31-08-2001 04:42									#31
	Re: Settings Support Apolyton buy from Amazon

quote: Originally posted by Wittlich IMO, since no one has played CIV3 yet (and no one knows what to expect), we should set the difficulty on "medium" (or Prince, for lack of a known term for the game setting), or even medium-hard (I guess that would be the "king" setting). I've been thinking about what Lancer said in reference to the "teams" being sponsored by various forums ... Are the teams being slotted in different forums a necessity? You know, we could just have an open sign-up for a given period of time. Then, when the sign-up window closes, start the games with everyone on their own (no teams). For instance, depending on the maximum number of players allowed, the first 7 players that signed up start a game, players 8-14 start a game, players 15-21 start a game, and so on. The winners of these games would them move on to a second game (and depending on how many players we have signed up, there would be a 3rd, 4th, 5th, and so on game) - until there is only one player standing. This brings another thought to mind - The Civ3 Release date. If Civ3 is released in America by mid-October, and the game is released in Europe in February 2002; we shouldn't have the championship until everyone can compete. What I'm saying is that launching the actual Apolyton Championship is dependent on the world-wide release on the game - since the Apolyton Forum is made-up from people world-wide. So, any thoughts?

I agree with both of your points. DOWN WITH TEAMS! UP WITH GIVING U.S. PLAYERS A CHANCE TO PRACTICE WITH THE NEW SYSTEMS *ahem* I MEAN GIVING EUROPEAN PLAYERS A CHANCE TO COMPETE

	31-08-2001 04:54									#32
	Full PM-box? Change here!

quote: Originally posted by TechWins Would anybody like to have a two game elimination?

Actually TechWins, I was on the same line of thought. I know that everyone has a "bad" game once in a while. With a two-game elimination, you could still loose one game and still be in the running. What does everyone else think?

	31-08-2001 05:43									#33
	Support Apolyton, buy Call to Power 2

quote: Actually TechWins, I was on the same line of thought. I know that everyone has a "bad" game once in a while. With a two-game elimination, you could still loose one game and still be in the running. What does everyone else think?

Yeah, you could be the best civ player in the world but some string of bad luck could haunt you and make you lose the whole tournament. Therefore if you are the best civ player in the world and you have a bad luck game and you lose then you will still have another chance to redeem your self.

Round One
Game1
P1-1
P1-2
Winner is P1-2
Game2
P2-1
P2-2
Winner is P2-1
Game3
P3-1
P3-2
Winner is P3-2
Game4
P4-1
P4-2
Winner is P4-2

Round Two
Game 1
P1-2
P2-1
Winner is P2-1
Game2
P3-2
P4-2
Winner is P3-2
Game3
P1-1
P2-2
Winner is P1-1
Game4
P3-1
P4-1
Winner is P4-1

Round Three
Game1
P2-1
P3-2
Winner is P2-1
Game2
P1-2
P4-2
Winner is P1-2
Game3
P1-1
P4-1
Winner is P4-1

Round Four
Game1
P2-1
P4-1
Winner is P4-1
Game2
P3-2
P1-2
Winner is P1-2

Round Five
Game1
P2-1
P1-2
Winner is P2-1

Round Six
P4-1
P2-1
Winner is P2-1

The winner of the tournament would be P2-1

[P is for player, the first # is for the first game # you played, & the second # is for the player you were in that game]

That was just a little mini view of what an actual tournament might be like. Who would like this system?

I happen to like this system because P4-1 lost his/her first game but wound up making it to the finals. P2-1 won all of his/her games until the second to last game but he/her was not eliminated from the tourney. For me this system is very simple and if I fully explained everybody else would be able to understand very easily as well.

If you have any questions on the system, such as how did I determine in Round three that P4-1 plays P1-1 instead of P1-2, please ask them.

	31-08-2001 06:05									#34
	Support Apolyton or Terrorists Win

I like it. Its got my vote

	31-08-2001 08:54									#35
	Support Apolyton buy from Amazon

Wittlich, you guys want no teams, no teams it is. Also, I don't want to pass on the chance of kicking some eoro butt so we'll wait. That means that we can iron out the details of the competition between now and the euro release. Maybe we'll even give em a day or two to practice.

