11-06-2001 06:48									#1
	Expelling Enemy Units Suffering from ads?

I give up. I haven't found where the procedure and requirements for the expelling of enemy units. I just refound CTP and thought I'd give it a retry. I now remember the frustration dealing with this issue. Please respond to my e-mail: tsharp@kconline.com

	11-06-2001 18:53									#2
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Have you tryed talking with the enemy's leader yet?
You can force him to expell his units from your territory.

	11-06-2001 19:19									#3
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quote: Originally posted by Juggler Have you tryed talking with the enemy's leader yet? You can force him to expell his units from your territory.

Well it seems like that's not what the AI is doing to me. I may or may not acquiese in removing the troops. But Boom the troops are expelled. Have you seen that? I guess I just don't know how the "BOOT" unit action icon works on the units screen from city view. Any clues?

	11-06-2001 21:24									#4
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Perhaps you were allied with him and then you canceled the alliance- in that case all of your units are automatically returned to their bases.

	11-06-2001 22:42									#5
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I don't think so. Tell me what does the "BOOT" icon do under the "Units" tab in the City screen? It says "Expel Unit" I assume that means an adjacent or near enemy unit.

	11-06-2001 23:41									#6
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Try reposting this problem in the CtP forum - there is no 'boot' button in Civ2 ...

	12-06-2001 06:45									#7
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A yes. Thanks for getting the correct problem. I thought I was in CTP.

	12-06-2001 16:57									#8
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quote: Originally posted by Juggler Have you tryed talking with the enemy's leader yet? You can force him to expell his units from your territory.

Ok how do you do this?

	12-06-2001 17:29									#9
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F3 (Foreign Advisor) - select nation - send embassy
if the nation is not allied (or at war) with you one of the options is "Request that you withdraw your troops"

	12-06-2001 17:34									#10
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[QUOTE] Originally posted by Scouse Gits
F3 (Foreign Advisor) - select nation - send embassy
if the nation is not allied (or at war) with you one of the options is "Request that you withdraw your troops" [/QUOTE





Thanks
I will play with that tonight

	12-06-2001 20:51									#11
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Option won't appear unless the nation has a peace treaty with you. Under all other conditions, no option for human player. The AI gives you that "greedy eyes" quote and threatens dire consequences, but you have no corresponding capability. Note that owning first the Great Wall and then the United Nations will force the AI to make peace, creating that option. In the later game, if your government is not representative, asking for tribute often creates the same effect as the AI withdraws its troops rather than actually tributing. Requests for withdrawals can also precipitate war, so be prepared for that when confronting the AI.

	12-06-2001 21:23									#12
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Ok now, let me see if i got this:
I need to make a peace tready
then I can see this. I usually donot make peace so
that may be why I did not notice this.
SO once you make peace with a nation
does this option stay for the rest of the game?
Is there anything else I need to get the forien embassy

	14-06-2001 20:07									#13
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jake

The attitude of the A1 civs towards you changes over time depending on how you stand on the powergraph. If you are doing poorly (low population) they will be reasonably friendly (2.42 version anyway), if you are Supreme they will dislike you. After 1750 if you are Supreme they will all hate you.

This affects peace treaties in two ways. If they dislike or hate you they will very readily break a peace treaty - by making a sneak attack. Secondly it is the experience of many that peace treaties can just wither away for no very clear reason.

One way or the other don't expect to have the "remove your troops" option offered too often.

Also a point comes where it disappears even for those with whom a peace treaty remains firmly in place.

And it is not only the A1's actions which bring peace treaties to an end. You too can sneak attack. You also lose a peace treaty by stealing tech or by bribing a city at ordinary prices (you can sometimes subvert it for twice the price which avoids this effect). Oddly enough bribing units does not affect your relations.

There is a flip side. The A1 get the chance to ask you to remove your troops. I must say I find it irritating when I have a good fortress blocking incursions through territory shared by one of my cities and an A1 city to be regularly asked to remove my troops. You can get a bit of cover by having a dip or caravan occupy the fort but that's not real secure. Further there is a small glitch whereby sometimes when you agree to remove troops you find that some other troops occupying forts or choke points in quite a different civ's territory have been moved as well as the ones sitting in the territory of the civ with whom you have the peace treaty. Verey annoying.

You have to watch boats. With troops it is just those within the area of A1 cities that get moved. But with boats there seems to be a SMAC like division of territory. Bloody annoying when a boatload of prime caravans about to reach a trading partner's city suddenly get dumped right back home again!!

Your standing with each civ is shown in the diplomacy screen and if you have an embassies or Marco Polo's/UN then you can also see how all the other civs stand one to the other by calling up the diplomacy screen and looking at the information given for each civ. It appears under the name of the civ and its leader. Where only one or two civs are recorded there it means that civ has not yet made contact with the others.

You can pull off some good stunts using diplomacy although this is an area where Civ3 is expected to be a lot more sophisticated.

PS A tip. I find that if I am powerful militarily they don't ask me to remove my troops much. Presumably they do not want to open the way to a refusal which precipitates war. I even suspect that their programming tells them (crudely no doubt) if you are militarily powerful in their neighbourhood (rather than just overall).

	14-06-2001 20:22									#14
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Tanks East street,

This is very helpful, I was up very late training on this with Chanute, he was not very receptive.

Jake

	14-06-2001 20:30									#15
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EST & Jake -- I think that your advice about units aboard ships only comes into effect when you or the AI cancels an Alliance - at this point every one of your units (inclucing non-military units) that are nearer to any AI city than to one of your own gets an air ticket home - this can be used constructively but is normally a right royal pain the rear. ' Troops withdrawn for violating the territory of x' only includes military units - ie caravans & diplos are not airlifted ...

	15-06-2001 02:06									#16
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SG is correct, as usual; boats only go home at alliance-ending time. However, EST is right about land units intruding on other civ's territory also being removed. Thus, if the Egyptians object and you withdraw, troops in Persian and Indian territory also withdraw (provided you are not at war with them), and some of those states move after the request. There goes your bottleneck, irrespective of the fact that it wasn't that civ that asked you to move. On occasion, I've had troops next to cities of civs I was at war with get moved to friendly cities. Quelle irritating! This is clearly a glitch. (First time it happened, I thought the troops had disappeared -- the program left two entrenched infantry but removed two artillery an two cavalry. ACK! However, as the move progressed, up they popped -- on an ISLAND about 5 squares away. Cost me 4 moves to recover from that.)

	21-06-2001 13:57									#17
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It's very nice that "withdraw troops" statement, but it's just annoying it doesn't work (barely) for human players.
How many times haven't you had the message "We have no time for your enless chattering" when you send a diplo to ask to withdraw some troops, while you get it sometimes each and every folowing turn(just a popupscreen with the options :withdraw or declare war).
btw if one of your units occupies a terainsquare one of the AI cities also occupies,it always belongs to the AI ,for military reasons.

shade