20-02-2000 00:27									#1
	None Units Support Apolyton

Can anyone tell me how far away do you have to be from your nearest city in order to get a none unit when you trip a hut? I seem to rarely get a none unit when I go exploring tripping huts and get a military unit that costs valuable shields from one of my cities.
It is usually too far a away to expediently bring it home and disband it.

Ron

	20-02-2000 00:53									#2
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Units from huts are always supported from the closest city. But if the closest city is not yours the unit will be NONE.

	20-02-2000 01:55									#3
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And you can easily return your units, even if they´re far away from your cities. Just place them in a city radius of an AI civ you´re not allied or at war with. They will ask you to withdraw your troops to one of your cities - flight ticket included.

	20-02-2000 02:06									#4
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Ahh None units, one of the joys of my life . I don't get enough of them when I play on huge maps. But if I play on small maps, I can get a decent amount of them. The staple of a good democracy is plenty of None units. It's almost too easy when I play a world map, because I know where the other civs are, and it makes it much easier to get none units.

	20-02-2000 08:17									#5
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BB, on a large map it's easy, park a couple of diplos and two defensive units on a mountain within 4 squares of and enemy city and you will get more non units that you know what to do with. Then extort money for peace and move the excess into their city range and take the free airline ticket home. This is the preferred method for building your army in OCC. Unfortunately it doesn't work as well against human opponents
RAH

	20-02-2000 08:36									#6
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Ah, but Rah, you forget the beings that reside at the Zone...they make ME look good.

There is another trick to getting None units, but you can only do it once a turn.

Basicly, you open the status window for a city in which you have an archer, which is based in another city, not the one its in. With the window that list the commands for the unit open, when it just comes to your turn [in an MP game], immediately hit 'support from this city
and you'll have a free unit.

Of course, this is a cheat, but it is a healthy one.

	20-02-2000 08:48									#7
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Yes, we were aware of that one. In fact XIN YU was the first to figure that one out, and he did figure it out in a game I was in.
Nothing gets past XIN.

RAH
We actually check after games to see if anyone has done it during a game that we're in. If so, we just never play with them again. Actually we have caught quite a few doing it.

	20-02-2000 14:40									#8
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People are still cheating ? hm........ must be because they aren't good enough

	20-02-2000 15:20									#9
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Cheating... *gasp*... Rah... tisk, tisk... oh wait n/m

	21-02-2000 00:09									#10
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Be careful.I challenged an opponent once on non units.

"You have non phalanxs.No way!"

"lol.My barracks city is Nonah"

"oops.sorry"

"dont ***** about my settler from Nontega"

	21-02-2000 00:49									#11
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LOL

Just look in the city menu and see if the Non(whatever) city has any settlers or whatever units attached to it...

	21-02-2000 01:05									#12
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I feel stupid asking this, but how do you check if they used this cheat or not? OK, if every single unit is a NONE it's pretty obvious, but if it's only two? How can you tell?

Carolus

	21-02-2000 01:17									#13
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One or two, and you have to just let it pass... But, when their whole navy is Non Units... that's a problem
You look for patterns over games. It's easy to figure out who is doing it.

	21-02-2000 05:04									#14
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It's called saving after every turn. If you see a few too many at the end, you just go back a few turns and you can see when they did it. Pretty darn definative........BUT

Yes, you're right, It is dangerous to accuse people. So I don't, I just stop playing with them. This is the main reason I don't usually play in tourneys, league, or other "prove how great we are games" I prefer to play with people that I don't have to worry about saving each turn. Don't get me wrong, Tournaments could be great, but not till they do a little better job of bullet proofing the game.

RAH

	21-02-2000 06:45									#15
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Well put Rah... you know i really want to play tournies too... but all i have ever heard is players who feel victumized by alleged cheaters........

Now , i don't want to slam anyone and i wont' as who really knows whats happened in the past, but it certainly segregates many great players from playing tournies....