So, we'll ditch teams, but I'd like everyone to state the forum they want to represent and have it in the lists of games next to their names. We can have unlimited players representing each forum, doesn't matter. The point is that I want a connection between the game and the site to help non players get into the action and results.

TechWins, sounds good, lets settle on King, or whatever aproximates King level in Civ 3. I like a map a tad over normal size, say 60 X 90? (instead of 50 X 80) Is everyone ok with that? I don't want to get into taking polls, rather focus on the opinions of those of us that get into it in these early stages and help as you guys are.

Consider this everyone, should we randonize maps? I have a preference, but I guess everyone does...but maybe the majority will think alike? If not we'll randomize.

I like continents w/ normal amounts of land, thoughts?

One thing that really matters to me is NO 2X. Please support me in this...

dainbramaged, you got it guy. No teams and we wait.

TechWins, great idea on having double elimination. Also, I like your system, would you like to handle the schedule?

Much as I'd love to play in this thing, maybe I should just deal with disputes, and administration. Less chance of an accusation of preference, squabbleing, that sort of thing. What do you guys think?

Maybe the winner will give me a game in the end.

Did I cover everything?

	31-08-2001 09:02									#36
	Here's a thought... Tired of ads?

We ramp up to the big competition, the world cup of Civ 3, the Superbowl of Apolyton, with a practice, single elimination small scale tourny after the US release. We might need the practice getting organized for the big show too.

Thoughts?

	31-08-2001 16:59									#37
	Re: Here's a thought... Enter the AD-FREE zone

quote: Originally posted by Lancer We ramp up to the big competition, the world cup of Civ 3, the Superbowl of Apolyton, with a practice, single elimination small scale tourny after the US release. We might need the practice getting organized for the big show too. Thoughts?

Cool. Count me in for both torurneys for the civ3-general forums.


And Thats all, folks. I realy have to stop posting hte same thing over and over again, and i also come to apolyton in spurts, so if i stop coming for a bit... well, if I dont respond, please email me when youre going to have a tourney
dainbramaged13@msn.com

	31-08-2001 21:04									#38
	Support Apolyton

I concur Lancer - NO 2X

I myself never play with the 2 times production

As far as the map size goes, I really don't care - as long as all of the players DO NOT start on the same continent

	01-09-2001 16:22									#39
	Tired of ads?

No point to having two tourneys...

I guess the difference in release dates will only be a matter of weeks, 2 or 3 perhaps.

dainbramaged, I'll keep you in mind.

Wittlich, great, btw isn't it rare in multi to have only one continent? I think I've only seen one map turn out that way and it was a small one.

	02-09-2001 01:51									#40
	Got spare money?

quote: TechWins, great idea on having double elimination. Also, I like your system, would you like to handle the schedule?

Yes, I would. We should actually start the signing up sometime in September and give it about a month for people to sign up.

A pre-tourney isn't a bad idea if the Euros don't get the game until sometime in 2002. If they are going to get the game in 2001 then we probably don't need to do a tourney. Maybe we could do some practice games for fun, though.

Yes, diffently there shouldn't be 2x.

Lancer I think you should join the tourney.

Where will all the games be saved at? How will the times of the games be determined, with all the time zone differences? Maybe we should only hold the games on weekends. Weekdays are too busy for me (wake up at 4am, do homework till 6am, go to school at 7am, come home at 3pm, do homework most of the night and play basketball for a few hours, then go to bed at 11pm). So I think holding the games on the weekends is the best idea to accomodate with time zones and people's schedules. If you fail to make it to your game then you will get an automatic forfeit. Unless you have one hell of a good reason why couldn't make it (i.e. went into a coma, house burned down, wife had a kid, my leg fell off unexpectingly).

The reason why I thought normal would be a good idea is because the games wouldn't take as long. I actually do like a map larger than normal, though. The continents with normal amounts of land is the best but some people may not agree so we might have to do a randominization. Then again who are they to speak out?

What should the winning conditions be? Obviously diplo won't ever happen. So there is no point in including that one. I think a cultural victory and military conquest are the only two we should include. The Space Race is too easy and I don't like the idea of a Domination victory in MP.

