07-01-2001 20:43									#1
	Attempting to fix the AI Support Apolyton, buy Civilization 2

As I said in the general forum, 'et's attack the AI... so what general, realizable, complaints to we have.. and has anyone modified the files to fix any of the complaints that will/are listed below.

Rich
[This message has been edited by OmniGod (edited January 07, 2001).]

	08-01-2001 10:56									#2
	Enter the AD-FREE zone

I've made quite a few improvements on the AI and posted some of the files up on my site. I've had ALOT of luck making the barbarians super aggressive but not stupid. They've bypassed heavily defended cities to attack weaker ones, I've seen barbs from a hut step back, group, then attack the next turn. Normally they would always just throw themselves piecemeal at me, which stills hapens most of the time. I've increase Ai garrisons so they arent as easy to take. i've seen some inteesting AI wars. The biggest prob is that the AI does a preemptive calculation to see if it can win. If it cant then it waits for the human to attack. From what I can tell, the AI takes into account terrain/building bonuses when doing its calculation. Unfortunately, during test games, almost always the closest civs are passive types so i havent had as many pitched wars with them as I had hoped. I have seen the AIs retake their cities from barbarians which unlike the old days, barbarians now defend their cities.

I mostly played with the goals and strategies files. What really irks me is when the barbarian kicks into the default mod and starts building wonders and trades routes. I wanted it to just pump out alot of units which in those games makes a passive defense impossible. I've seen civs as large as 7 fall into barb hands. What really needs to be done is to figure out how the AI determines which strategy is used and under what conditions does it determine whether to change strategies. Also I noticed that if the human player just cities in a few cities, the game plays totally differently. I restarted a game to watch how the AI had moved and they didnt go to the same places and the barbarians were none existant.

What would great is if some time we could get some of the knowledgeable mod'ers into a chat room for an interactive discussion. i know Apolyton has chatrooms but no clue how to get to them.

------------------
History is written by the victor.

	07-01-2001 23:58									#3
	Support Apolyton, buy Civilization 2

Hey, I'm a modifier - just point me to the chatrooms too please.

The modifications I have made are ones from other people's ideas and posts:

increasing AI's time to make decisions,

doubling all MaxEval and MaxExec numbers in the Strategy.txt file,

and giving the AI a better lists of government types.

I have seen a little improvement, but who knows - maybe we can get the AI even more improved. I am pretty much satisfied with the Barbarians - I want to keep them as a nuisance rather than a greater threat. But let's try to find ways to get the AI to utilize armies on the offense and a more coherent defense strategy.

	08-01-2001 04:07									#4
	Increase Your PM Length

hmmm...well first what needs to be said at least once is where the %^%$^%$ is activition on this! Its not the loyal and slighted fan bases job to fix this. Our reward for working hard at te end of the day shouldnt be trouble shooting someone elses screw-up. That said..it is kinda fun and empowering...but Activision really need to be doing it. What happened to the Azarel2 fella ..he was from activision eh ? Lets make him watch Patty Duke re-runs until he submits!! hehe

In reality though it seems the ball is in our court..so far I think you folks have played a good game..From what I've rumaged off these boards I've/We've given the shipped Artifical-dumbass a total makeover and now it takes my cities and all that fun stuff. I even got that revoultion thingie working now. Very annoying in a multiplayer game that I've been playing for like weeks to have all your cities suddenly decide they want to be Korean..heh its really added some spicy to the game...Ok to the point..I've got two things I'd like to see

1) The computer now attacks me and takes cities and whatnot...but does it half assly...I'd like to see a full on sweeping offensive with all its units like the Monguls use to do in the first civ. Right now its sends like 5-6 and pecks at my weaker cities. I think the solution behind this has something to do with the computers gadging of which tile to move to...it seems to keep large collections of 12 stacks of units right nxt to its cities...I think this is because it cant pass through other 12 stacks and it would never think to go around because that would be "inefficient". Solution : Dull the Ai's "next move chooser" so it doesnt seek the most effienct path to its goal. Yes, it will do dumb things like not use roads...but I think it will free up all those stacks that get caught from being fanatical about using roads...or have the AI just build roads everywhere like in the first 2 civs.

2)My second issue involves the use of transports and choppers or the lack there off. I have never ever ever seen the AI put more than one or two units on these thing..I now play random maps that are super-mega continents because I KNOW the AI could never really attack me island to island and thus an Island game would be very very boring. Its seem to know how to use these typs of units...I've seen it do this with settlers...but never with anything else. This is prob tied into the whole aircraft carrier prob..who is to say though...anyhoo.. Solution:: I think that someone will have to go in and write a whole behavior instruction that entials grouping several units at the sea and then loading then and then shipping them to whereever...I cant see this problem fixed by our hunt and peck repairs that effect general attitudes and whatnot...unless this type of behavior is already writen and just not getting enough love.

So thats my two cents...I'm going to track down the activision HQ phone number and see if I can instruct some of their executive muckity-mucks in the fine art of customer service and communication. I would hope that everyone here has sent at least one *****-mail to the CS dept there.

-joe
[This message has been edited by joe77 (edited January 07, 2001).]

	08-01-2001 10:34									#5
	Remove this text

Um Joe - Mark, Omni and others would appreciate it if no none trashes Activision staff anymore and instead coordinate our efforts to modify and fix these flaws ourselves. Yes, we do not get paid - but I agree with Omni and others that it is time to stop complaining about Activision's staff.

I made the mistake myself recently posting a sarcastic attack on bad AI - but that's the last of that for me. Now, I'll just discuss what can be done.

	09-01-2001 04:33									#6
	Remove this text

My friend, perhaps you do not realize the gravity of the situation!! Are you aware that if you spell Activision backwards in Gaelic then count letters, using the inverse numeric value of each letter, from the first letter of the book of Quanza to the last letter in the Dead Sea scrolls it spells out "Go Satan! Rah! Rah! Rah!" ?? It is not just for our duty to ourselves but for our duty to the global comunity that we must right this wrong and assure that poor Timmy, starving and naked on the streets, without an internet connection to call his own, and those like him, without access to this site and site like it, can grow up with one or two stratigic brain cells because WE made sure the the great Satan cleaned up its mess and made available to the public all the positive changes we have found for ourselves here. FOR GOODNESS SAKE MAN FOR ONCE IN YOUR LIFE THINK OF THE CHILDREN!

(no band wagons or patriotic flag-wavers, nor ciggarette-lighter swayers were injured in the authoring of the post)
[This message has been edited by joe77 (edited January 08, 2001).]

	09-01-2001 07:42									#7
	Put an end to popups!

ROFL!!!

That was a FUNNY one, Joe.