07-12-2000 02:19									#1
	first PATCH CONFIRMED! Support Apolyton, pre-order Civilization IV

from our news desk:

CTP2's Senior Producer Parker Davis, confirmed to us today that the team is working on a patch and is expected to be ready "within the next couple of weeks". A specific release date has not been set, nor is there a set list of bug fixes or changes.

The patch is the top priority for the team right now, which means that the WW2 scenario and the Editor/SLIC documentation will be released after the patch.

	07-12-2000 02:29									#2
	Support Apolyton, buy Alpha Centauri

Now that is the best news I have read about CTP2 since its release.

I hope the Activisioners have a look at the multiplayer forum comments in addition to the patch wishlist.

Hey Markos, that explains the delay in your review, you were waiting for the patch first, right?

BTW I found your Usenet postings interesting to read )

Jim

	07-12-2000 03:05									#3
	Support Apolyton

Will it fix this cursed corrupt save game? If not, I'm taking this POS back and never picking up another AVision title.

	07-12-2000 04:09									#4
	Support Apolyton, pre-order Civilization IV

The corrupt saved game bug is fixed. It won't fix saves that are already broken - there's no way to reconcile the bad data that got saved with the rest of the file, but it won't create any more bad saves.

The primary focus of the patch is indeed network games. No new functionality for multiplayer has been added, but stability is greatly improved.

	07-12-2000 05:07									#6
	Enter the AD-FREE zone

I presume "next couple of weeks" does mean before Christmas, else its next month. ?

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Pax Vobis.

	07-12-2000 06:16									#7
	Support Apolyton, buy Civilization III: Complete

I JUST WANT MY WW2 senario id rather have that then the patch.

	07-12-2000 06:28									#8
	Avatar Enlargement: We've got the solution

Don't discourage them from a patch. If the game won't save things right without it what use is having your scenario?

	07-12-2000 07:07									#9
	Help yourself to an AD-FREE life

I hope thye fix the 'faults' all teh current users/owners have with the patch. I also hope it is not the last patch. I've read a lot of interesting things about the game and almost (I state ALMOST) broke down and bought the game. But, I do not need another single player against his/her computer game (maybe 2-3 years form now when it is priced like CTP-1 at $19 rather than its currnet $39-49 range). I am therefor, still hoping for a 'Hot Seat' patch (which will probalby meet the wishes of the PBEM folks too). Without the patch, I will never experience the 'good, bad or uglies' of the game. I only play those Civ games with Hot Seat, that way my entire family can play together on the same computer. We currently have games going in CTP-1 and CIV2-TOT.

Please do not neglect a 'Hot Seat' patch.


thanks

	07-12-2000 09:00									#10
	Support Apolyton

Please add a Legion for the love of god!!!

	07-12-2000 09:26									#11
	Support Apolyton, buy Civilization III: Complete

For the second patch, we NEED TO allow the AI to transport a sufficient attacking army overseas with all transport ships of all ages.

We also NEED TO increase the sosphisication of the AI's ability to utilize all features of diplomacy. Get those computer opponents to ally and gang up on the human player!

	07-12-2000 18:06									#13
	Inflate your Upload Space

I second MR Funs request.

These are the only thing i need patched.

More diplomacy between the AI players and More hostile to the human player (More attacks) They fight between them so just make them prefer to fight the Human.

Yes make the AI use transports over water both troopsships and carriers, missiles for bombers etc.

The Air unit fuel problem that have been discussed must be fixed.

/Mathias


[This message has been edited by Matte979 (edited December 07, 2000).]

	07-12-2000 18:12									#14
	Help yourself to an AD-FREE life

A legion unit!!

A cavalry unit as ancient flanking unit... not the knight!

Unit capability to bombard from a distance!

Scenarios!



