23-05-2001 21:29									#31
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quote: Originally posted by Yog-Sothoth Hmm, if this screen shows all the advances for the middle age (22 of them), and there is to be 4 ages that will give us about 100 advances. Civ II had 90 (?), with the increase in the number of wonders, units etc one would think that Civ III would have more advances than this.

Hold on a second! In Civ 2, albeit it had four eras too, had only 17 techs in the renaissance! If a similar pater is followed, that means there WILL be a lot more techs! If the increase is proportional there will be over 115 techs! Of course there'll be more techs.

	24-05-2001 01:25									#32
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Does anybody else think that the screenshot uses muddy dark colors? I liked the bright general appearance in Civ I and Civ II but I found the SMAC appearance so dark that I eventually didn't want to play it . I was hoping that Civ III would recognize that the dark look was probably what prevented SMAC from being as classic a game as Civ II and would fix that but evidently they thought otherwise.

	24-05-2001 06:41									#33
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quote: Originally posted by Grigor Does anybody else think that the screenshot uses muddy dark colors? I liked the bright general appearance in Civ I and Civ II but I found the SMAC appearance so dark that I eventually didn't want to play it . I was hoping that Civ III would recognize that the dark look was probably what prevented SMAC from being as classic a game as Civ II and would fix that but evidently they thought otherwise.

I think that the issue comes from the whole game being focused on the Tower of Babel coloring and looks that a preview quoted Jeff Briggs as saying. I think that the coloring looks a lot like parchment, though I'd rather have a marbley feel like the Civ2 menus, but it's really a minor point in my view. I do like the fact that all the menus are pretty focused as to looking similar in style, nothing feels out of place that way. I never thought that the city screen and science screen in particular fit into the general look of Civ2, but again, real minor complaint.

	24-05-2001 22:01									#34
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[QUOTE] Originally posted by bagdar
Music Theory as a tech? What theory? which theory? Why is it in the 'middle ages', are they trying to refer to the beginnings of polyphony? Do they mean 'an awareness of musical theory'? Then why not Pythagoras but the middle ages?

Hello! I taught Music Theory at a university as a grad student and I can tell you that Music Theory as we know it today did not exist before the 1500s or so. What Pythagoras did was not really Music Theory, but rather a theory of harmonics and vibrations and such. With just Pythagoras, Bach wouldn't have been possible, for example. On the other hand, even if having Music Theory develop during the Middle Ages were a weird notion (which it's not) I am willing to 'suspend disbelief' for the sake of what promises to be a great game!

	24-05-2001 23:53									#35
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quote: Originally posted by netcowboy Hello! I taught Music Theory at a university as a grad student and I can tell you that Music Theory as we know it today did not exist before the 1500s or so. What Pythagoras did was not really Music Theory, but rather a theory of harmonics and vibrations and such. With just Pythagoras, Bach wouldn't have been possible, for example. On the other hand, even if having Music Theory develop during the Middle Ages were a weird notion (which it's not) I am willing to 'suspend disbelief' for the sake of what promises to be a great game!

Yes, I know what was there before 1500s, as well as what happened in the 1900s, not to mention what's inbetween. What I feared was CTPlike advances which didn't have any taste whatsoever. This issue was settled some time ago, and it's perhaps the most appropriate way of having 'culture' in the game. I have a personal distaste for those people who cling to 'theory' as holy scriptures of Aesthetics: Since techs in Civ are mostly time-independent, the discovery of 'music theory' at some age is disturbing for me. Oh, anyway.

	25-05-2001 00:52									#36
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On the second screenshot, on the top right, there is some black text that says "eyes on thero, sir"

what's this?

	25-05-2001 00:54									#37
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quote: Originally posted by bagdar I have a personal distaste for those people who cling to 'theory' as holy scriptures of Aesthetics: Since techs in Civ are mostly time-independent, the discovery of 'music theory' at some age is disturbing for me. Oh, anyway.

