06-08-2001 22:35									#1
	This time, it's Persia-poll! Browse Apolyton AD-FREE

What about Persia? Are they in? Who will lead them?

	06-08-2001 22:42									#2
	Re: This time, it's Persia-poll! Remove this text

quote: Originally posted by Alexander01 Who will lead them?

Certainly not me. And probably not you because they're probably not in. There are very few slots left and Persia always seems to fall into the background. See the "civs included" thread for details.

Too many polls

	06-08-2001 22:48									#3
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Hey, there are thousands of people in this forum, so there's always someone to vote. If you're not interested, you don't have to express your opinion.

But somehow, I think Persia has a much better chance of getting in than even Babylon has.

Here's the list, in case you weren't paying attention...

1. Americans
2. Chinese
3. English
4. French
5. Greeks
6. Egyptians
7. Iroquois
8. Indians
9. Japanese
10. Zulus
11. Germans
12. Russians
13. Romans

There are 3 slots we're not sure of, but it's most likely -

14. Persians
15. Babylonians
16. Aztecs

though Spanish are a possibility and there's always the Mongol fluke.

	06-08-2001 23:01									#4
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Xerxes definitely.

Bonus points for spelling SexRex backwards!

	06-08-2001 23:07									#5
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I would say that Spain HAS to be in, it's just too important to be left out. Besides that, I think the Aztecs and Mongols fill the other two slots. There has been very little evidence of any of these five civs in the game, but I think it's more likely that it is Spanish and Aztecs, considering their impact on the world and other civilizations. The final slot is open, but I think that the Mongols are the most likely candidate is the Mongols, with Persians right behind. I believe that the Babylonians will almost certainly be dropped.

Also - I didn't say you couldn't post a poll, you can do that all day if you like. BUT, doing a separate poll for each civ is excessive. There have already been leader threads. You could easily combine these polls into one thread.

	06-08-2001 23:08									#6
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If Cyrus is good enough for Machiavelli, then he's good enough for me.

	06-08-2001 23:14									#7
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Persia has had a great impact on the world, just not so much on the modern world (unless you count Iran). At the time when Alexander invaded, Persia was the largest empire the world had seen to date.

In fact, Cyrus the Great is listed on the top five conquerors list (in terms of total territory), along with Alexander, Augustus Caesar, Genghis Khan, and Attila the Hun, I believe.

I think it would be an error on Firaxis' part to eliminate all Mesopotamian civilizations - that's where civilization itself started!

	06-08-2001 23:14									#8
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I think Bablyonia has a better chance than Persia, for two reasons, firstly the previous civilization games seemed to think they were important (I had never heard of them before, so I now associate them very strongly with civilization) and secondly, the hanging gardens of babylon will be in the game - If they think the civilization was important enough to include one of its wonders, it's highly likely they'll include it itself. I'd like to see both in personally.

With regards to suggestions that there are 'only 3 slots left' I would refute that... If you look at civ2 many civs are mutually exclusive - You don't have russians, romans or celts in the same game, because they are all 'white civs'. It is highly likely therefore that there will be a multiple of 16 civilizations in civ3, possibly 32 or maybe even more. I would hope that is what will happen anyway.

	06-08-2001 23:18									#9
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quote: Originally posted by Rhysie With regards to suggestions that there are 'only 3 slots left' I would refute that... If you look at civ2 many civs are mutually exclusive - You don't have russians, romans or celts in the same game, because they are all 'white civs'. It is highly likely therefore that there will be a multiple of 16 civilizations in civ3, possibly 32 or maybe even more. I would hope that is what will happen anyway.

There are 16 civs in civ3. Period. No multiples, no "white civs." There are 16 playable civs, with 16 playable at once (through editors, not main screen). The reason for this seemingly "low" number is because of the addition of unique units and leaders.

	06-08-2001 23:28									#10
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quote: Originally posted by Sabre2th There are 16 civs in civ3. Period. No multiples, no "white civs." There are 16 playable civs, with 16 playable at once (through editors, not main screen). The reason for this seemingly "low" number is because of the addition of unique units and leaders.

I know where the evidence is that there are 16 max in game at any one time, but as far as I know there is no evidence to say that there are only 16 which can be selected. If you are going to so bluntly reject my suggestion please either provide a link or information to back up your rejection rather than just posting an 'I am an expert' post.

Not saying you are wrong, just saying that if you are so sure it would be nice of you to provide me with the information which makes you so sure.

