 |
|
Dida
|
|
Can we build canals in ctp2? It will be a extremly cool featurem, by allowing us to build Canals and ships to move on rivers we can 'cut the distance in half'. (that's why they've got Suez and the Panama)
|
|
| |
|
|
|
Chris Horscroft
|
|
Canberra, Australia
Sep 2000
time: 05:14
|
|
Thanks Pyaray for the decisive answer! Pity it can't be done though, as this is a major annoyance stretching right back to the original civ. Do you know of any technical reason why it can't be done? If enough people agitate for it, could it be put into a future mod?
|
|
| |
|
|
|
Dida
|
|
Isn't there a tile improvment that you can build call "Terrain" or something like that. Which becomes available after you've discoverrf Conservation. If we can change a plain into jungles, why not a plain into ocean or river?
Can Activision do some change to the code so that
we can change land tile into ocean tile, and also that ships can move on rivers? Just to make it more realistic (I think a battleship cannot engage in battle if in a narrow river)
|
|
| |
|
|
|
Gedrin
|
|
Well I have not tried it but looking over the terrain.txt in CTPI I would think changing a land tile to TERRAIN_WATER_BEACH would work.
The trouble is that if you have a setup like this:
O=Ocean; B/b=Beach; L/l=Land
OOOOO OOOOO
BBbBB -> BBbBB
LlllL -> LBBBL
LLLLL LLLLL
Then terraforming the three 'l' to 'B' must also cause 'b' to become 'O'. This could likely be SLICed in on the trigger: special.buildtransform but that triggers when Xform starts, not finishes... so if you make it ocean it will look goofy for a few turns... minor point but there never-the-less.
In order to do this every tile adjacent to the one being Xformed must be checked. If is is a beach and no tile adjacent to it (except of course the one we are currently terraforming) is a land then make it an ocean.
I do think this could be done however no one has yet.
Gedrin
[This message has been edited by Gedrin (edited October 31, 2000).]
[This message has been edited by Gedrin (edited October 31, 2000).]
|
|
| |
|
|
|
Old Bear
|
|
Malad, ID USA
Jan 1970
time: 05:14
|
|
Canals would be great, but in most cases just put a city at the narrow and exit both sides. At this late date I don't think anything new or radical will be in . Perhaps Civ III or Empire of Earth has time to include something like this. Dida is to be congratulated for coming up with a truly new idea.
------------------
The secret to life is-
there isn't any.
|
|
| |
|
| |
|
|
|
Pyaray
|
 |
Santa Ana, CA, USA
Oct 2000
time: 21:14
|
|
Just a thought about this canal issue. Has anyone stopped to think how realistic it would be to build these canals that you're asking for? I mean each tile on the map, you're probably talking 100-200 miles. The Panama Canal isn't that big, and I'm certain what you all are meaning is to make multiple canal tiles to get boats to inland cities. From a reality standpoint, this isn't really practical. The Panama Canal is the largest ever built (this is from memory, don't kill me if I'm wrong), and it's only 51 miles, and took 40 years to build, and is one of the engineering marvels of the last 2 centuries. Don't get me wrong, I understand why you want it from a gameplay standpoint. I was just curious if anyone else had actually thought of it this way.
Pyaray
|
|
| |
|
|
|
Dida
|
|
Panama Canal was built in mountainous area, in contract, the Grant Canal of China was built in the 7th Century on the Eastern China plain, which runs from HangChou in southeast China to Louyang and Chang'an in central China, linking the Yangtse and Yollow River and some other smaller river systems, stretching at least several hundred miles. And remember this was done in the 7th century when people don't have all those nice and powerful machineries to do the digging work. You might argue China was a super power at that time that not every Civ could be able to do that, but still, they did the work that is impossible according to your point of view.
