28-04-2000 23:57									#1
	You CAN build canals! Get a bigger avatar today!

On a game I'm still playing there is a large inland sea. About 100 tiles, 14 across.

I had built a city on the cost of the sea, thinking it was ocean. I soon learned the dastardly british were on the other end, and couldn't get a ship into it. My new city had little production, and my cashbox was rather light, but I already had a big navy.

I noticed a one tile lake behind my city on the inland sea. I then noticed that an inlet from the ocean got with one tile, diagonally, of the inland sea. I built a city on that tile, a forest square no less, and poof, breezed a cruiser through city - lake - city and into the inland sea, where it wrought havoc.
The forest square had a railroad as it was connected two cities, so I got 3 shields but only one food. My other worker went in the ocean.

So for 14 turns, my engineer/city/canal produced one science and one gold, and then the city/canal turned back into an engineer. My cruiser had done his duty and left for the open ocean by then.

We often will site a city on an isthmus to make a "Panama Canal" but has anyone else ever linked cities and lakes to make a longer canal system?

What's the biggest inland sea anyone has ever encountered on a computer generated map?

	29-04-2000 02:10									#2
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Scouse Gits comparision game "Spindle" required this procedure.I used 3 small lakes to complete the "canal"

I never seem to get really large inland lakes.Maybe 10-15 squares max

	29-04-2000 02:15									#3
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A favourite naval tactic of ours is to suddenly make an "inland city" subject to naval attack. Sometimes what seems to be an unapproachable AI capital can be given a "coast" by strategically building a city adjacent to a lake.
Suppose the AI city is three squares inland, but on a 1 square "boating lake" you build your city on the square between the coast and the other side of this lake so that the navy can blow away the defenders ignoring such details as city walls (you seriously believe that the AI has built a coastal fortress in such a location?)
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	29-04-2000 03:21									#4
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I once linked 3 lakes together to get to the ocean. It was fantastic! The city that was at the one end was producing my entire sub fleet in the middle of a huge continent.
One sub every turn and then those had to get to the battlefield somehow.

It also saved my empire from destruction. I suddenly lost most of my major coastal town and with them all of my fleet, except for my submarines... 49 subs and 3 cruisers saved my days. I'd never sunk so many ships in a counteroffensive before. Must have been dozens and dozens. Ranging from transport full of tanks and howies down to battleships and fully equiped aircraft carriers.
For my luck my nuclear force was by about 90% sub based...You can probally imagine what happened next.

Yeah, the havoc I wrought...those where the days

	29-04-2000 15:14									#5
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Biggest inland sea?
In one duel with Ariitea,we got really big lake. I cannot remember exact size,but i believe it was about 150 squares big.

	29-04-2000 23:09									#6
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You just realized that? I was building canal cities before I could win on Warlord. I build cities to make canals all the time, even if they don't go anywhere. I guess I'm a bit eccentric. I don't usually get big inland seas, but I usually use one to make a canal across my continent.

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	30-04-2000 04:21									#7
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Not only are canals useful for inland seas, but also to cut a large continent in half and link two large oceans. Or does this just go under the "Panama Canal" thing?

Yeah i thought i had something, but i guess not.

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SandMonkey

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	01-05-2000 22:10									#8
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I built my first "Panama Canal" city in my 2nd game, to send a battleship through on the same turn and surprise two cruisers on the other side.

The fun part this time, besides stringing through a one-tile "pond", was knowing it was a temporary city, and that it would turn back into an engineer when I didn't need the canal anymore.

I had never had an inland lake much more than 10 tiles before,

	23-05-2000 01:20									#9
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I do it all the time on World.mp, you can link the Atlantic to the Caspain sea and to that other small one to form a link from the central Asian desert to the Atlantic!

	23-05-2000 03:09									#10
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How about this: Build a city on the shore, move a dozen of ships into the city, then disband the city and build another one square into the inland, keep on going until your ships move to the other end of the land.

Actually I haven't tried it. So it is quite possible that it will not work.

