25-05-2001 12:36									#1
	alien artefacts on water - what do you do? (& use of them) Enter the AD-FREE zone

Well,
Unity Pods can contain alien arftefacts every if they are on water. Unless I got well-producing harbours freighter are quite expensive for gettlin lost most times due to "isle of the depth". But saving an artefact can save *lots* of research time later in the game. So is it worth to "harvest" them by chance with freighters or better so get energy&materials&techs with cheap scoutships?

the second question I got is the use of the artefacts. Sure, later in the game techs are very valuable (due to tech stagnation). But a early-game-tech wich will allow to build a SP may be at highter value; techs can be stolen/researched but SPs are "fix" values and "can never reached again".

	25-05-2001 12:59									#2
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Artifacts are good for techs, especially in the early game, where each tech is of paramount importance.

	25-05-2001 14:32									#3
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In early game, I use Alien Artefacts for rushing SP's, because, by playing transcendent level with its production bonuses to the AI, it is often the only way to grab a SP. In later game, when You can use crawlers, I only use them for techs.
I nearly never use them for prototyping. I can remember only one single time I used one for prototyping, when I needed nerve gas units very urgently against attacking Aliens.

The best units for pod popping on the sea are IOD's. I don't build transports for pod popping, when they find an IOD, they were form food.

	25-05-2001 15:35									#4
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hmm, hadly never lost a SP to AI (playing trancend usual). i was thinking on multi-player strategies...
(by the way: cashing ogers is a *very* good way to spend those useless units; they consist of plenty of material)

IODs are a good idea, will keep them in mind; only problem is i need the "green" economy therefore

	25-05-2001 18:43									#5
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quote: Originally posted by Daniel Senz IODs are a good idea, will keep them in mind; only problem is i need the "green" economy therefore

Under FM, the IOD can be homed to the punishment sphere city to avoid the unhappiness it causes while it's out looking. The drawback under FM is the -30% it will get attacking another IOD and the zero chance of capturing one. Other plusses of using an IOD are fungal movement, and no lost move-point when the pod contains an IOD. They can get out of dodge if you decide not to attack.

Ocean pod-popping is a reason I always put the MCC on my list of Most Valuable SP's. IOD's are more mobile, and escort attack foils have enough morale to survive close encounters.

	25-05-2001 19:32									#6
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when thinking about "green" i ment something like "in order to get them". i al looking for a early & inexpensive way to harvest the pods; if i got harbours with 20+ minerals a turn i cand build special transports too but that was not my position...

	26-05-2001 00:30									#7
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One of the "prizes" from popping a pod is a unity foil -- a transport that moves 2 and can carry 1 (?). I suppose if you build cheap foils of your own for pod popping you may run across on of these and could work with them from there.

	26-05-2001 00:37									#8
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all around though I usually wait to get the IOD's or I just don't sweat them. time can better spent building and attacking then chasing sea pods.

	26-05-2001 00:46									#9
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i hate unity foils. these things can't run from an IoD. at least with a standard transport, you can make sure that you have at least 3 moves before popping the pod, and make sure there's plenty of room to run away should those nasty IoDs surface, and then run towards the sea, opposite the nearest sign of land or human settlements.

	26-05-2001 01:14									#10
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maybe i have to try with a cheap escort vessel to do recon on the one hand (for new pod-positions) and protecting for iod's on the other hand

	26-05-2001 01:42									#11
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Why not just use a transport or an IoD to pop the pod and then move one of your best ships into the same square and designate it primary defender?

	26-05-2001 03:30									#12
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Why not make a 0-3rt (resonance trance)-4 foil? Great on defence against IOD? Gives +25% res defence AND +50% Trance bonus?

	26-05-2001 03:38									#13
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@SMAC Fanatic
The problem is that if turn ends in Fungus i will have to accet that 50% attack bonus for the nativ IOD. and an additive trance unit would be more expensive than a trance-freighter...
have to try those different varienties

@Cybergod
sounds as the answer of a perfectionalist
sure, that way i can keep the transport alife in more cases, even if his turn ands in fungus (and the attacking IOD get the 50% bonus)

but 0-3r,trance are a bit exepnsive (in a pre-IA-world)...

but allover i fear that there is not "ultimate" solution; but i will keep it in mind for exporation tours later in the game

	26-05-2001 04:57									#14
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I am in agreement with Iskander Reza. The unity transports suck and you can't always have a foil around to defend it. And they are slow. So upgrade it. You don't have to slap on your best armor. Any armor will give it that extra movement point.