King sounds good to me.

Lancer, I agree with you on getting these things ironed out before the game gets released.

	02-09-2001 01:53									#41
	Support Apolyton, buy Galactic Civilizations: Deluxe Edition

quote: TechWins, great idea on having double elimination. Also, I like your system, would you like to handle the schedule?

Yes, I would. We should actually start the signing up sometime in September and give it about a month for people to sign up.

A pre-tourney isn't a bad idea if the Euros don't get the game until sometime in 2002. If they are going to get the game in 2001 then we probably don't need to do a tourney. Maybe we could do some practice games for fun, though.

Yes, diffently there shouldn't be 2x.

Lancer I think you should join the tourney.

Where will all the games be saved at? How will the times of the games be determined, with all the time zone differences? Maybe we should only hold the games on weekends. Weekdays are too busy for me (wake up at 4am, do homework till 6am, go to school at 7am, come home at 3pm, do homework most of the night and play basketball for a few hours, then go to bed at 11pm). So I think holding the games on the weekends is the best idea to accomodate with time zones and people's schedules. If you fail to make it to your game then you will get an automatic forfeit. Unless you have one hell of a good reason why couldn't make it (i.e. went into a coma, house burned down, wife had a kid, my leg fell off unexpectingly).

The reason why I thought normal would be a good idea is because the games wouldn't take as long. I actually do like a map larger than normal, though. The continents with normal amounts of land is the best but some people may not agree so we might have to do a randominization. Then again who are they to speak out?

What should the winning conditions be? Obviously diplo won't ever happen. So there is no point in including that one. I think a cultural victory and military conquest are the only two we should include. The Space Race is too easy and I don't like the idea of a Domination victory in MP.

King sounds good to me.

Lancer, I agree with you on getting these things ironed out before the game gets released.

I just pushed reply when I realized that I had to say one more thing. I'm going to represent the Civ3-General forum. Even though, I am the motivator behind the opening of the Civ3-Civilizations forum, note: look at threads around the time of the Civ3.com release.

	03-09-2001 06:32									#42
	Suffering from ads?

Thanks TechWins, for taking the schedule up.

Lets see how many people we get in the tourney before I decide if I'm in. If it's just a small thing I'll join. Otherwise it might be better to have someone w/ some distance to settle disputes.

Players should be responsible for saving their own games. A game might take a long time, so they can agree to pick it up and set a meeting.

Weekends sounds good.

I would suggest that instead of forfiet, the AI plays the civs of those that miss the agreed to meeting. That way they can pick it up again the next time around. (If anything survives)

If their leg falls off, , but arms remain attached they better show up...

As far as maps go, if you, Wittlich, and dainbramaged agree to normal land w/ continents, so be it. We're the ones here from the get go and involved in making this work. dainbramaged says he won't be around much, being busy, but perhaps instead of being a dictator of this, you, Wittlich, and I become equally responsible for all decisions. Democracy gets us better trade anyway. So, 2 out of three sound good for decisions? We'll give special attention to the ideas of dainbramaged, since he has shown early interest. We have to be non bias towards or friends, or people with whom we want to demolish. Save it for the battlefield. If we're a democracy I'm in and will play.

So, if you guys are agreed to sharing the duty, we need to vote on the map type, size, and what happens to folks that don't show. (eliminated or AI)

As I mentioned, I suggest 60 X 90, standard land, and continents. Should we set a default on all the other stuff to avoid problems among players? We don't know what 'all the other stuff' is yet, but we can set what we can for now.

I'd like to hear what you guys think of what I've written, and anything you want to add. I wish more people would get involved, but it's early yet.

Hey TechWins, I never got a forum opened, and I've done a few things around here, good job!

Shouldn't you be interested in the special abilities of civs though?

	04-09-2001 01:44									#43
	Increase the size of your Attachments

quote: As far as maps go, if you, Wittlich, and dainbramaged agree to normal land w/ continents, so be it. We're the ones here from the get go and involved in making this work. dainbramaged says he won't be around much, being busy, but perhaps instead of being a dictator of this, you, Wittlich, and I become equally responsible for all decisions. Democracy gets us better trade anyway. So, 2 out of three sound good for decisions? We'll give special attention to the ideas of dainbramaged, since he has shown early interest. We have to be non bias towards or friends, or people with whom we want to demolish. Save it for the battlefield. If we're a democracy I'm in and will play.