	06-08-2001 23:33									#11
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I did not mean to come across like that, but my point is the same. About my proof: I'm at work right now and can't look back for it. I'll try to remember to look tonight when I'm home.

	06-08-2001 23:56									#12
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Rhysie, it's been mentioned in about a dozen different and independent previews that the game will only come with 16 predefined civs.

	07-08-2001 00:00									#13
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I am fully expecting to see an expansion pack 6-12 months after the initial release, containing 16 more tribes with their own leaders and special units.

Persians, Mongols, Dutch, Celts, Incas, Hopi, Ethiopians, Arabs, Khmer, Norse,
Polynesians, Koreans, Turks, Ghanese, Portuguese, Sioux - we will all be there after all!

Right, Firaxis?

	07-08-2001 00:11									#14
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This is probably not far off, Ribannah. Even if Firaxis doesn't make more "official" civs, people here will certainly be making their own.

	07-08-2001 01:14									#15
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Frankly, I enjoy your polls Alexander.
I agree that the Spanish are simply too important to neglect, and the Mongols have been important throughout history (Golden Horde, anyone?), IMO it comes down to a showdown between Persia and the Aztecs, and that is a battle I feel that the Aztecs will win, since it would be the lone representation of South American civilization into the game..then again Persia would be the only Middle-Eastern country....gah! This is too hard to say!

	07-08-2001 01:50									#16
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quote: Originally posted by monkspider IMO it comes down to a showdown between Persia and the Aztecs

Who had more impact on the world? Persians, hands down. The cultural influence of the Aztecs was practically erased.

	07-08-2001 04:09									#17
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quote: Originally posted by Ribannah I am fully expecting to see an expansion pack 6-12 months after the initial release, containing 16 more tribes with their own leaders and special units.

I'll second the sentiment, and throw in a bunch of new scenarios and graphic enhancements (ie more tile variety without changing the actual terrain, ie prettier forests and such)

	07-08-2001 05:40									#18
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Rhysie,
There's no real hard evidence that the maximum of choosable civs will be 16 but there are very, very strong clues. I'd say the number 16 is about 99% certain.

Sabre2th et al,
You guys seem to look at civs that you personally think are important more than actual evidence: the evidence on the Aztecs is pretty strong (a handfull of city names), the evidence on the Persians fairly strong (2 typically Persian city names), the evidence on the Babylonians is weak (1 city name that was assigned to Babylonia in the past but is really Sumerian) and the evidence on the Spanish and Mongol extremely weak (they can only be in if other evidence turns out to be incorrect). So it looks like the Mongols and Spanish are out in favour of the Babylonians, Persians and Aztec. No, I don't like it either but that's the way it looks (and with only 16 slots certainly not unacceptable, though the Mayans would have been more fitting than the Aztec). Of course, nothing is 100% certain yet at this stage.

My vote goes to Cyrus BTW, though Xerxes and Darius the Great would be very acceptable as well.

	07-08-2001 06:36									#19
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quote: Sabre2th et al,

Why pick me? I didn't pick the ones I thought were more important, I've followed your thread and have read your eveidence. These are the civs that I think are most likely, based on everything I've read so far.

	07-08-2001 07:29									#20
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Xerxes. (BTW how do you pronounce that:confused


The Persians make good rivals for the Greeks. They should (and probably will) be included. Hmm, Persepolis - that sounds kinda Greeek. Minneapolis.

quote: I am fully expecting to see an expansion pack 6-12 months after the initial release, containing 16 more tribes with their own leaders and special units.

Yes please.

	07-08-2001 08:54									#21
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Xerxes = "Zerksees" in pronunciation, I believe.

The reason all the Persian names sound Greek is because we have almost all our information on Persia from Greek historians, the Greeks being their nemesis.

Persepolis - Greek for "Persian City"

Darius -- more properly Dareios, also a Greek translation of his Persian name.

As for Xerxes, his real name was most likely closer to the Biblical equivalent, Ahasuerus, a more Semitic version of the name.

Unique unit could be the 10,000 Immortals.

	08-08-2001 00:48									#22
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My vote goes for Ayatola,it doesn't always has to be a legend whose name first got translated to greek and then to Latin(ie Darius)and Iran is where Persia was in the old ages(not exactly but it's a part of it)

Shade

	08-08-2001 19:59									#23
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Cyrus the Great? How do you prononce him? Take care - his name was Kurosh.

He was the first who established Persian Empire. So he is their leader.