04-05-2000 22:34									#1
	Exchanging Maps Got spare money?

Another question for the enlightenment of those in whose hands "the torch of knowledge sputters."

Has anyone ever exchanged maps with an AI opponent? I wish there were a way to threaten them into doing so.

	04-05-2000 22:50									#2
	Increase the size of your Attachments

In my experience, there seem to be three factors involved in map trading. If you are #1 on the power graph (usually #1 in population is a good indication of this) or #1 in land area, then the AI will refuse to trade maps so you wont get too far ahead. If you are #6 or #7 in either category, the AI will scoff at you for being too far behind. In either case you get the same "We have no need for your useless maps" message. It also helps if their attitude toward you is neutral, receptive, or better. Give them a couple gifts and their attitude will improve.

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"I fear that I shall die a Prince."
-Edward VII, Prince of Wales

	04-05-2000 23:20									#3
	Increase Your PM Length

The only absolute requirement is that the AI must have Map Making, or it cannot trade. I think the willingness to trade is based solely on attitude; I am usually way ahead in the powergraph in my games and I can still trade maps if someone is cordial or better. In one game, I had an atrocious reputation and was still able to trade maps with an AI after gifting them up to Worshipful. This was after I had nearly wiped them out, breaking treaties all the way, and couldn't find their last city.

A further note: the AIs like you when you trade maps. Trading maps every turn can improve your relations or at least keep them from deteriorating.

	04-05-2000 23:39									#4
	Increase Your PM Length

You should ALWAYS try to trade maps with the AI in a game against the computer. Since they know where all your cities are anyway, why not. At least it makes it fair

The trick is getting them to do it. It is even harder in the Civ MPE Gold edition than it was in CivII. They made the AI a little nastier. (just in attitude, not combat)

	04-05-2000 23:46									#5
	Increase Your PM Length

you usually have to get them to worshipful or allied.

usually you have to give a few techs to acheive this attitude.With MGE you have give away the farm.And next turn they hate you again.Not a very good investment

	09-05-2000 06:13									#6
	Support Apolyton buy from Amazon

You can sometimes get a map exchange if the ai is enthusiastic. Otherwise, you need to be worshipful or allied. I think you both need map making. If you have these conditions, keep trying, particularly early. As you start to have success, the map trading will dry up. Even an obsolete map will help.

	09-05-2000 09:30									#7
	Suffering from ads?

Thank you all for this thread. I had been loath to trade off any of the really "good" techs (Mapmaking, Navigation, etc) for fear of having the AI use it to stomp all over me. The result was, they'd never trade maps with me.

The other day, I offered them a couple of "gifts," techs that I might not really have wanted to part with, but as a result, I shared maps with two of them, giving me coverage of a large chunk of the world.

However, I still have a bad reputation; the idiots come and stand on my irrigated fields, tramping down my rice, and expect that I'll leave them alone just because they've paid tribute!

I'm a nice guy, and not a warmonger, but I'm not _that_ nice.

Jim W

	09-05-2000 18:15									#8
	Enter the AD-FREE zone

Jim-

Reputation isn't taken into account for your final score. Ergo, 1) don't worry so much if the other civs hate you, and 2) The Eiffel tower doesn't account for much in AI games. Try to sow discord among your opponents so they leave you alone. Or, send an emissary and insist they withdraw their troops. If the animated herald appears to be giggling, claiming they have no troops on your territory, then just kick their asses and ask for a cease fire later.
[This message has been edited by Sortub (edited May 09, 2000).]

	09-05-2000 19:30									#9
	Remove this text

Yes, it has been remarked elsewhere that when the AI refuses to "withdraw his troops" or the option to ask of a nation at Peace (not allied or cease fire) magically disappears this is advance warning of an impending sneak attack - so"do unto others..."

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Scouse Git[1]

"CARTAGO DELENDA EST" - Cato the Censor

	10-05-2000 07:59									#12
	Support Apolyton, buy Call to Power 2

Check out Ai's attitude often.
If AI's attitude is,Hostile or Icy,you have peace treaty with them and attitude suddenly change to Receptive w/o reason,you will be sneak attacked next turn.

-What exactly your comment have to do with map exchange?
-Hell if i know

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	10-05-2000 19:55									#13
	Support Apolyton buy from Amazon

Venger - I did say "Peace (not allied or cease fire)" allies cannot be attacked or attack you and do not restrict your access to resources - during a cease fire - horrible things _ I avoid them at all costs _ they can attack you, you can only attack them at loss of reputation - they restrict your resources and you cannot ask them to retire.
The purpose of my post was to point out that an AI at peace can and will sneak attack, but this is ofttimes flagged by your inability to ask him to withdraw!


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Scouse Git[1]

"CARTAGO DELENDA EST" - Cato the Censor