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Defiant
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WISCONSIN
Aug 1999
time: 05:14
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Once Vicksburg fell and the Gettysburg battle occurred, it didn't matter what Grant had of whose, it was all over with, it was just a matter of time and who would get the clean up job.
Sherman's annhilation of Georgia and to the ocean was only the deathblow but the fatal injuries were sustained at Gettysburg and Vicksburg.
I just looked it up and here is a bit of a coincidence, Gettysburg battle started July 2nd 1863 and ended July 4th, Vicksburg started March 29th and ended July 4th, 1863. Vicksburg residents would not celebrate the fourth for years following. But the point being, these two battles were the critical impact of losing the war, IMO.
Last edited by Defiant on 13-07-2001 at 02:02
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Defiant
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WISCONSIN
Aug 1999
time: 05:14
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Ruff,
I think the North would have won regardless of Vicksburg, no doubt Vicksburg was extremely critical to the win but moreso in the quickness of the win. The stranglehold was on the south, supplies to run the southern war effort were running out, people were starving in the south, afterall that is what brought Vicksburg to her knees, a sieze not a military defeat per say. When they came to Gettysburg it was for shoes, just not enough supplies to maintain a war effort much longer than it did.
The north had the industrial edge on the south, the south had the better Generals but in the end evens great Generals can't fight if they start to run out of the food, clothing, weapons and such to stage a war effort.
If the southern generals were fighting for the north with the supplies they had it would have been an extremely quick war.
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hacksaw
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Ruff,
Huh, I always thought that it was Gettysburg, O well, You learn somthing new everyday. I think vicksburg is always over rated. The Blockade did more to hurt the south than Vicksburg. Sure it was harder to cross the Missippi, but ways could be found. Quick quiz, what state in the south was able to hold off the north for the longest. My vote is texas. Its huge size, bad climate, and limited population reduced its desirability ( sp ) to the north. Plus any attack of the north was repelled. They may have taken a city, but they would edventually be driven back out. It is through texas that some supplies reached the south via Mexico and It was able to defend itself well enough to send troops far east to help the fight there.
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His Divine Shadow
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Side 3, Archduchy of Zeon
Feb 2001
time: 23:14
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quote:
Originally posted by hacksaw
Ruff,
Huh, I always thought that it was Gettysburg, O well, You learn somthing new everyday. I think vicksburg is always over rated. The Blockade did more to hurt the south than Vicksburg. Sure it was harder to cross the Missippi, but ways could be found. Quick quiz, what state in the south was able to hold off the north for the longest. My vote is texas. Its huge size, bad climate, and limited population reduced its desirability ( sp ) to the north. Plus any attack of the north was repelled. They may have taken a city, but they would edventually be driven back out. It is through texas that some supplies reached the south via Mexico and It was able to defend itself well enough to send troops far east to help the fight there. |
Except for the fact that Texas was a divided state socially during the war. The Germans who'd settled the hill country in central Texas opposed the state's entrance into the Confederacy and it's continued use of slaves, nor would they mobilize to defend the South in the end. At best, you'd be dealing with a LOT of "conscientious objectors". At worst, you would've had a horde of Scando-Germanic guerilla partisans running rampant over Confederate supply lines while they were trying to hold the massive Federal army at bay.
The problem the Federals would've had was differentiating between Confederate Texan and Noncompliant Texan, and like it or not, those same Scando-Germanic hordes would not have taken kindly to a bunch of scalawags in blue stomping all over their land and busting up their good time. So there might've been some trouble there, too. The Germanics down there tend to get a touch ornery and territorial, even today.
It was this socio-political division that enabled Texas to weather the post-war "punishments" with ease and with its rights intact, rights which are still current today. It is also this division that allows Texans to tolerate a post-Nolan Ryan Texas Rangers baseball team without having to commit ritual suicide in shame.
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12-07-2001 19:56
Domination comes before all! No heresy! Domination Domination Domination! 
Back in my day there weren't any vacations until your game was done. yadda yadda yadda blah blah blah 
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