25-05-2000 08:08									#1
	The First Space Odyssey Challenge Support Apolyton, buy Alpha Centauri

I read Adam Smith's 1001: A Space Odyssey Challenge thread and decided I likedd the idea so I put together a quick scenario that we can all try out.

Sticking (mostly) to AS' guidelines, this is a small (almost, it's 50x60) map with normal sized, varied continents. Also, 3 billion, wet, temperate. There is a good start for the suggested Civ, and no civ gets less than 2 specials at their starting location.

I will start this map tonight and let you all know how I do. If anyone want to try this challenge you can download it here. Play as the Sioux.

edit: After talking with other players I found that the above scenario WILL NOT WORK with Civ II 2.42, it only works with Fantastic Worlds. If you have 2.42 please do not download.

edit: This is the SOC games everyone should use, Adam Smith's SOC1 save game file.

You can also download the same file in zip format.

John-SJ


<font size=1 face=Arial color=444444>[This message has been edited by John-SJ (edited May 27, 2000).]</font>
[This message has been edited by John-SJ (edited June 07, 2000).]

	26-05-2000 06:49									#2
	Browse Apolyton AD-FREE

John:
Thanks for pulling it together.
Anybody interested?
Propose we use this thread for logs, etc., other thread for strategy, rules??

	26-05-2000 15:00									#3
	Support Apolyton buy from Amazon

Question: just to be clear, are there any rules at all in this challenge?

	26-05-2000 15:02									#4
	Inflate your Upload Space

Hmm, can't download it... dead link.

	26-05-2000 15:34									#5
	Enter the AD-FREE zone

The link works for me.

	26-05-2000 17:49									#6
	Support Apolyton, buy Alpha Centauri

I had to try a couple of times before I could download it, so keep trying Graag.

	26-05-2000 18:17									#8
	Browse Apolyton AD-FREE

I was able to download it, but I can't play it (civ says it is not a scenario file when it tries to load it).

Did you create this with MGE? I'm using v242, which will not read MGE scenarios. Most OCCers will be in the same boat. Any chance you (or someone else) could rebuild the scenario in v242?

	26-05-2000 18:42									#9
	Remove this text

Tom,

That is strange. I have Civ2 and FW, not MGE. I used only the cheat menu in creating the scenario.

Hmmm, I'm not very knowledgable about the ins and outs of scenario creation, anyone have any ideas why this won't work for some?

John-SJ

	26-05-2000 19:12									#10
	Put an end to popups!

I think that if you have FW it will not be downward compatible with 2.42.

	26-05-2000 19:20									#11
	Support Apolyton, buy Civilization III: Complete

Same problems here as Tom. Oh well.

	26-05-2000 19:39									#12
	Avatar Enlargement: We've got the solution

Yeah, Fantastic Worlds is v278 or something, and is not compatible with v242.

	27-05-2000 09:42									#13
	Increase the size of your Attachments

Yikes!

Sorry about that guys!

I'm at work right now, I won't be able to correct this 'til this evening.

Actually, now that I think about it, there's no easy way to make this scenario compatible without starting over from the map file (if that even works), so maybe now is the time for Adam Smith to submit his. Adam, ready?

John-SJ

	27-05-2000 07:30									#14
	Support Apolyton, buy Civilization: The Boardgame

I've got the file, and its in 2.42, but I dont have a web site. Does anybody have a site I could post it on? If you do, send me an e-mail (the address in my profile is good), and I suppose I could send the file back as an attachment. Or is there a better way to send/post it?

Adam Smith
Technically Challenged

	27-05-2000 07:47									#15
	Remove this text

Adam,

I can post it, just send it to me in e-mail. Use the link above or in my profile.

John-SJ

	27-05-2000 22:18									#16
	Avatar Enlargement: We've got the solution

John:
I just sent the file. Post here or e-mail me if you have any problems with it. Thanks for the help. This should be fun.

	27-05-2000 22:22									#17
	Support Apolyton, buy Galactic Civilizations: Deluxe Edition

maybe we should use 1 map for this challenge,OCC and BC bloodlust.

	27-05-2000 22:30									#18
	Support Apolyton, buy Civilization III: Complete

And here it is...

Adam Smith's SOC1 save game file.

edit: I just test d/l'ed this file. When I did it saved it as soc14000.sav..sav. If this happens just rename to soc14000.sav.
John-SJ

[This message has been edited by John-SJ (edited May 27, 2000).]

	28-05-2000 15:50									#19
	Support Apolyton, buy Civilization 2

That was bizarre. I started downloading the file and Windows came up and asked me if I wanted to install Flash 4.

Just a coincidence - the add at the top of the web page must have been Flash.

Anyways, the saved game works. Thanks!

	03-06-2000 23:41									#20
	Support Apolyton or Terrorists Win

Downloaded it without problems.

So, this is fastest to AC any way but OCC? Two cities are ok, fourty cities are ok?

