31-08-2001 20:55									#1
	The 'Giggle Factor' Elements in Civ3 Browse Apolyton AD-FREE

The Giggle Factor is a term used for amusing but inconsequential elements in games, esp. strategy games. Developers like to put these in to add flavor, environment or ambience to what the gamers interact with. But the distinction of these elements is that while they may enhance the playing experience, they add nothing to the actual gameplay. It appears that Civ3 is loaded with Giggle Factor elements:

City View screen - I have this as my wallpaper but while it's nice to look at, the fact that it's just a snapshot without any interaction, it becomes a giggle factor element.

Unit Animations - it's irrelevant whether the units are animated or not, they still perform the same. While most of us think having units go through a animation loop is cool, it'll be interesting to see whether this giggle factor element is something civers will get tired of.

Wonder Movies, opening cinematics, etc. - This is an obvious one. Like with Civ2, I fully expect that after a few times, most civers won't even bother with them and just got into or back to the game.

Leader Animations - This seems to be all the rage in the Civ3-Civ forum, but this is also a giggle factor element. In other words, you would be able to conduct diplomatic relations regardless what the leader looks like or reacting to or if it's even there. It's a giggle factor because while it may be nice to see a face, it's irrelevant to gameplay. (To digress, a prediction may be that we will wish that Firaxis spent far less resources on the leader's animations and much more on the diplomatic AI.)

Throne Room/Palace - just for ambience.

These are just some of the few obvious ones I thought of off the top of my head. One could also argue that any of the units themselves are giggle factor elements because the only important thing is that you can identify what the units are, regardless of what they look like.

In all, there seems to be a lot of words written in these forum about what I call 'Giggle Factor' elements. But I believe it's important to keep in mind that while they are there for make the game more enjoyable, they are irrelevant for playing the game. Once we get into the strategies and tactics, I suspect that many 'Giggle Factor' elements will be ignored or turned off because they would end up taking away our focus or concentration on what really matters in playing Civ.

	31-08-2001 21:04									#2
	Support Apolyton, buy Civilization III: Complete

You need to have something other then the Demographics to look at while waiting for your turn.

	31-08-2001 21:04									#3
	Inflate your Upload Space

Although I agree that some of the elements you suggest may be turned off after playing for a while, I don't agree that they detract from the real focus of the game.

On the contrary, there are going to be MANY things that firaxis has added to literally get a giggle out of us. Such things that you failed to mention would be the dialogue that the AI responds to you with, some of the noises that different actions make, and the advice that your advisers may make.

I've always enjoyed seeing a game company have a little fun with their otherwise serious product. To me, it ADDS to gameplay, not detract from. I'm playing to have fun, and these kinds of things sure add to the fun.

Bring on the Giggle Factor, Firaxis. I look forward to it!

	31-08-2001 21:32									#4
	Other Giggle Factors Support Apolyton, pre-order Civilization IV

Using Sid and others as advisors.

Leader images - seeing Lincoln in Renaissance garb is a hoot.

Of course the Dan Quayle rating or the similar modern version of it will be amusing.

	31-08-2001 21:49									#5
	Re: The 'Giggle Factor' Elements in Civ3 Increase the size of your Attachments

quote: City View screen - I have this as my wallpaper but while it's nice to look at, the fact that it's just a snapshot without any interaction, it becomes a giggle factor element.

Not necessary, but fun to have.

quote: Unit Animations - it's irrelevant whether the units are animated or not, they still perform the same. While most of us think having units go through a animation loop is cool, it'll be interesting to see whether this giggle factor element is something civers will get tired of.

I don't know about the other people here, but I never turned off the animations in CtP 1+2.

quote: Wonder Movies, opening cinematics, etc. - This is an obvious one. Like with Civ2, I fully expect that after a few times, most civers won't even bother with them and just got into or back to the game.

Firaxis acknowledges that people get tired of movies. An opening movie is kind of necessary in my mind. It doesn't do much for gameplay (obviously), but it's in pretty much every game and is just a bit of fun. There are no wonder movies in civ3.

quote: Leader Animations - This seems to be all the rage in the Civ3-Civ forum, but this is also a giggle factor element. In other words, you would be able to conduct diplomatic relations regardless what the leader looks like or reacting to or if it's even there. It's a giggle factor because while it may be nice to see a face, it's irrelevant to gameplay. (To digress, a prediction may be that we will wish that Firaxis spent far less resources on the leader's animations and much more on the diplomatic AI.)

First of all, you know nothing about the AI. Second of all, the leaders are functional, they aren't just fluff. The leader animations are used to judge the other civ's opinion of you.

quote: Throne Room/Palace - just for ambience.

So? Have a little fun.

quote: I suspect that many 'Giggle Factor' elements will be ignored or turned off because they would end up taking away our focus or concentration on what really matters in playing Civ.

I don't. Like I said above with the unit animations, I didn't turn off the 'Giggle Factors.' I still watched the wonder movies occasionally, still played with the palace, and even occasionally looked at the city view .

Bottom Line: If you don't like them, don't use them. Or, better yet, don't even buy the game. Don't tell us that we shouldn't like them or use them. I think Firaxis did a fine job on the game and I'm not going to criticize. (At least not until I have the game.)

	01-09-2001 00:21									#6
	Got spare money?

