28-06-2001 05:54									#1
	How about a leader unit Full PM-box? Change here!

I suggested this eons ago in the first list. A lot of old board games had capture the capital, kill the leader victory conditions. Kind of fun to have a figure you have to protect. Maybe he could establish cities too like a settler and do other stuff, like heighten military performance, stop disorder by visiting a city or improve producivity etc. etc.

Imagine if you had to put your leader (i.e. you!) on a ship and flee your capital in a hostile sea. Fun, Fun, fun. Could be a customisable figure so you really feel your in the game.

If they can do generals they can do leaders. How about it Firaxis?

	28-06-2001 06:31									#2
	We have that... Support Apolyton, buy GURPS/ Alpha Centauri

And it's pretty much exactly as you describe. All players start the game with a single Leader (which is considered the Primary Leader and represents the player's alter ego). More can be obtained during the course of the game.

Leaders in our game can learn skills, which include the sorts of things you've listed (scouting, increased production, better combat, better espionage, etc.). The Primary Leader can also establish cities, sort of like our settler unit (with some restrictions).

One of our winning condition possibilities is to kill all the other Primary Leaders. Another neat thing we are planning (but which hasn't yet been implemented) is Leader capturing, leading to ransoming, prisoner trade, and so on.

There are all kinds of interesting things you can do with Leaders, and it's one of my favorite systems in our game. So anyway, if Firaxis doesn't have 'em, at least we will

Ron

	28-06-2001 06:56									#3
	Interesting Support Apolyton

Haven't seen your game. I'd like to have a look. I'll try the link.

	28-06-2001 07:47									#4
	Suffering from ads?

Hey,
The game I'm designing at the moment has a similar thing... but with a few nice ideas. Not that I want to give them all away but here's one: If your government is Dictatorship it allows you to build "Imitators" which look like "Primary Leader" unit, only its impossible for the other players to know if its the legit one or not. Nice little addon....

Just started serious design phase, will begin coding in a month or so...

	28-06-2001 08:01									#5
	Support Apolyton, buy GURPS/ Alpha Centauri

RonHiler...

Just checked out your site... what language are you doing it in?

And not that I want to slag it down but I HATE Windows looking games, and that would be enough for me not to buy it. Even just changing it from the boring old gray would help some...

Spherical world very cool... tried to work on that, but as yet haven't come up with it myself... Anyone seen Power Monger? It's old but has a hell good 3D terrain system...

	28-06-2001 09:10									#6
	Full PM-box? Change here!

quote: Originally posted by Krippled what language are you doing it in?

C++

quote: And not that I want to slag it down but I HATE Windows looking games, and that would be enough for me not to buy it. Even just changing it from the boring old gray would help some...

The screenshots are a bit out of date (already!). We've since skinned the front screen with a texture to remove some of the Windows-look, and will eventually do all of them the same way. We're going to do more to get rid of the generic look, but it's not a high priority yet. I'm more interested in getting everything functional first

quote: Spherical world very cool... tried to work on that, but as yet haven't come up with it myself

Thanks. That spherical world was by far our most difficult task, at least so far.

Good luck with your game. Let me know how it goes

Ron

	28-06-2001 10:48									#7
	Support Apolyton buy from Amazon

Stop spamming Horse. You got your deity status so no more pointless ideas are necessary. One of the basic premise of Civ is that you are the invisible guiding force behind a civilisation, not some mortal who can be chased down and wasted. No mortal lasts for thousands of years for crying out loud.

Of course, other games have different premises

	28-06-2001 22:07									#8
	Enter the AD-FREE zone

Actually I've kinda done the leader thing once in CivII.

It was my first time trying Deity level and the game started me out on a small island. Developing my civ was tough and the AIs advanced way beyond me. They all hated me and it wasn't long before they all teamed up trying to wipe me out.

I was almost defeated when I had one last idea. I built a settler and a boat and left sailing north. I made it to a small penninsula sticking down from the poles and settled a city on the tundra. By then the AIs had wiped out the rest of my civ and so I was left with this one lonely city hidding from them way up north.

So it was kinda like I had a leader unit who flead the capital for exile in the icy north.

Joe.

	28-06-2001 23:18									#9
	Help yourself to an AD-FREE life

Ron, is that game that youve been makeing complete? By the way your makeing it sound it is not, but on your site you can dl what looks like to be the game.

	29-06-2001 06:54									#10
	Help yourself to an AD-FREE life

No, we're not complete. We're in Alpha, which is to say, the game is playable in a basic mode, but a lot of the features that will make it fun are still missing. So the download is of a working but still incomplete game. This is different from what you might be used to, where only the final version of a game is released. We release our Alpha's to garner feedback and bug reports from the fans. There have been test games with multiple people played which have lasted a dozen or two dozen turns, but they were played more for bug-hunting purposes than any real attempt to have fun This is a good thing, for I have gotten many bug reports that I wouldn't otherwise have known about yet.

As a quick summary, here is what is working:
You can design a custom race. You can enter this race in a multiplayer game. You get your primary leader and a few starting units in one stack. You can move stack(s) around the planet. You can found cities. You can collect resources with those cities. You can design new units (unlike Civ, we have a unit workshop where you can customize your unit desings). You can build new units in your cities (and either leave them there or send them out in a new stack). You can do research to discover new unit templates, unit components (both for the unit workshop), new resource types, and new Leader skills. You can aquire new leaders. You can send messages to other players via the mail screen. New turns can be generated by the host.

What isn't yet working:
Combat. City occupation and annexing. City improvements and upgrading. Espionage/Loyalists. Trade. Formal diplomacy. Player Borders. Structures and World improvements (roads, bridges, dams, etc.). Training leaders with new skills. Computer Player AI. Single Player Mode. Lots of graphics still to put in

The thing that really limits the fun of the game at this point is the lack of combat. Without any way to attack your neighbors and take their cities, there is no tension between the players. This is why the combat and occupation/annexation systems are a very high priority to get working right now We're also finishing up the leader training code, so you can give your leaders new skills.

Ron