08-02-2000 20:21									#1
	Does anyone play "flat world"? Support Apolyton, buy Call to Power 2

I've started a few games recently in the flat world (in the ToT fantasy game). I think that you get a border (on all four sides) of grassland that can safely be ignored for good terrain. I haven't see a hut on the border yet, but I haven't looked real hard.

It's kind of intetrsting to play this way, i think. Any comments?
-toby


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toby robison
criticalpaths@mindspring.com

	08-02-2000 20:46									#2
	Support Apolyton, buy GURPS/ Alpha Centauri

I think when playing on a localized geographically-realistic map (like my recent NY State map), you have to play it flat. I think for a random map, that would just take too long to play (unless it's a small world).

	09-02-2000 10:20									#4
	Support Apolyton, buy Galactic Civilizations: Deluxe Edition

Sten: What was it exactly that prompted you to get ToT?

	09-02-2000 10:59									#5
	Support Apolyton, pre-order Civilization IV

Stephano -

1) tobyr's questions about ToT made me feel incomplete

2) Carolus got it and I feel like I owe it to him since I encouraged him to get MGE.

3) I own HAS stock and it keeps going down

Do you have it?

	08-02-2000 23:26									#6
	Support Apolyton buy from Amazon

When you customize the world you are building, you get to a Customize rules screen, where you can choose options like civ-1-style combat, and "Don't restart eliminated players". "Flat world" is one of the options. If you select it, the world has four uncrossable boundaries to the E, S, W and N; You cannot go east forever, or west forever.

What I like about it is:
(1) It's easy to digest the actual map as it is revealed.
(2) there are no poles of ice to deal with.

- toby


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toby robison
criticalpaths@mindspring.com

	08-02-2000 23:57									#7
	Support Apolyton, buy Galactic Civilizations

Hmmm, that stuff I knew, but I'm still not sure why it would be ignored for good terrain - it still acts like grassland and can have hidden specials, doesn't it??

	09-02-2000 00:59									#8
	Support Apolyton, buy Call to Power 2

I revealed the (normal size) map in a flat world fantasy game to see what's on those borders. In this game, the surface, cloud and underground maps have the equivalent of ocean all around the border. The surface LOOKS like there is a grassland border, but grassland is on halfsquares that do not actually exist, and are mostly black. The surface actually has one landmass that extends all the way to the border.

The undersea map has a 3-square-wide border all around of normal land, including special squares. Please note that if I had not picked "flat world", the same would be the case undersea, except that the edge squares might be all mountains, or mostly coral; there is a lot of variation undersea.

I do not think this is the only possibility for the surface map either; in another game (small map), I think there really was grassland around the edge, but with no specials; but my memory is hazy.

- toby


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toby robison
criticalpaths@mindspring.com

	09-02-2000 01:02									#9
	Get a bigger avatar today!

Sten: Got to admit, my friend, that I have a very strong bias - I am completely turned off by anything fantasy or science fiction. That, unfortunately rules out SMAC, ToT, CtP, etc. I guess I'm too much of a historical purist, which is why I am very intrigued about 'Sacrificial Blood' - it says the two magic words for me, 'historically accurate'. And, that is why I fervently hope that CivIII will based here on earth starting at 4000bc (with the option of creating scenarios, of course).

Sten, since I respect your opinions, maybe you can help me and other shed light on ToT, SMAC, Sac Blood, etc.?

	09-02-2000 02:59									#10
	Full PM-box? Change here!

toby - thanks for the super clarification! Now I get it. Of course if I had run into the ToT maps before I should have understood you the first time. Soon!

Steve - My historical bias is much less strong, though it is my preferred style of game. I read those Tolkein books at an early age; add in some Norse mythology and Midgard ends up being alternate history or prehistory if you will. Scifi also works for me as an possible future history.

I think ToT has your choice of game styles...some historical scenarios, a fantasy scene and a space game. All with four maps and a variety of new features. And if it sucks I'll just add it to my CD holder next to SMAC.

On the other hand if Sac Blood turns out to be as cool as it sounds, I'll be so caught up with it that I won't get around to anything else for a while. Have you DLed it yet? I should do that this evening...

	09-02-2000 04:49									#11
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Hey Steve, i bought all the add ons for civ2 and such... TOT CTP SMAC.... and MGE is by far the best and has the most competition or replay value.

I too am a huge history buff and that is probably why SMAC which is a great game doesn't interest me nearly as much as civ.

IMO save your money and get MGE if you don't already have it.... and if you do, My MOnGOLS are waiting patiently for you.

I must admit some concepts in both TOT and CTP and SMAC are great and would like to see it in civ3 if it wont mess with the game

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Destroy or be Destroyed.
Conquer or be Conquered.
Strategy overcomes any odds.
Hit first,fast,hit last.
I am not a warmonger, i am just aggressively forcefull.


icq 30200920

	09-02-2000 21:27									#12
	Tired of ads?

War: I have only played with MGE since I started civing - not for MP, but because it was what was available at the time. You wouldn't believe the number of offers in all of my gaming years to play MP. I just can't. My gaming time is very limited and very specific. The only thing I've done is PBEM on the TalonSoft Civil War games with a good friend from the ACW Gaming Club. Don't think PBEM would work for MGE. I would love to play you and Sten (and others), but alas...

	10-02-2000 04:01									#13
	Support Apolyton, buy Civilization III: Complete

Steve there is a PBEM thread in one of the forums.... we could do it if you like hint hint...... and as my baby is due anyday now, i have less and less time as well...

------------------
Destroy or be Destroyed.
Conquer or be Conquered.
Strategy overcomes any odds.
Hit first,fast,hit last.
I am not a warmonger, i am just aggressively forcefull.


icq 30200920

	10-02-2000 04:12									#14
	Help yourself to an AD-FREE life

War4naught & Steve - I would be up for trying a small PBEM game, my guess is that diplomacy would require a well established set of house rules; we are expecting our first child in two months and I have no idea what I'm in for!

	10-02-2000 04:33									#15
	Lose 30 kilos (of popups)

Sten and War: Much congratulations on your upcoming babies. Pray that all will go well. I can tell you exactly what to expect (assuming you haven't gone through this before). No more playing until 2am (you'll be too tired), no more playing for a few hours during the day (you have to give your wife a break) and no more playing after dinner (you have to give your wife a break). The only time you can play is after the child goes to bed and before you do, so in my case, that means 7:15 to 9:00 or 10:00. I have a 2 year old and when I am on the computer during the day, he and I want to play together (and it's not Civ). At first with an infant, it's pretty easy to get game time in, but once they become toddlers, I guarantee that game time will be reduced significantly.

Will look at PBEM (didn't know we could do it), I would be very interested in giving it a try.

	10-02-2000 04:37									#16
	Support Apolyton, buy Civilization III: Complete

congrats Sten.... you are the third person who plays civ that i "know" online who is also expecting a child.... we civers are a ferile group

Steve i believe the PBEM is in the strat forum a few pages back i am sure..... or we could start a new thread for us and maybe others if you like