15-12-1999 21:28									#31
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Okay, I tested it and city walls do seem to work against amph assaults, and coastal forts don't. Learn something new every day.

	16-12-1999 01:19									#32
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Undefended cities can be taken by any unit cept dips and spies.You can even move a unit directly from a boat into an undefended city.Doesn't have to be a marine.

	16-12-1999 02:46									#33
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One correction to your post: caravans and freights also can't take cities.

	16-12-1999 03:23									#34
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Correct

	16-12-1999 18:10									#35
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I think I figured out what I was doing wrong when I couldn't capture an undefended city on a one-square island. I was trying to land my unit by moving the transport to the city. I should have clicked on the transport and selected the land unit it was carrying, then moved that to capture the city.

	24-08-2000 19:32									#36
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I was reading this older thread on the smart use of Marines, and I thought I would post
my own favorite Marine attack style. My style of play is to go for spaceships, rather than
to conquer, so I only do as much warring as I have to in order to accomplish that. Also I
have never played MP so I don’t know if this tactic would be effective there.

#1; I send a transport loaded with diplos or spies, and investigate the likely targets for
invasion, looking for the weakest target. Also taking into consideration the reason I am
taking the city. For example if my goal is to invade the rest of the enemy’s territory I
would pick the city with the best location for that next step. If I determine that the city I
want is to heavily defended and will have to be bribed, then I start amassing the cash.

#2; I then assemble the needed Naval force, usually three or four cruisers and a
battleship.
When the ships are ready, I send a transport of Marines under escort of the Navy to the
target city.

#3; The battleship and cruisers bombard the city, then the Marines attack mopping up the
weaker defenders and taking the city. The Battleship and any weakened cruisers then
moves into the city for repairs, and to attack any force that attempts to retake the city.
The battleship is great against partisans on a hill, for example, or any target that would be
too tough for the Marines. Often the battleship can sit at a choke point, and pick off
enemy troops as the approach the city.

#4; If my plans call for it, the transport and cruiser escort goes back and picks up the
cavalry, armor, howies, and or reinforcements.

In summary, I think the Marines are best used as the “spearhead” of a carefully planned
invasion force, rather than just going in on their own. Their biggest advantage is that they
are strong enough, both on defense and attack, to hold onto whatever they take.
Especially with a battleship or two to back them up.


Often I just let the Marines hold the city by themselves, while the dumb AI sends attacker
after attacker in suicide assaults that the Marines just shrug off. Meanwhile, I am off
somewhere else using my resources building universities and stock exchanges instead of
troops.

	15-04-2001 18:58									#37
	Increase the size of your Attachments

{combat system}
{marines}{city capturing}
{}{SlowThinker}{end2}

------------------------------
This is a post with keywords. See a thread The Great Library: a hierarchical structure" thread.

	17-04-2001 15:52									#39
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I like the point about saving escort/assault ships damage. Ships heal slow.

I'll have to look at the cost of a transport (50 shields, I think) plus two or three marines (60 apiece, is it) compared to the cost of, say, one more line of battle ship.

Damage suffered by a marine in mopping up ships caught in port, aircraft, missiles and antique units (after the line of battle ships have taken out the strong defenders)would only put one, relatively inexpensive, unit out of commission for a time and would not even cut down that unit's manoeverability when he does his healing on board the transport travelling to the next assignment.

As the fleet has to travel at the speed of the slowest unit (or wait while Aegis escorts heal) this may be a technique which will keep the whole fleet (representing a lot of shields) moving along faster.

And, of course, unlike his land bound fellows the marine is not left in an exposed position after making his attack. He and his transport either continue to sit under the fleet's umbrella or else he benefits from the transport's movement points so as to be taken into the newly captured city or to be taken to some other safer haven.

	17-04-2001 23:56									#40
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As the originator of this thread indicated, Amphibious Warfare is one of the earliest available modern technologies. If researched early enough, there is a small window of opportunity wherein vet Marines may be able to overcome any other unit defending a coastal city. With the advent of superior ground and sea units (in terms of movement and attack points), however, Marines quickly lose their usefulness except as defending units in captured cities.

Hence, I feel that given their early availability and unique properties, Marines are best used in a manner analogous to real-life marines -- to establish and defend beachheads in the early stages of a continental invasion.
[This message has been edited by Everyman (edited April 17, 2001).]

	18-04-2001 01:42									#42
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Actually, Everyman is close to one good role for Marines, a ranger role as blocking units with a high firepower. They defend sufficiently well and can kill most approaching units. The forward defense idea works well in SP, as the AI often moves units next to a city to attack next turn. The marine can kill them and still take advantage of walls for its defense. I've never seen any real advantage provided by their amphibious capability that other units can't fulfill as well or better.

The four units mentioned excepted, any land unit can take an empty city from land or sea.

Like Scouse Gits, I lost a trireme by docking it in a one square island. I bribed the city from the sea with a diplo, moved in, hit space bar to end the trieme's move, and had the mesage about death at sea pop up with the cracking beam sound. Fortunately, the unit on board stood up upon entering the city so it was not lost.

	19-04-2001 06:42									#43
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This is a very old post I hope that by now most people know that tirimes sink if left active in a one square island city. You can solve this by fortifying the tirime. I also believe that putting it to sleep works too. Just don't hit space if you wanna keep your tirime

	21-04-2001 02:30									#44
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Obviously, some of us old vets (age, that is) did not know that. Guess that's why we have the forum.

	21-04-2001 02:44									#45
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Blaupanzer is right - the ability of a marine to actively defend makes it more valuable to me than alpine troops. How many times has a unit ended it's turn adjacent to you - maybe mech inf or armor - and you know you aren't strong enough to attack it, but you are damn sure to get killed waiting for it to attack you. The Marine has the nuts to open a little whoopass...

Of course, I'd just as soon double stack a square with Mech. Inf. and Armor...

Venger