Sure Lancer, I can assist you in this.

You are right, we need to come up with a STANDARD set of rules/settings for the Championship. These settings will need to be the same for every game, including map size, continent/island size, amount of goods, difficulty level, barbarian level, and a standard setting for the terrain distribution (ie, wet/dry/warm/cold/so forth)

Concerning Player no-shows during the Championship, I agree that if these players do not show up on the given date/time of the game, their civilization should be played by the AI (for good or bad). I suggest that on the given date/time of a game, all players wait for a given amount of time (30 minutes) for the missing player to show up. If after this 30 minute waiting period, the player in question still does not show, then his/her civilization will be controlled by the AI for that time. Of course, a given game will most likely take more than one day or more than one "sitting" If the person shows for the next "round" in the game, then he/she would assume the control of their civilization.

A point that I feel that I need to make is this:

Everyone who signs up for the Championship is in it for the long haul . If a player gets bored, upset, looses interest, or has a pesonal/family emergency - My sympathy goes to you. HOWEVER, these problems/rotten luck/life-threatening situations CAN NOT and SHOULD NOT effect the execution of the Championship. If you experience a personal/family crisis, your fellow Apolyton members will feel your pain, but the Championship will CONTINUE.

I do apologize if I sound like I'm being carass and unfeeling, but I believe that we need this understanding in advance in order to have all players "on the same sheet of music" if you will.
Once we decide on all of the rules dictating the execution of the Championship, these rules will apply equally to everyone - no exceptions.

Concerning the "other stuff" (which is unknown right now), you are right Lancer, once we find out what these other options/settings are, we will then have to come up with the Championship Standard so to speak.

As a suggestion, even though the Host will save the game in process; I recommend that this same saved game file also be saved at an additional location - maybe here at Apolyton? I don't know... There are actually two reasons for this. First it allows the saved game file to have a "back-up" in case the Host's computer crashes or the file gets corrupted; and secondly it can be a form of checks and balances to ensure that no one messes with the settings/data of the saved game (possible cheats within the game itself).

Well, that's my two cents worth concerning the Championship. How does everyone else feel about it? Anyone else have any futher suggestions, comments, heartburn, or insight?

	04-09-2001 04:39									#44
	Avatar Enlargement: We've got the solution

quote: So, if you guys are agreed to sharing the duty, we need to vote on the map type, size, and what happens to folks that don't show. (eliminated or AI)

Oh yeah I agree to share the duty as long as I'm getting paid.

The map should be 4 billion years old, 60x90, normal temp, archipealago (spelled right?), and have these settings everytime but of course a slightly different map will appear. That is if these options are in the game.

The difficulty should be set at King.

No Civ Specific Abilities.

Victory conditions of Cultural Win and Military Win.

If there is a no show then Wittlich's ideas will apply.

Weekends will be playing dates.

The games will be saved on three computers instead of one or two. To give even more insurance than what two would. If only two computers are saving games then if one person cheats how will anybody know which one is cheating. I hope people will have enough integrity not to cheat in a fun tournament such as this.

A contract of some sort that has all the rules listed needs to be signed by every person affiliated with the tournament. It would be like signing the registration form here at Apolyton.

If a problem arises of any kind it will be brought up to Lancer, Wittlich, and I. Since Lancer will most likely not join the tournament he will have the ultimate say. Even though, Wittlich and I are apart of the executive group Lancer will be the head the head of the group.

Another thing is people should not join the tournament if they have no desire of winning. Meaning that they might try to blatantly take out another civ even if it destroys themselves.

	04-09-2001 16:04									#45
	settling forum wars Tired of ads?

alternatively, we can use a recipe patented by ajax and feyenoord hooligans. they agreed on time and place, met off the highway, brought their clubs and beated the s*** out of each other.
btw, i bet yin would singlehandedly beat both teams

	05-09-2001 03:30									#46
	Full PM-box? Change here!