Rah is right..... if you want a good honest game of civ play with poeple you know or here good things of by word of mouth.... this will help minimize any hard feelings

In fact... lucky me.... i have a great circle of civers to play and win or lose, i always get an honest and exciting game.

	21-02-2000 17:19									#16
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Hahahaha!

A NONE navy? I guess they didn't bribe your navy either?

Heck, even I would raise an eyebrow in that case...

Carolus

	21-02-2000 20:58									#17
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RAH raises a good point. Always save every turn if you have any thought that somebody might be cheating. You might actually learn that the person didn't cheat at all... and that they were just a better player

I also agree with him on his position of tourneys (duh). That is why I have no interest in playing them. The whole idea of such tourneys seems to bring out the worst in some people... sigh... Give me a good group of people I know... and thank god I have found such a group here

	23-02-2000 03:29									#18
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A NONE unit will be 'NON' while a unit supported by a city named 'NONE' will be 'Non'. You can tell the difference.

	23-02-2000 03:40									#19
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Xin Yu... what if the city was NONE.... then It would be NON wouldnt it ?

Ok ... i am confused here.....
[This message has been edited by War4ever (edited February 22, 2000).]

	23-02-2000 04:15									#20
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A NONE unit woule be 'NON', all capital letters; a unit supported by a city, even if the city name is all capital, will be 'Non', only the first letter is capital.

	23-02-2000 05:14									#21
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not if you name in capitols.ie-NONAH-NONTEGA-NONBHETTO-etc

just reread Xin's last post.I get the first 3 letters exactly as you have you used them in the name.Please don't tell me this is another difference with the MAC version.
PC people:
could you start a deity game and resupport your 2nd settler after naming your city NON something and confirm this?
[This message has been edited by Smash (edited February 22, 2000).]

	23-02-2000 05:30									#22
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Xin Yu... For once, you are wrong on this one. (a rare event) I just went and tested this in a recently saved MP game. The unit shows as NON. I changed the city name to all caps (NONTEST) and the unit showed as NON. Granted, the unit is still supported by the city...

	23-02-2000 05:40									#23
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Ooooops. Final hope. There are several views, inside city window maybe different?

	23-02-2000 05:47									#24
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so i am not retarded then and no wise cracks you guys !

	23-02-2000 06:03									#25
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if the unit in question is from another city named NON-(players do this to keep units from disbanding in seiges)it looks just like a NONE unit not showing support from the city you investigate.

I used to do stuff like this to confuse people but I found the only one being confused was me.

	24-02-2000 11:39									#26
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Smash... huh?
A unit supported by a city named NONxxx, inside another city under siege won't "disband". Why would they disband?
Die, yes, but disband?

I know it's the wee hours of the morn & i may be easily confused... but i do not follow that thread at all.

	24-02-2000 12:42									#27
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ok.This is more a 1x production occurence and against Republics and Democracies more than other governments

By seiging specials,you can rob a city of that specials resources.If the situation is right,the loss of that specials resources can leave a city with a sheild deficit.This deficit causes disbanding to "level" out.By supporting defenders from other cities,that cities defenders cant be disbanded by seiging the city

Settlers can also be disbanded if food runs out.

By "capturing" a high trade resource,you may rob the city of enough trade arrows to cause civil disorder

	24-02-2000 13:06									#28
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Ken - As you know, if you are in Republic or Democracy, each unit requires one shield support. During a siege, the enemy is sitting on your mines and other shield squares - stopping that production from reaching the city. If 4 units are garrisoned in the city, all supported from that city, the shield shortage causes automatic disbanding of all but one of the units. (The one being supported from the shield on the city square itself.)
To avoid this situation, have some units there supported from other cities.
The siege works well against an AI city when you wish to preserve its population and improvements.
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SG (2)

	24-02-2000 13:09									#29
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Sorry Smash - I was writing whilst you were posting!
-------
SG (2)

	24-02-2000 23:01									#30
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hehehe....I like your explanation better