The idea of having a foil escort to defend your transport ship is a good one though. The free cash or IoD that you can get makes it worthwhile. Unfortunately the only time I seem to consistently do this is when I play the Pirates.

	26-05-2001 17:30									#15
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do you know if the (pirates or assingable) ability to capture ships counts for IODs (and see-serpents) as well?

	26-05-2001 20:17									#16
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The ability to capture ships, Marine Detachment, doesnt apply to IOD's. Of course any of the Green factions have some chance of capturing them as they always have.

You can capture enemy sea formers with marine detachment.

And dont forget that building the transports is not as expensive as you think, due to the many pods that contain credits or free builds. Also the advantages of early contact with other factions.

I like to have at least one ship out popping pods at all times.

Although I usually use plain unarmored trance gun foils or cruisers rather than transports, becuase they have more movement points, so they explore more territory earlier and pop more pods than a transport could. Also when they pop a data pod, you get the tech right away, without having to transport an alien artifact all the way back to a network node.

And they are so cheap I dont care if they get killed by Iods. If they survive a few attacks and build up morale, I bring them home and upgrade them as base defenders.

	26-05-2001 23:51									#17
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maybe i am to long-term-orienated; you are right, the other goodies to get are quite valuable. i am at the stand that artefacts can save tons of energy in mid-game and maybe allow you to get those SPs like the "clouds"...

i am not sure how the percentage of the random events charges when using transports - but the last dozends of games tend me to think that artefacts on sea are times more the case than other things.

due to the "expensivness" of the units i think i have to explain that at the time of starting huge exploring my empire usually not even reached the "critical mass" (about turn 30 or 40); but using transports on far-way-journeys may allow me to take a lonely island (which sometimes reveals at a huge empty continent)

same reason is on cruiser chassis; i just reached flexibility but i am yet far away from doc:init (tech stag or 1/10 of normal tech development)

	01-06-2001 04:39									#18
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I wonder whether popping a sea pod with a non-transport unit results in always getting an IoD on those occasions when an AA would have apppeared if you were using a transport unit or if it is randomized. (I've never gotten a (doomed to drown) AA when I've popped without transport, so I'm assuming that it doesn't happen and that you always get something else.) If the odds of getting the IoD are greatly increased by non-transport popping, it would be worth factoring in, one way or another - depending.

	01-06-2001 10:17									#19
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Any sea pod pop which would have required the transport such as getting a Rover, Ogre or AA; will result in an IoD if you use a foil instead of a transport. This is explicitly stated in one of the more popular SMAC guides.

You can pop an "instabuild" from the sea regardless of what unit you use. IIRC you can get a tech either way too, can someone confirm?

While it is nice that IoD's of your own can transport as well as fight, I have a very poor record of keeping them alive in the early game.

	01-06-2001 14:07									#20
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quote: Originally posted by RedFred Any sea pod pop which would have required the transport such as getting a Rover, Ogre or AA; will result in an IoD if you use a foil instead of a transport. This is explicitly stated in one of the more popular SMAC guides. You can pop an "instabuild" from the sea regardless of what unit you use. IIRC you can get a tech either way too, can someone confirm? While it is nice that IoD's of your own can transport as well as fight, I have a very poor record of keeping them alive in the early game.

This all seems to be true in my experience. And yes you can get a tech from the sea. I seem to only try this in the early game as the Pirates, where it becomes something of an industry. It really helps me get those early SPs. Later I think it is wise to build an armored (can be synthmetal) trance-port. Trance should keep this guy alive most of the time. If you build the SP that gives you +50% psi defense your trance-ports should only fear enemy ships. Even in the mid to late game picking up pods can be very lucrative. At this point you should use a cruiser, hopefully with an advanced reactor. The increased movement and cargo capacity allow these ships to range far and wide. I really hate to make a long trip home before I have cleaned out an area because I can't carry any more AAs. (Well ok I don't hate it, but it's more efficient to continue popping pods if you are halfway around the globe from your bases.)

	01-06-2001 18:09									#21
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Unless I'm using an IoD (or have an IoD or cruiser escort), I'll usually send a transport to base after picking up the first couple of AA's or ogres. Pod-harvesting is rolling the dice, and I'd rather get AA's plugged in than risk losing them to an unlucky IoD pop (esp if by that point the transport is carrying 4-5 AA's, ouch!) I try to have lots of folks wandering around to get the rest of the goodies, so not too much time is lost by sending the successful hunter home.

And I somehow missed the part about AA/rover/ogre seapods always being IoD's when popped by non-transports. That's good to know.