Carolus

	03-06-2000 23:45									#21
	Support Apolyton, buy GURPS/ Alpha Centauri

As far as I understand it's just fastest to AC. I don't think there is any rule that says you couldn't do it as OCC if you think that will get you to AC fastest. But please correct me if I'm wrong.

	04-06-2000 07:04									#22
	Support Apolyton buy from Amazon

The idea is first to AC with however many cities you want.

	04-06-2000 12:42									#23
	Tired of ads?

play as...Rome?

	04-06-2000 20:08									#24
	Support Apolyton buy from Amazon

Yes, play as the Romans (white)

	05-06-2000 09:48									#25
	Increase Your PM Length

I have been getting better landing dates with OCC than with regular games lately, so I decided to play it with only one city. This has the added advantage that I can actually finish the game in a not too long time. Anyway, I landed in 1779. I would like to see how much earlier other people can land with more cities.

	05-06-2000 08:10									#26
	Put an end to popups!

It may be that occ is faster. I built a civ of about 12 cities, and landed in 1901. I had some bad luck early with huts(no units) and barbs. The main problem was that I had to research EVERYTHING. I suspect that with a smaller civ, I could have traded for more techs early and saved lots of turns. I was at 3 turns per advance for a long time.

	05-06-2000 08:30									#27
	Full PM-box? Change here!

I was at two turns per tech most of the time after University and one turn per tech for the short period from Computers to Advanced Flight (after Flight cancelled Colossus the Caravan bonus helped with that).

	07-06-2000 13:04									#28
	Inflate your Upload Space

I also went OCC and in my usual mistake filled manner was "only" able to land in 1803.I didn't improve my land correctly which forced me to deviate from normal tech path or I could have saved many turns.