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'Blood will run'

	07-12-2000 18:16									#15
	Increase Your PM Length

I would like to say here that I've not been experiencing this save game bug at all and I've had the game at least 3 weeks now. Played every day, too. I have saved in the middle of my turns, end, beginning. I always use the keyboard shortcut, too (shift-s) and the shortcut to load if I got hung. I just don't see this bug and it bothers me a great deal!

You'd think I would be glad but I'm actually paranoid...

Patch: I agree with MrFun that the AI needs a bump in how it handles it's armies across water. As it stands, once I get a decent navy going I am unbeatable. Very frustrating cuz I know I can box the AI in all to easily. Diplomacy needs a fine-tune too. I offered the AI 50,000 gold last night for a cease-fire and they balked at it. A few turns later, they were wiped out by another AI player. Ridiculous. No sense of self-preservation. Hell, I would've sold my last living in-law for 50,000 if it meant saving my remaining city from extinction. How many units would that have purchased? This was on 'normal' diff. by the way...

	07-12-2000 18:36									#16
	Enter the AD-FREE zone

I didn't buy CTP 2, even though AI and Diplomacy seem to rule, the lack of PBEM made me ot buy. Will PBEM be in it?

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Solver - http://www.aok.20m.com

	07-12-2000 19:45									#17
	Support Apolyton, pre-order Civilization IV

I think Mr Ogre mentioned that there will be no new multiplayer functionalities so I would assume there would be no PBEM for now.

	07-12-2000 19:55									#18
	Put an end to popups!

Solver,

Go here for more info on PBEM support:
http://apolyton.net/forums/Forum46/HTML/000011.html

	07-12-2000 20:09									#19
	Support Apolyton buy from Amazon

I do not want to distract the porgrammers (who are doing a wonderful job, btw) from their task of fixing as many bugs as possible, but I have to agree that the AI's knowledge of what to do with water sucks. They really do need to know how to transport units over water and guard the transports in the process.

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The Electronic Hobbit

	07-12-2000 20:34									#20
	Support Apolyton, buy Civilization: The Boardgame

This is a relief. After 2 months Wizards and Warriors is still awaiting an officially sanctioned patch to fix its many bugs. Looks like Activision is being a bit more proactive on this title. I may just crack and buy the game when it ships tomorrow after all.

	08-12-2000 10:53									#21
	Support Apolyton or Terrorists Win

I don't mean to be Mr. Pessimistic, but I would not expect AI or diplomacy issues to be addressed by the patch, unless they are the result of a bug (like perhaps the fact that the difficulty settings don't work for the world map). As we saw with CTP I, Activision has a problem admitting design flaws exist.

I'd expect only fatal or near fatal errors will be addressed.

	08-12-2000 00:03									#22
	Increase Your PM Length

I am playing a Hard game (first game) and the AI doesnt seem to be very challenging. I will try Very Hard next and I hope its more aggressive there.
I am not first though. First are my allies, then comes me and then the rest that I am all at war with!

The thing that bothers me most is that there is no upgrade feature for units. And then the interface is also stupid. When I am in the build manager I have to know what and how many units are in this certain city! So what do I have to do? Click on City manager+klick on Units tag+klick on close. Waste of clicks that is!
Next the msgs of the message tab are displayed upper left hand corner. The "pool" is lower right hand corner. So when I click on a message I have to move the mouse all the way up to close it and then move it all the way down to delete the message. Very annoying! Besides why cant it be that I dont see all vital information in this one line of the message tag? For example: "[city.name] built [city.built], next: [city.queue[1]]" Something along this line, so that I dont have to open this message to see what is next. Would be very convient this way!!
when I think again I never need to open the message. Why not cutting that out and make the left-click on the message (in the message tab) a focus instead?
The focus currently doesnt work anyway. When I hit focus and then the city tab the previous selected city is displayed. So I have to additionally click the focused city is that what designers wanted???

Next thing is that sometimes a double click on a city opens the city manager and sometimes it opens the unit tab. Would be a lot better if there would be consistency.