Three comments:

1. I had clearly stated that these elements make the game more enjoyable. but they don't mean anything for gameplay. I thought the word 'enjoyable' could also mean fun?

2. I can't believe that someone thinks that the graphical representation of a leader's face is functional as oppose to pure cosmetics. I certainly don't need to see Mao's snarling baboon-like mug to tell me what I would read (from the Advisor window), "Mao, the Chinese leader is pissed at you." The words would do just fine and depending if I got my tanks going after their Riders, I may react accordingly. Oh, I play Civ2 and OCC on deity. I certainly don't expect the AI to be as good as the amount of resources they put into the artisits.

3. One of my focus is perhaps in reaction to many of the threads that seem to debate things that 3 months from now, folks will say, 'why did we debate that?'. Can you imagine someone in the Civ3-Strategy forum starting a thread debating the strategy of what to build next on the palace or how much of a snarl to give Brian Boru? I don't think so.

But then again, this was just a time-killing thread for a Friday. Besides, no one has ever accused me of being a critic of Civ3 before (a critic of the critics, yes ), so that part was funny.

	01-09-2001 01:06									#7
	Enter the AD-FREE zone

quote: I had clearly stated that these elements make the game more enjoyable.

I do not know about others, but I play a game to enjoy myself. Ofcourse that is a mix of something nice to look at, an intellectual challenge etc.
The game IMHO is more than just the strategy part of it. Even when playing a game of chess it makes a difference if you have to use some cut out cartons or some nice peaces. To play with nice toys is nice I think.

The ambience is extremely important, it is text, graphics, music and user interface. Only strategy like e.g. Space Empires IV, without ambience to capture me, I do not like to play. I am only willing to spend time on something if it is capable of capturing me, when I try to have some influence on the outcome of the game, as long I have the feeling I have some influence and it is still a challenge I keep captured and I keep playing.

Also in a game like VGA Planets the images of the space ships wre important, because they added to the athmosphere of the game. Although for all the strategy and tactics they had no influence. It did have the effect that more people liked to play the game.

	01-09-2001 03:03									#8
	Enter the AD-FREE zone

quote: Originally posted by Tventano Even when playing a game of chess it makes a difference if you have to use some cut out cartons or some nice peaces. To play with nice toys is nice I think.

ABSOLUTELY!! There's nothing like playing chess on a big board with pieces that look like kings and queens, real bishops, and knights. Very cool.

The same thing applies to other games as well.

	01-09-2001 03:15									#9
	Support Apolyton or Terrorists Win

quote: Originally posted by Gramphos You need to have something other then the Demographics to look at while waiting for your turn.

http://www.liquid.se/pong.html

might even beat out the civ 3 ai

	01-09-2001 23:59									#10
	Support Apolyton, buy Galactic Civilizations: Deluxe Edition

"Avatars" for your computer screen that look like Civ II Units... Such as instructors in Microsoft Word or the desktop which do strange animations

	02-09-2001 05:25									#11
	Increase the size of your Attachments

Most graphics in games are more than 'giggle factors' they quickly portray information to you and make you enjoy and feel like your in a real world.
Its like the smilies on this forum, they are amusing but they also are good for showing peoples emotions and meanings behind sentences quickly,
the best way to present data is in a picture format, which is why civs use of groups of coins for profits is good etc.
Seeing the face and expression of a leader makes that civ seem more personal and like its led by someone, and you can easily see how happy they are towards you- better than a simple number.

PJ (game designer/programmer extraordinaire)

	02-09-2001 05:51									#12
	Full PM-box? Change here!

Apolyton-related easter eggs would be hilarous... as long as they aren't used over and over again.....

	02-09-2001 13:47									#13
	Re: The 'Giggle Factor' Elements in Civ3 Support Apolyton, buy Galactic Civilizations: Deluxe Edition

quote: Originally posted by Steve Clark Leader Animations - This seems to be all the rage in the Civ3-Civ forum, but this is also a giggle factor element. In other words, you would be able to conduct diplomatic relations regardless what the leader looks like or reacting to or if it's even there. It's a giggle factor because while it may be nice to see a face, it's irrelevant to gameplay. (To digress, a prediction may be that we will wish that Firaxis spent far less resources on the leader's animations and much more on the diplomatic AI.) Throne Room/Palace - just for ambience.

I have a couple of comments on these points.

Throne room/Palace first. It may just be ambience to you. But I find it a useful gauge of the happiness of my Civ. I know that if I've just built a Wonder and don't get at least one addition to my TR/P in the next few turns that maybe I might want to think of adjusting some things for a little while. Ok, I admit that most of the time I don't actually push up the luxury rate when this occurs. But I know that its something that I probably should consider.

In fact, one of the few things I don't like about SMAC is that there is no real equivelent to the TR/P. The monuments just aren't the same. I mean they are useful gauges of how much progress I am making compared to the rest of the factions but I know that when I do certain things for the first time, the monument will always pop up.

The TR/P is different. I know when I do certain things, it should pop up, but it can't be predicted when it will pop up. And sometimes when it occurs its a surprise.


In a similar respect, I am looking forward to see how useful the leader animations in Civ3 are. If they are useful enough in giving me additional feedback about the mood of the opposition, and not too intrusive, I'll leave 'em on. Shoot, as long as they aren't overly intrusive, I might just leave 'em on.