Here is a semi complete log

3950-hut-horseman-hut 50 gold
3900-hut-horseman
3800-hut-chariot-Rome(2 gold,iron and?)
3700-hut-chariot-supported
3650-Bronze Working
3600-warrior-start Collosus
3550-disband warrior
3450-hut-Horseback Riding
3400-contact Babs-trade Horseback for Alphabet-peace
3250-hut-horseman-NON-contact Spanish-trade Horseback for Burial-gift Alpha-alliance
3050-grass river>silk
3000-hut-Warrior Code
2950-hut 50 gold
2900-hut-Code of Laws!
2750-contact Vikings-gift Alpha and Warrior Code-peace-hut-barb horse(disappears next turn)
2600-barb leader 150 gold
2550-gift Horseback and Laws to Vikes-Laws to Babs-Warrior and Laws to Spanish
2350-Monarchy-revolt-trade Babs Burial for Writing-trade Vikes Writing for Currency-trade Spanish Monarchy for Pottery-gift Writing-receive 50 gold-hut 50 gold-hut archer-NON
2300-tribute-Babs 50-Vikes 25
2250-govt.-Monarchy
2200-Collosus-Pottery to Vikes and Babs-Currency to Spain-receive 50
2100-Monarchy to Babs and Vikes
1950-hut-Trade!-trade Babs Trade for Masonary-gift Warrior and Currency-alliance-Trade to Vikes-Trade Spanish Trade for Myst
1900-Spanish gift 50
1850-library-gift Mason and Myst to Vikes-tribute 50
1800-hut 25 gold
1600-gold caravan-Babs cancel alliance-3 units returned home-disband supported chariot
1550-Spain gifts 50
1500-Construction-trade to Spanish for Map Making-share maps-gfit Map to babs and Vikes
1450-hides caravan
1350-gift Construction to Vikes and Babs
1150-dye caravan-share maps with Spanish
1100-Spain gifts 50-share maps with Spanish
1000-gold arrives in Babylon 54 bonus
975-Literacy-market-barb leader 150-
925-temple-Spain gifts 50-tribute-Babs 75-Vikes 100
900-hides arrives in Babylon 56 bonus
875-contact England-gift Construct,Writing and Trade-alliance-share maps-receive 100 gold-share maps with Spanish and Babs
800-Philosophy-The Republic-revolt
750-Spain gifts 50
725-govt-Republic
700-colliseum-start “we love” size 3-dye arrives in Babylon 70 bonus
675-contact China-still at war as per Babs request eons ago-remain at war-gift Republic to Babs,English and Spanish-gift Phil,Lit and Repub to Vikes-alliance-share maps-receive Iron Working
625-Iron and Phil to Babs-Phil and Lit to Spain-receive 50-6 techs to England-receive 50
550-aquaduct
500-caravan-disband horseman
475-Mathematics-caravan-end “we love” size 12-more beakers at 10% lux so I keep colliseum for now
425-caravan
400-alliance with Babs-receive 100-Spain gifts 50
375-caravan-gift Math to Spain,Vikes,England and Babs
325-Astronomy-caravan
300-Cope’s-non sheild river>forest
250-Medicine-caravan
225-gift Astronomy to Vikes-receive 100-Astronomy to Spain-receive 150-Astronomy to England who then cancel alliance
200-caravan-gift Astronomy to Babs
175-The Wheel-caravan-Babs gift 25-share maps with Spain
125-caravan-gift Wheel to Babs,Vikes and Spain-England declares war
100-Engineering-Babs gift 25-Spain 100
75-caravan-sell colliseum-4 techs to China-ceasefire
50-Shake’s-sell temple
25-Sanitation-trade China Republic for Seafaring-gift Sanitation-peace-trade Babs Seafaring for University-gift Sanitation-receive 25-Seafaring to Spain-8 techs to China-share maps
-----------------
AD1-start “we love” size 12-hut-legion-NON
20-sewer-Babs gift 100-Spain 150-gift engineering to Babs-receive 100-trade Spanish Engineering for Feudalism-gift Engineering to Vikes and China
80-Banking-build university-more gifting to all cept England(war)
120-caravan-end “we love” 17
140-Gravity
160-caravan-disband chariot
180-caravan
200-Invention-forest>plains
220-caravan-gfit Invention to all cept Vikes who cancel alliance-receive 100 from Babs,50 from Spain-ceasefire with England
260-Democracy-revolt-caravan-disband horseman
280-caravan
300- govt-Democracy-caravan-tech gifting-Vikes and England declare war
320-caravan-Medicine to Babs-receive 50
340-Sir Ike’s-gift Wheel to England-ceasefire
380-Gunpowder-trade Babs GP for Bridge Building-receive 50-GP to China and Spain-Spain gifts 50-England declares war
400-bank
420-Chemistry-Spain gifts 100
460-Explosives
480-stock exchange-Explosives to Babs-receive 50-Explosives to Spain
500-Metallurgy-start “we love” 17-tech gifting until 2 turns-ceasefire with England
520-engineer
540-Navigation -
580-engineer-lost my 2 turns due computer reassigning workers to food squares-end “we love” 17-more tech gifting-Babs gift 50-Spain 100
600-Physics
620-diplomat
640-Magnetism
660-coal caravan
680-Electricity-Physics and Magnet to Babs-Physics to Spain-Physics,Magnet and Metallurgy to China
720-Refrigeration-caravan-bribe 2 barb knights-82 a piece-disband 1-England declares war
740-disband knight-peace with England-gift Physics and Engineering-share maps
760-Steam Engine-supermarket-Babs gift 50-Spain 100
800-Railroad-caravan
840-Industrialization-caravan
880-The Corporation-caravan-more tech gifting-Spain gifts 50-Vikes declare wart
900-bribe barb knight 82-coal to Babylon 69 bonus-much tech gifting cept RR of course
920-Steel
940-freight-disband knight
960-Refining-freight-start “we love” 17
1000-Combustion-freight-Spain gifts 150
1020-Darwin’s-Automobile-Mass Production-gift RR to all
1040-Mass Production to all-Combustion to Spain-Babs gift 50
1060-Electronics-Babs gift 50-Spain 50
1080-end “we love” 22-sell sewer
1100-Conscription-sell aquaduct
1120-superhighway
1140-Chivalry
1160-freight-bribe barb crusader-82-barb leader 150
1180-Leadership
1200-freight-disband crusader
1220-Tactics-freight
1260-Machine Tools-freight-bribr barb crusader 82
1300-Miniaturization
1340-Computers
1360-research lab
1380-Mobile Warfare
1400-freight-disband crusader
1420-Robotics-freight
1460-Atomic Theory
1480-freight
1500-Nuclear Fission
1510-freight
1520-Nuclear Power
1530-oil freight
1540-The Laser
1550-factory
1560-Flight
1570-nuclear plant
1580-Radio
1590-manufacturing plant
1600-Advanced Flight
1620-Rocketry-Chinese declare war-oil to Babylon-116 bonus
1640-Space Flight
1660-Plastics
1764-Fusion Power
1788-15-3-3-1-1-1-launch-been at war with all civs for awhile
various units and city defenses
1803-Arrival AC

	07-06-2000 17:25									#29
	Support Apolyton, buy Civilization 2

OK, I'll give this a try today. I think I'll try with ~4 cities. The extra 3 cities will build mostly caravans, to help speed up the building of wonders. I should be able to launch a spaceship in half a dozen turns too. Hopefully the game won't take too much longer than regular OCC (I shudder to think how long it would take with 20 cities).

	07-06-2000 17:44									#30
	Increase Your PM Length

Can some one e-mail me a copy of the scenario, cause i can't seem to get the save game from the link working?!?! it totally crashes my Civ2, and gives me a funny window with an error code!!!! Cheers

Thinking about the strategy, the best thing to do would be to start one city occ style, and with a second settler (assuming you get one!??) start spreading, maybe founding 6/7 new cities!!! surely this would help a great deal, but make sure that one of your cities follows the occ wonder route from the out set?!?! just me thinking allowed...