26-07-2001 19:42									#1
	Counterespionage -- Need Help Support Apolyton, buy Galactic Civilizations

How best to deal with a Spy whom I just caught coming out of one of my cities after he stole an Advance?

I have Peace Treaties and Trade Pacts with all the other civs. According to my Diplomatic Adviser, they all "love" me and are impressed by the wonders I have built (Statue of Liberty, etc.) My goal is the Science Victory pure and simple, so I don't want to waste time, money, and resources going to war against any civ. I have enough territory (34 cities) already (it's in the late 1880s) to be able to place the obelisks correctly to cover at least 60% of the map. I'm way ahead of all the other civs in all respects. It's only my second game of CTP2, so I'm just playing it to learn the ropes, so to speak.

Now, if I kill the Native American Spy, I will break my Peace Treaty with that civ, won't I? I want to avoid that, if possible. In this game, I'm trying to see whether I can reach my goal without having to declare war against any civ. Also, I've just created three new cities on an island immediately adjacent to the main Native American territory, so I prefer not to provoke them at the moment -- at least, not until I build up some military protection in those three cities.

To complicate matters, many turns ago the Native Americans agreed not to trespass on my territory. Obviously, they have violated that agreement with this spy. I have protested -- angrily -- their current violation of my territory and demanded that they remove him. Although they agreed, I am wondering what to do if they don't remove their spy.

So, is there anything I can do, short of killing the spy and provoking war, in order to stop the spy from continuing to wander through my territory?

Thanks!

	26-07-2001 21:09									#2
	Support Apolyton, buy Civilization: The Boardgame

Special units (i.e., the invisible or non-combat ones) can be expelled. Move a regular military units next to the Spy, click on the 'Units' tab, select the Boot icon, point the cursor at the Spy, and click. (The expelling unit needs to have at least one movement point remaining, I believe, although this doesn't appear to use up any movement points.)

Expelling a unit might cause a very slight (& temporary) drop in the other civilization's regard for you, but it is not an act of war.

BTW, expect a return visit. Spying is just one of the things that civs do -- even to an ally. Build your own Spies & Diplomats to defend against it.

	26-07-2001 21:41									#3
	Support Apolyton, buy Galactic Civilizations: Deluxe Edition

Yeah spies can be used for Counterespionage. If you know where is a hostile spy you can kick him out with a regular unit. You don't need to protect your borders with spies it is enough if you protect each of your cities with one spy. And if you aren't on the same continent with the Native Americans the spy should need a little bit of time to revisit you. And note the other civs want your techs.

-Martin

	26-07-2001 22:56									#4
	The Progresses. Remove this text

I think like this, to avoid that type of things.
I try to share the times with the people that I have been treating of peace or some pact.
The Progresses, not so expensive or not necessary, of the for sharing easily.

	27-07-2001 01:06									#5
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quote: Originally posted by uh Clem Special units (i.e., the invisible or non-combat ones) can be expelled. Move a regular military units next to the Spy, click on the 'Units' tab, select the Boot icon, point the cursor at the Spy, and click. (The expelling unit needs to have at least one movement point remaining, I believe, although this doesn't appear to use up any movement points.)

Thanks, uh Clem (and Martin and Bra) for your answers! Knowing that I can Boot a spy out really helps. I'll use that method in the future.

What I eventually did in this game was to kill off the spy, since at that time I didn't know about Booting. At first, in order to avoid killing him, I tried to block his entry into a city by placing two military units diagonally next to each other next to the city and directly in front of the spy, but he was able to squeeze between them and enter the city! I guess spies are not limited by ZOC. So I reloaded the game to the previous turn and whacked him off with a musketeer. Naturally, the Native Americans immediately declared war, claiming that it was my civ that was at fault for having broken the peace treaty So I had my military advisor change my civ's military stance from Peace to War and began beefing up all my cities with Riflemen and Secret Agents (the MM2 mod's new "Spy" unit). In any case, that all proved unnecessary, for the Native Americans asked for a Cease Fire about 10 turns later.

And then they had the audacity, after having stolen two of my techs, to ask for another one! Naturally, I refused. Let 'em eat cake.

	27-07-2001 05:51									#6
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In the Med Pack 2,can't Spies also sue trade and special units(including other spies)??????

	27-07-2001 12:42									#7
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quote: Originally posted by Gazablanca In the Med Pack 2,can't Spies also sue trade and special units(including other spies)??????

Yep!

Much better than kicking them out, especially when they come from a civ next to your borders, 'cause it gets quite annoying when they come back each turn.

	28-07-2001 01:32									#8
	Suing Enemy Spies, etc. -- ?? Support Apolyton or Terrorists Win

quote: Originally posted by Der PH Yep! Much better than kicking them out, especially when they come from a civ next to your borders, 'cause it gets quite annoying when they come back each turn.

This is good to know! However, as I am now playing only my third game of CTP (7/18 update to MM2), I have had no experience with suing. The information that WES gives in his MM2 Main ReadMe file (under "Unconventional Units") about Spies now having the ability to sue assumes that all of us players know everything that the act of suing entails, but -- newbie me -- I don't.

So, could you help me out? The CTP2 Game Manual does not say much about what suing does, except to destroy units (or I couldn't find it, anyway).

Two questions:

1. Does the act of Suing ever fail? If so, what is the Success Rate for a Spy? For a Secret Agent?

2. Do I have to pay money in order to sue? In other words, are there any "negative" consequences that may happen as a result of attempting to sue?

	28-07-2001 08:25									#9
	Full PM-box? Change here!

Sue has 100% of chance of working, but it costs 500 gold.

If you have a question about unit orders go to the grat library there is a screen just to it (the one before the last).