Thanks for your great insight LaRusso.

	05-09-2001 05:36									#47
	Browse Apolyton AD-FREE

Wittlich, standardized map it is then.

How about 15 minutes waiting instead of 30? Be there or be square. If someone arrives after their Civ has been turned over to the AI, then they can take over at that point, assuming they can contact the players to let them in, sound good?

We'll have to go through this thread when Civ 3 comes out and see what works, and condense it down to some rules.

Your "long haul" rule seems fair, we all have to manage under the same rules, so if TechWins agrees, so be it.

Wittlich, you want to handle the backup saved games? That way if there is a discrepancy discovered between a players saved game and the real one, the cheat can be proven. At least 2 people in each game would have to email you the save under these circumstances, and you would be the judge, jury, and executioner. In games where you take part, send the files to TechWins if he's OK w/ that. OK TechWins?

I'm purposely minimizing my part in this as I don't know beans about comps or how to play w/ files and such. I'm a hopeless antique.

I'm going to submit this and reply to TechWins and the other posts in a couple minutes.

	05-09-2001 06:18									#48
	Got spare money?

TechWins, paychecks will be issued on the second Tuesday of each week...

Everything sounds good to me about your map except that archapelico is the opposite of continents, what we had discussed earlier. If you don't like continents then we can meet in the middle w/ normal. What do you prefer Wittlich?

TechWins, assuming Wittlich likes the idea, are you in favor of his controlling the third save game, as you mentioned?

I like your contract idea. It should also bring up the fact that we make decisions regarding changes and additions.

Since you two are sharing the decision making process, I will play in the tourney. Each of us will be equal in decision making. As there are three of us, there should never be a problem not resolved by a vote.

There will be no way to discern why a person joins the tourney. If a person accuses another of joining for the specific purpose of knocking someone else out, that's hard to prove. I don't see how you can implement this, and it will just lead to unresolved confusion in my view. Someone comes gunning for you, that's life.

Or, wait a sec. You don't have to play under your own name if you don't choose to. However you must submit the name you are playing under to me, I'll be keeper of identities...I'm not gunng for anyone, and will play under my name. I might have a few gunning for me, but I have friends too. This sound good guys?

Hey, how about a second place finisher goes on to the next round? This would allow an allied victory and seriously shorten the game time for each game. No two way slogging matches.

Thoughts?

LaRusso, I'll give that some thought as you are still early in the planning.

:thinks:

umm, no.

	05-09-2001 06:21									#49
	Support Apolyton, buy GURPS/ Alpha Centauri

Yeah I agree with the "long haul".

quote: In games where you take part, send the files to TechWins if he's OK w/ that. OK TechWins?

How would this be done?

I think 15 minutes would be better because if we did 30 minutes it could delay the tournament a lot.

	05-09-2001 07:06									#50
	Support Apolyton, buy Alpha Centauri

I'm glad to hear that you are going to join the tourney. But you are lying when you say that you aren't going to be gunning for anybody. You know you are going to want to take out AH.

Oh yeah continents is what I thought the archipealago meant. Continents is what I want too. Much much more fun.

I'm not sure about my opinion on 2nd place advancement. At this point I'm unbiased towards it and I can't make a decision. Whatever you and Wittlich is fine with me.

What do you guys think about victory conditions and civ specific abilities?

	05-09-2001 19:58									#51
	Support Apolyton buy from Amazon

Concerning the saving of the game files - Sounds good to me. Yes, the players can email me a copy of the game(s) in question and TechWins can save the files if I am involved in the given game. Of course, in order for this to work, the actual players involved in the games will have to remember to send either TechWins or myself the saved file. But this shouldn't be a problem - as long as they remember to email it to us.

Concerning continents vs archipelago - Actually, I usually play archipelago . I just didn't think it was wise to have everyone basically strating out on the same land-mass/continent.

Concerning 2nd place advancement - Wouldn't it be rather difficult to decide who actually holds 2nd place at the completion of the game? I mean, the actual winner is easy, but to pick the 2nd place person might be a little difficult - what do you use? His/her military strength? His/her cultural ranking? His/her political influence? Do you see what I mean?