|
|
| |
|
|
|
Chris Horscroft
|
|
Canberra, Australia
Sep 2000
time: 05:14
|
|
Pyaray, thanks for the reality check. I would think Panama and/or Suez should appear in wonders of the world lists - and from your post, it sounds like you'd agree. Nonetheless, a few further real-world points must be noted. Most ocean going vessels (up to modern times) have been readily capable of navigating major river systems, at least to some point. So reality would suggest that all ships, up to ships of the line, should be able to enter rivers in CTP. Canal systems have been built at various times, and have turned inland cities into significant ports. Rotterdam is a clear example, London is on a river, not the ocean, and the Great Lakes Waterway is surely a fairly good example too. Besides, the game doesn't stop at the end of the 20th century - what waterways will we build over the next thousand years?
I think most of us would want a canal system to cost enough to prevent it being used everywhere, and that would enable oceans to be connected across narrow land areas. In the original, with cities built next to each other, you could do this (poorly!). But far preferable would be the ability either to turn natural river into canal as a terrain improvement, and/or the ability to build 2 or 3 tile-length canals. This obviously expands on the "just build a city at the narrowest bit" idea! I would say canals of greater than that length are unrealistic - but see previous comment about when the game goes! Finally, the game is capable of turning land into water - it does so in response to global warming. It surely would not take too much effort for a patch to introduce:
1) Rivers can be navigated by early ships
2) Turn river into canal so as to allow large ships in
3) Build canal up to 3 tiles in length.
The last would allow players to work canals around existing rivers (which fits reality) as well as across narrow isthmuses (spelling?) like Panama and Suez.
I think most players would support such a feature - I'm sure this forum will tell you for certain!
|
|
| |
|
|
|
Dida
|
|
Agree with Chris Horscroft's proposal, I believe it's fairly easy to add these features.
But I don't think we shall be allowed to build canal over a mountain.
|
|
| |
|
|
|
Chris Horscroft
|
|
Canberra, Australia
Sep 2000
time: 05:14
|
|
Pyaray - thanks again for staying with the thread. I understand that it is not possible to include canals in the release at this late stage, and that really doesn't worry me, so long as the fan feedback saying "Please include canals" is heard, and (hopefully) acted on for the updates/patches/whatever that will no doubt follow release.
I will buy CTPII anyway, without canals, but look forward to more than 8 civs, canals, etc upgrades in future.
Presumably you guys maintain a list of desired revisions and upgrades? If so, please add waterways!
(And Dida is right - there should be limits to the terrain types you can canal through)
|
|
| |
|
|
|
Maccabee2
|
|
What an original idea! I can only hope that it might be included in some future patch, or I'll become a supplicant to the all-powerful SLIC programming players. (A settler looks in his backpack for some incense and some bribe money.)
|
|
| |
|
|
|
Gedrin
|
|
So a breif look at terrain.txt shows that all water tiles inlcude somthing like this:
ENV_CANAL_TUNNEL {
ENV_MOVEMENT 10
ENV_FREIGHT 10
ENV_MATERIALS 1200
ENV_TIME 2
ENV_ADVANCE ADVANCE_SEA_COLONIES
}
Has anyone ever tried making such a def'n for land tiles? The reason I ask is I was startled at the name. CANAL_TUNNEL. Which is it? Or it both?
I'd love to try it but alas I have recently moved and not completely set up my computer. It may be possible that this tile improvement simply allows anthing to move along it. When placed on a land tile it may even confer the same production bonuses as rivers.
And it could of course not be added to mountains... hills maybe and really expensive but not mountains.
Gedrin
|
|
| |
|
|
|
Gedrin
|
|
Well PC is up and running again and nope...
adding ENV_CANAL_TUNNEL to land does nothing.
Gedrin
|
|
| |
All times are GMT. The time now is 05:14.
Apolyton Time is 00:14. |
top of page
|
| archivepost |
|
Forum Rules:
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts
|
HTML code is ON
vB code is ON
Smilies are ON
[IMG] code is ON
|
|
|
|
|
|
31-10-2000 04:51
|