet pikes go along way then muskets can hold their own for a long time.These are the 2 defensive units that actually have to do their job against the ai.Same deal with humans add in alpine troops.Very good offensively also as they move regardless of terrain.Good for seiging specials and defending attackers in a stack.

I think the best "modern" defender is the veteran stealth fighter.Nothing gets close enough to hurt you.

	23-11-1999 03:01									#6
	Enter the AD-FREE zone

by all means city walls are the most important part of defense.... but i have to agree with Smash... once again.... pikeman and musketeers are easily my biggest defensers against the ai. I prefer vet pikemen to vet musketeers against mounted unit.... is this obvious? i dont' focus on numbers just results and i have found that musketeers can be easily defeated by vet ai mounted knight or crusaders... however they have a much more difficult time against the pikemen. Even pikemen fortified in a city with walls can defend against cavalry. Musketeers are dominant agaist ancient armies but a little weak against gunpowder.

	23-11-1999 03:43									#7
	Help yourself to an AD-FREE life

In your coastal cities fortify a couple of vet AEGIS cruiser (or an AEGIS cruiser and a battleship) can be very effective against air and sea raids. Better than the Mech Inf

	25-11-1999 05:20									#8
	Tired of ads?

In democracy, use a wall of bombers to block invasions [hehe]. Seriously, the best defencive unit is the pikemen. Since many games do not move into the modern era, I feel pikemen make the best defencive unit.

Modern era: If you have city walls, defend a few walled cities with oodles of partisans. Remember, never throw away a partisan- their worthlessness is idle to block a wave of howies, which can then be mopped up with missiles and fighters.

How you structure an effective defence in the modern era is as follows:

At the border cities [land] use walls of bombers [unless prior agreed that that is illegal] to stymie enemy advances, also using infantry and tanks to repel invaders. But the intent of the border defenders is to slow the other side down, not stop them. Remember, walls can be desstroyed, and if a civ really wants a city, they'll take it.

But, to defend, I use missiles and fighters to strike the enemy, as well as bombers. Coastal bombardments from battleships also help. The primary role of defence is not to repel but to slow or hurt; air cover is the true defender.

Walls can be broken, fortresses sabotaged, sams 86'ed, but nothing destroys a missile.