Concerning Victory conditions and civ specific abilities - The victory conditions are fine. To play or not to play with the civ specific abilities...I don't know, since none of us are actually familiar with it. Yes, we know "basically" what the civ specific abilities do, but we don't know how much of an effect it will have on the game as a whole. I suggest we take the position of "wait-and-see" concerning the civ specific abilities.

You are both right and I agree - a 15 minute waiting period is better than a 30 minute period. I basically just through a number out onto the floor to see what everyone thought.

	07-09-2001 00:49									#52
	NO INITIAL MULTIPLAYER SUPPORT?!? Help yourself to an AD-FREE life

Well, this is a DEFINATE problem with trying to have a Civ3 Championship!

I was reading the below listed thread and the posts indicated that Civ3 will most likely NOT ship with Multiplayer support, rather the multiplayer function will come in the form of a later-to-be-released upgrade/patch:

http://apolyton.net/forums/showthre...&threadid=25964

Now I remember reading on the Firaxis FAQs that multiplayer would be supported. If I recall the wording, Firaxis' response was something like ..."You bet. Civ3 will have the ability to multiplayer using TCP/IP, Lan, ect"....

Well, I went back to the Civ3.com site and again looked up Firaxis' response to the question "Will there be multiplayer support for Civ III?" which is located under "The Civilization III FAQ: General."

This is NOW the response listed for that question:
We're working on some unique things with multiplayer, but we're not ready to start talking about it yet. It has always been challenging to make multiplayer really fun in turn-based games and we're looking at new ways of approaching that.

So, this is leading me to conclude that Firaxis has run out of time to place multiplayer support in the game and still make their October USA release date. It still looks like Firaxis has plans for Multiplayer support for the game, but it will be released later....

And of course there has been complete silence so far from Firaxis concerning my question of how many human players can be supported in Civ3.

So, unless there is a change, it looks like our hopes of having the First Ever Civ3 Championship is currently on hold and will remain so for the forseeable future.

	07-09-2001 04:46									#53
	Support Apolyton buy from Amazon

I think MP will be released with civ3. Especially since Jeff said that (on this forum) simultaneous play will be included.

	07-09-2001 06:19									#54
	Support Apolyton, buy Civilization: The Boardgame

TechWins, as I said earlier, AH is experienced at multiplay. I'll be counting on you to schedule a very tough line up for him so he gets taken out early... Actually I don't even know if he'll join us. Heck, it might just be a half a dozen guys having a great time.

TechWins, how about you and Wittlich and I play a multiplayer Civ 2 game set on continents? That way we can point out the advantages to Wittlich... If we can't we should drop it to normal. Wittlich, you in for a friendly game of Civ 2?

TechWins, I'm for Civ specific abilities in this competition, but it doesn't really matter to me. The controversy surrounding this aspect of Civ 3 hasn't bothered me, it's just another tool in the game to make things interesting. Whatever though, I know some people have strong feelings regarding their use. To me, it was never something deserving of those strong feelings. I'd climb that mountain because it's there, but we should vote later when we know more.

Your victory conditions get my vote.

Wittlich, you up for a Civ 2 game? I don't think I've ever had all players on one continent, except in a small map multiplayer game using the maximum amount of land AND continents. What TechWins and I are proposing is normal land and continents. Big difference. Anyway, want to give it a try?

Thanks for taking up the saved game thing...

The second place advancement has implementation problems, true. However if we can resolve this I see potential for making things a bit more interesting.

Guys, how about this, the 1st place winner chooses who advances. This way who you are allied with can make a monster difference in whether you succeed. Did you join the right camp? Are you the most favored nation in that camp? Or, if you are the #1 player, who will remember the break in the future? Which player will show loyalty and gratitude in future games, maybe giving you the break in some future game that you give him now?

Politics, politics...

What do you guys think?

Regarding whether multiplayer is in or not... If it's in it's in, if not we have a delay in our tourney, that's life. We'll see...