My last request is that please but the army manager item in the right-click infobox on a city even when you have selected the city tab. Its lame work switching to the unit tab and then do the right click. Just the army manager!

And I dont like the new trade manager. When I abandon the trade route my caravan dies???? Why isnt it possible to use the caravan on other trade routes?

Oh and yes it seems that there is something wrong with the population numbers. It says all my cities are below size 30,000. I checked Warsaw and it said they were 252,000!!!

I miss the maximize buttons. Sure I could play around with the specialists for myself, but I dont want that. I want to hit: "Production" and Specialists are assigned that way that I have best production while still not starving.

If you could pay some attention to this things I would be very happy.

ATa

	08-12-2000 06:23									#23
	Help yourself to an AD-FREE life

and if you could make it so that you can zoom in and have your units battle in a first person view, that'd be killer wicked sweeeeeeeet.

...'specially the slavers.. koooool...

Of course.. if you'd rather just work on the already well-documented multiplayer and save bugs for now that's alright too I suppose.

	08-12-2000 07:44									#24
	Support Apolyton, buy GURPS/ Alpha Centauri

I don't think that Activision will bring out a patch for AI issues. The fact that the AI can't beat good players isn't really a bug. Only mods will help make the AI better - that, or suggestions like giving the AI more time to move, etc.

But, since you asked what should be in the batch - I vote that they fix the "alliance" bug. The GL says my ally's map should be transferred to me every turn - how about making this actually happen?

	08-12-2000 07:51									#25
	Browse Apolyton AD-FREE

I would love it if when bombarding a city A city view comes up (civ2 style) and you could see the shells dropping and damaging the buildings in the city reducing the effectiveness and eventually destroying it
droooool!
I haven't even got the game yet and I need more

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" mind over body "

	08-12-2000 23:21									#26
	Support Apolyton, buy Alpha Centauri

So CTP2 is going be a game like Axis&Allies, where you have to invent limitations on yourself to get a challenging game... Last time I played as germany I set all japans offensive values to 0, essentially forcing me to take on the entire world myself. Still won, but it took a little while longer...

So what to do for CTP2? I've tried allocating longer times for the AI to think, didn't help. Maybe 'hmm, what if I play and refuse to build wonders'? Or refuse to build bombard units... *sigh*

I just don't get it... Does people remember the old game Master of Magic? I'm guessing it is about seven years old, but the AI there is still hard to beat... Quite aggressive, combined with a bit of cheating... It still beats me one time out of two. What happened since then? Apparently nothing... Diplomacy, A&A, Advanced Civilization, CTP, CTPII, they all feel like stealing candy from a deaf, blind and overly cordial kid...

And while this is not a bug... It should be treated as a criminal offense...



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Gnu Ex Machina - the Gnu in the Machine

	08-12-2000 23:35									#27
	Increase Your PM Length

Improved AI will not be a part of the patch...

Everyone hope that MedMod2 will correct these issues - and I believe that it will. After comparing a MedMod CTP1 and the default CTP2, MedMod CTP1 is still better.

CTP2 is better than the default CTP1 though.

I hope the whole 'Scenario Editor' issue will be addressed. At this point, all I can do is place settlers on a map. Placing cities causes a whole host of goofy things to happen. (maybe I am missing something here?) At least give us instructions how to do the basics...

And please address the 'Wonder Movie' bug which leaves the movie screen up after the movie is done. I can't get rid of it!

	09-12-2000 00:25									#29
	Support Apolyton, buy Civilization: The Boardgame

"and if you could make it so that you can zoom in and have your units battle in a first person view, that'd be killer wicked sweeeeeeeet.
...'specially the slavers.. koooool...

Uhm, you don't fix that in a patch
You add it to a game before it's released

	09-12-2000 03:47									#30
	Support Apolyton buy from Amazon

When?

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Big Dave

Do the Vatican police speak Pig Latin?