	23-05-2000 05:09									#11
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Never thought of that one Xin... I'll have to see if that one works. As usual, a different way to look at the game

	23-05-2000 05:38									#12
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How do you guys do this? I tried to get to an inland sea and the game informd me that I can't build cities on adjacent squares.

	23-05-2000 06:27									#13
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Father Beast -

You can't build cities next to each other, as you discovered. You have to build a city next to an ocean square, and on the other side of that ocean square, build another city. I hope that made sense.

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SandMonkey

"Shut up brain or I'll stab you with a qtip"
-Homer Simpson

"Ecky ecky ecky!"
"It's just a flesh wound!"
- Monty Python and the Holy Grail

Check out my 1602 A.D. site

	23-05-2000 13:47									#14
	Enter the AD-FREE zone

In one of my latest games something relly strange happened.
I misread your posts and decided to build a canal with two adjacent cities (yeah, I can't do that, but I only discouvered that at the time ). So I built a city, left there my trireme and went to build the second one. Since it was impossible I rushbuilt a settler in the first city and when it disapeared, there it was my trireme swiming on dry land!!!
So I built the second city, the trireme entered it (so it not only survives on land but actually advances through it into the city!?!) and there it went to the ocean.

As anything like that happened to one of you before?

	23-05-2000 15:24									#15
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Once again Xin you have discovered a new Grand Strategy - now what is the most efficient fashion to create and dissolve cities?
EcoWiz - it seems that you have just verified the strategy proposed by Xin - see the posting above...


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Scouse Git[1]

"CARTAGO DELENDA EST" - Cato the Censor

	23-05-2000 15:26									#16
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Wow - I have just thought - how about a 'Maginot Line' comprised of vet Battleships strung across a contintent?!!


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Scouse Git[1]

"CARTAGO DELENDA EST" - Cato the Censor

	23-05-2000 17:14									#17
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Scouse Gits... Another great insight.

Just think, a line of battle ships that can't be attacked by ground units. That's almost better than a row of fortresses on mountains.
(At least until cruise missiles start flying )

You just have to love all the bugs in the game...

	23-05-2000 18:02									#18
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Ming and SG1 - can grounded ships not be attacked by ground units? Then a trireme would be enough, maybe stacked with a warrior to prevent bribery. Hmmm...

	23-05-2000 19:31									#19
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I just built a couple of cities and disbanded them after fortifying a destroyer in each. I then added a barbarian unit right beside them from the cheat menu.

The barbarian unit was able to attack them (after announcing that the ship was caught in port).

	23-05-2000 19:43									#20
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Tom - thanks for checking that out. As much as people complain about the bugs in Civ, the programmers got it right much more often than not.

	23-05-2000 19:49									#21
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Yeah... they got it right, a ship can be just sitting there in the middle of land

Well, that's good to know that a ship in this situation can be attacked by ground units. Thanks for running the test. I was just picturing this row of ships on land...

	24-05-2000 16:26									#22
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Yes, but. I just trialled an inland BB versus assorted archers et al - it seems to have the same attack - ie they die quickly - and comparable defence - no visible dints after repeated ancient unit assault - despite the 'Ship in port' message - further I tested the city chain - created inland naval vessel, built city next door - moved vessel into city - works!
If someone can quantify the attack & defence poperties of inland naval units that would be good?
I guess we have to add this to the 'cheat list' now before we get to use it in anger - sigh!!


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Scouse Git[1]

"CARTAGO DELENDA EST" - Cato the Censor

	24-05-2000 16:51									#23
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SG1 - grounded ships should attack at full strength. According to the manual, ships "in port" have their firepower reduced to 1, and the attacker's firepower is doubled. So on defense, a BB (battleship) is effectively 12 def, 2 HP, 1 FP, or about 33% better than a mech inf.

Edited for typo.
[This message has been edited by DaveV (edited May 24, 2000).]

	24-05-2000 18:38									#24
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Thanks DaveV - how about this one?
Do 'Vessels in port' benefit from terrain advantages?


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Scouse Git[1]

"CARTAGO DELENDA EST" - Cato the Censor

	24-05-2000 18:58									#25
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SG1 - I don't know what the effects of terrain are, but maybe some ambitious person could take upon himself to run a quick test...