Last edited by Lancer on 07-09-2001 at 06:29

	07-09-2001 07:43									#55
	Help yourself to an AD-FREE life

Yeah, who knows how many people will join. Hopefully we could get quite a few. It might just depend on how much support we get from Apolyton (i.e. news items regarding the tourney). No matter how many people join the first round players for each game will be randomly or stratified randomly picked. What I mean by stratified random is I might group people that have similar time zones together then pick randomly from each group, that way the game time will be more accomadable for everybody in the first round. All rounds after that will not be randomly chosen one bit.

A civ2 MP game is fine by me. It would have to be Saturday and I'm not sure what exact time, though. What times are good for you guys?

Civ specific abilities should not be included for a few reasons. People might complain about what civ they have (people might want Germany, US, or who knows maybe even the Zulus). No matter how balanced it is we will get people fighting over which Civ they want to be. The second reason is an assumption that it might not be fully balanced. [For my SP I think I will be playing with CSA's on and quite possibly have them on playing MP over a LAN]

Maybe we should wait on what victory conditions to include. But if a few are easy (i.e. Space Race) like they were in Civ2 then they shouldn't be included. In my opinion I think cultural and military victory will wind up being the only two we use. The other seem as if they will be too easy and everybody will go for those victory paths.

Your system for a second place advancement is not efficient. Many people who are friends might pick their compadre for the 2nd place finisher. If there isn't a clear cut choice determined by the game itself then we shouldn't have a 2nd place finisher advance. Unless somebody can come up with a flawless system, which I doubt will occurr.

	07-09-2001 09:19									#56
	Browse Apolyton AD-FREE

Sure Lancer and TechWins - I'm game for a Civ2 game (if you'll pardon the pun!)

Saturday is fine with me. I am located on the west coast (San Francisco, CA). What ever time you all decide upon should be fine with me. My ICQ # is: 110689330. Email is: wittlich@earthlink.net

	08-09-2001 02:56									#57
	Help yourself to an AD-FREE life

Saturday sounds good to me. I'm open regarding the time...

TechWins, you're in europe aren't you?

Btw, I have no ICQ on the machine I use for Civ...

Regarding your post, I can live without Civ specific abilities, and am happy to cooperate. I don't expect to have a tourney where I pick a majority of options, but just a third if it averages...give and take works for me.

I would like second place advancement. I don't suggest that it will be fair, but will add the dimention of alliances to the end. If a person advances a friend that isn't a good player, that person will be taken out later anyway. It will be fun, and fun is more important than perfection in my view. Fun is why we play these games, yes?

So TechWins, that's the case for second place advancement. If you have suggestions for making it better, I'm happy to hear them. If you still want to nix it we can make it the occasion of the first vote among us. I'll abide by the result...

Might be Spring before we can do this tourney, hope the news isn't right.

	08-09-2001 03:13									#58
	Increase the size of your Attachments

Ooopppsss, nix the europe, I see you're in Arizona TechWins. Saturday afternoon sound good?

	09-09-2001 00:06									#59
	Got spare money?

quote: Might be Spring before we can do this tourney, hope the news isn't right.

If it is going to be Spring then I might not buy Civ3 ever. Go look around at some of my recent posts on the topic for more info, if you would like to.

Sorry Lancer but I'm going to have to vote against 2nd place advancement.

About the MP game of Civ2 I can't do it until about 4pm today. Is that ok? By the way, I have no idea how to do an Internet game. I did it once and I forgot how to setup it up. I know you have to get the IP address from the host or something like that. Could somebody refresh my memory?

	09-09-2001 01:09									#60
	Support Apolyton, pre-order Civilization IV

If it's Spring then I won't worry too much about your vote then TechWins. Don't be sorry about a vote btw...no point in that.

I'm going to buy Civ3 whatever, and all the add ons whenever. I'm a sucker for Civ and admit it freely.

It's been a while since I played Mplayer too. I used to go to 'The Zone', and could do that again, it's easy there. Lets set a time for next Saturday however, I have plans for this one, ok?

Guys, it's called 'The Internet Gaming Zone'. I suggest we all do a search for it, find it, and get our games updated. They will get you the latest patch which you'll need to play, and do it before next Saturday so we're all ready when we get there.

I'll search now and see if I can provide a link.