29-08-2001 07:49									#1
	Starting Position Spoilers Support Apolyton buy from Amazon

One thing I always hated in Civ II was if you started a game with just mining, irrigation and roads, you were on a sweet, large continent with no enemies immediately nearby.

If you started the game with Alphabet, Bronze Working, Pottery, etc, etc, you always knew you were on a small island, or in the middle of a tundra or desert, or had enemies all over you.

I know the additional techs were given to balance the game and give players with crappy starting positions a chance, but isn't there some other way to do this without giving it away before terrain is revealed? Kinda spoils the sense of discovery for me when I pretty much already know based on my starting techs what kind of position I'm in.

And another thing, Firaxis: I just played a game of Civ II where as soon as I started the game (in 4000 BC) a message popped up saying I was the 5th largest civilization. Considering I was playing on "random number of civs" and enjoy the element of surprise, that's kind of a big giveaway to me, isn't it? Heck yeah, I'll go straight for the Great Library if I know that many civs are involved. I wouldn't know to do that if I hadn't gotten that dumb message screen way too early in the game. Wait till I am aware of these civs before ranking me!!

	29-08-2001 13:32									#2
	Support Apolyton, buy Alpha Centauri

I agree, it would be more fun (and more realistic) for the rankings to only take into account those Civs you know...

Advisor "Sire, of the 2 civilizations that we know of, we are the 2nd largest in the world!"

Something like that

	29-08-2001 13:57									#3
	Put an end to popups!

I agree, but there should be an option, like if you already know how many civs there are, you know what I mean? some people LIKE the info..

	29-08-2001 14:50									#4
	Support Apolyton, buy Call to Power 2

That always did bother me, but we need some stats.

	29-08-2001 18:03									#5
	Support Apolyton, buy Alpha Centauri

Stats are fine, I just don't want any spoilers before I know what I'm dealing with - let me find out myself.

	29-08-2001 18:06									#6
	Increase the size of your Attachments

And if you hit F8 you know most of your opponents. Anyway in civ3 civs have civ specific starting techs, so thats one spoiler less.

	29-08-2001 18:16									#7
	Support Apolyton buy from Amazon

I wonder if they'll give additional starting techs to the guy who starts out on a 5 X 5 desert island.

	29-08-2001 18:34									#8
	Increase Your PM Length

There are ways around it. For example, put additional goodie hunts near players who need help, and fix these huts so certain good things come out of them

	30-08-2001 02:07									#9
	Get a bigger avatar today!

quote: Originally posted by Skanky Burns Advisor "Sire, of the 2 civilizations that we know of, we are the 2nd largest in the world!"

What if you have met no-one, should we pessimist or optimist?:

"Sire, we are the the most technologically advanced empire in the known world"

or

"Sire, we are the stupidest nation yet found on Earth."

	30-08-2001 02:14									#10
	Support Apolyton, buy Call to Power 2

Well to be blunt with you, I found the map generator in Civ2 to be awful, it generated these horrible straggly landmasses. SMAC was better because it formed decent continents. Hopefully Civ3 will have a decent map generator which will produce more even starting points...

	30-08-2001 07:48									#11
	Got spare money?

Big Crunch, id say they would go with optimist... you know... the whole "Shoot the messanger" sort of thing... They stat guy would want to keep his head on top of his neck

I agree that we need stats, but i think we shouldnt know about other civs until we know other civs, at least met a unit or city of theirs.

I like hearing about other civilizations kicking the bucket tho

	30-08-2001 09:08									#12
	Support Apolyton

quote: Originally posted by Provost Harrison Well to be blunt with you, I found the map generator in Civ2 to be awful, it generated these horrible straggly landmasses. SMAC was better because it formed decent continents. Hopefully Civ3 will have a decent map generator which will produce more even starting points...

We already know from the screenshots and FIRAXIS comments that the terrain generator in CIV3 is much better than the CIV2 one.

	30-08-2001 09:24									#13
	Put an end to popups!

I don't like the random map generator in Civ 2 it always messes up my perfectly arranged cities