Well, I think the invention of a codified, univerally understandable system for explaining all of these little tones we've been making on our little sticks and bells, so that we can play together as orchestras, and play other people's music from other parts of the world -- that's a cultural development. What you call 'holy scriptures,' I guess I call that the development of a new system for constructing and designing musical architectures,etc; a system that was sorely lacking before a specific point in history. Of course you're right though, it's surprising that this issue would engender so much commentary. I wonder if it's the parallel between musical composition and empire-building

	25-05-2001 01:22									#38
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One thing worth noting about the new in game shot is that it no longer has those shaded circles at the bottom of all the units

	25-05-2001 01:59									#39
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quote: Originally posted by cyborgasm One thing worth noting about the new in game shot is that it no longer has those shaded circles at the bottom of all the units

It seems they replaced the circle with slight unit coloring. The American units have the light blue color striped across their uniforms and as part of the paint job on the chariot. I personally don't like that way much, too minor, too easy to miss who a unit belongs too. I'd even rather have the ugly circles (maybe slightly transparent) but at least they're very easy to recognize

	25-05-2001 02:03									#40
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quote: Originally posted by HsFB On the second screenshot, on the top right, there is some black text that says "eyes on thero, sir" what's this?

I think it says "eye on them, sir"

Maybe one of the map names, like in SMAC where you could name map features? Just a guess, I really don't have a clue as to what it means.

	25-05-2001 02:42									#41
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quote: Originally posted by SerapisIV I think it says "eye on them, sir" Maybe one of the map names, like in SMAC where you could name map features? Just a guess, I really don't have a clue as to what it means.

May be I'm mixing info, but it seems to me it refer to (somewhere previewed) feature to "stick " the camera on a target (e.g. unit, city).
At least it has some sense to me

	25-05-2001 02:51									#42
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Well if its a focus on target feature, it would appear to be focused on the Indian Chief, which would give support to someone's suggestion that the Chief is a leader, not a unique unit as the human player would be very interested on where that unit goes because he can have an army behind him. Along those lines, is there going to be some kind of flag or distinction between armies and individual units?

	25-05-2001 03:38									#43
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Coud it be more abvious that civ 3 is taking the better parts (the few there were) of CTP
and making them their own? Ages of technologiical advance is just the most obvious one.

	25-05-2001 20:44									#44
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quote: Originally posted by netcowboy Well, I think the invention of a codified, univerally understandable system for explaining all of these little tones we've been making on our little sticks and bells, so that we can play together as orchestras, and play other people's music from other parts of the world -- that's a cultural development. What you call 'holy scriptures,' I guess I call that the development of a new system for constructing and designing musical architectures,etc; a system that was sorely lacking before a specific point in history. Of course you're right though, it's surprising that this issue would engender so much commentary. I wonder if it's the parallel between musical composition and empire-building

Maybe that's why I always enter my name as 'Alban Berg' regardless whether I'm playing the Chinese or the Greeks

I wonder what other techs there are, similar to this one? In fact I am curious about all those new techs... Free Artistry? Education? Military Tradition? ( god, it sounds ctp )

	26-05-2001 02:35									#45
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quote: Originally posted by SerapisIV I think that the issue comes from the whole game being focused on the Tower of Babel coloring and looks that a preview quoted Jeff Briggs as saying. I think that the coloring looks a lot like parchment, though I'd rather have a marbley feel like the Civ2 menus, but it's really a minor point in my view. I do like the fact that all the menus are pretty focused as to looking similar in style, nothing feels out of place that way. I never thought that the city screen and science screen in particular fit into the general look of Civ2, but again, real minor complaint.

At least what I have seen the map does not use the colors of that Tower of Babel thingy. The city views which in my opinion looks absolutely fantastic follows the color used in the Tower of Bable thing. The rest of the map is a brighented up version due to the complaints of a dark map. Personally I think using the darker fuller colors on the City View Screen would add depth, color, and enrich the game compared to the brighter colors currently being used. The contrasting oranges, red, greens, and such of the City View Screen is just so appealing and inviting to me and I personally believe would be closer to the Tower of Bable and closer to the look Civ III should be.