 |
| |
|
|
Wiglaf
|
 |
Cambridge
Dec 2000
time: 23:15
|
|
it's so obvious, yet it happens again at again. whenever you see a major release, board pressure (for lack of a better term) builds up...namely, the bashing of people with any and all doubts as to the quality of a game with a 'fanatical' following. and when the release date comes and the product is cahrapo, look who wished they hadn't been so blinded.
your bashing of "pessimists" is stupid and based soley on the money you will or have spent on something your mind tells you will be good for God knows what reason. You've heard a fraction of what you need to know about the game to justify a purchase, and you haven't confirmed nearly enough to flame those who argue your position.
people don't come here to read "I love you, Firaxis!" and Magaha love fests. believe it or not, with the flood of newer users, people come for an objective review of the product and, once registered, a varying opinion.
civ3 might be good. but then again it might not. we've lost sight of the fact that it's a game. we've seen SMAC, ctp, ctp2, ToT...no Firaxis TBS game, or recent Civ game, has been as good as some of you dream of civ3 being. Actually, all we've got to go on is the five year old civ2 which many of you now dislike.
So be open. We've all got high hopes, but this flaming and shunning is childish and ignorant. Don't come here to justify your lost nights of sleep or spent $60, come here to talk about civ3 and how great it might be, but be tolerant of those who think otherwise.
like horse said, it's just a game anyway. don't go too far with it...
Last edited by Wiglaf on 16-10-2001 at 08:10
|
|
| |
|
|
|
squid
|
|
if you think otherwise, what value do you have in staying here to complain? Perhaps you should find another game to worship if this isn't your bag? Gosh it's like a fan club for a game where half the people here are really just protesters! It doesn't work.
|
|
| |
|
| |
|
| |
|
|
|
Wiglaf
|
|
Cambridge
Dec 2000
time: 23:15
|
|
quote:
lso, I find it funny how you ignored my entire post, I wonder why |
ok
quote:
If someone wants to be happy and worship sid, its there oppinion, if they are trying to be positive what right do you have to tell them not to be ? |
being 'positive' is different from flaming and looking down on "pessimists"...people of varying viewpoints shouldn't be shunned or whatever as has happened before and, judging by the general mood of these forums, it's happening again, and it's pretty pathetic
quote:
About the pessemist bashing. I know all positive oppinion has been bashed by the pessimists so who are they to tell us not to retaliate?!? Thats would be like America apeaseing Bin Laden after he hit the WTC and not responding (I know its abstract but im sitting here watching the news). If I want to say something thats not of your oppinion im allowed to without you telling me to shut up! |
ok, but the whole whining thing has to end eventually, and it starts by you not bombing osama bin laden, or whatever. pessimists that bash are just as bad, but not all nay sayers are as issac-brockish as most 'optimists'...actually yin is the only person on these boards who goes out of his way to argue about civ3, and even he has a worse reputation than he deserves...some of his points are very valid
quote:
I really wish everyone would drop the whole pessimist vs optimist thing |
agreed to a certain extent
quote:
You havent touched it either! that is why I really dont see any point in debating its future yet... |
generally, all sweeping and rash statements are stupid as well
and splangy, I rarely fully respond to long posts bit by bit, but instead I try to respond to the gist of it, which I think I did
quote:
Also, why does everyone here take this forum so seriusly? Ive said it before and ill say it again, whether the game is god or crap tommorow still comes... |
that doesn't address me, I don't think, and if it does please reread my original post
|
|
| |
|
|
|
Chronus
|
|
The ironic thing about all this is that both camps (if you can call them as such) are guilty of the same things and yet insist that it is the other camp that is wrong, intolerant, whatever.
I hope it's obvious that I'm not refering to every individual, just the overall sentiments. Then again, each camp may simply have their 5% minority of big mouths who create 95% of the bashing.
|
|
| |
|
|
|
Tolkien
|
|
Anywhere but here
Oct 2001
time: 22:15
|
|
quote:
Originally posted by Wiglaf
ok, but the whole whining thing has to end eventually, and it starts by you not bombing osama bin laden, or whatever. |
what the f-ck is this supposed to mean!? are you saying 'we' americans don't have the right to bomb that bastard that killed more than 5,000 innocent people? I am an american, and it pisses me off when other people from around the world tell us (americans) we don't have the right to retaliate - I got into an argument like this on battle.net/diablo2 LoD last night. we have all the rights in the world to do so...and we will do it! if it was up to me we would be bombing 'til dooms day. They pissed me and the rest of americans off, I think worse than ever before...and will recieve their reward for doing such.
|
|
| |
|
|
|
Anun Ik Oba
|
 |
Grace of God
Sep 1999
time: 00:15
|
|
quote:
Originally posted by Wiglaf
your bashing of "pessimists" is stupid and based soley on the money you will or have spent on something your mind tells you will be good for God knows what reason. You've heard a fraction of what you need to know about the game to justify a purchase, and you haven't confirmed nearly enough to flame those who argue your position.
people don't come here to read "I love you, Firaxis!" and Magaha love fests. believe it or not, with the flood of newer users, people come for an objective review of the product and, once registered, a varying opinion.
|
But the 'pessimist' team isn't objectively criticising the 'product', but rather the developer's public relations. The whole argument was spawned out of the expressed disappointment of MP being delayed, but it quickly degraded into a criticism of Firaxis' lack of PR on the subject, and then further degraded into numerous character slurs and bashings.
I for one agree that Firaxis could have (and still can) heal many hurts with one simple post of explanation, but at the same time, their obligation to do so, and the arguement that states they are obligated, is pretty much nill.
Now, the 'optimists' are not any better in that they have also flamed and bashed with the best of them.
quote:
your bashing of "pessimists" is stupid and based soley on the money you will or have spent on something your mind tells you will be good for God knows what reason. You've heard a fraction of what you need to know about the game to justify a purchase, and you haven't confirmed nearly enough to flame those who argue your position. |
This may be true, but then how is it possible for the pessimists to have enough info to criticise the game?
And I, and many tens of thousands of others, have heard MORE than enough to justify a purchase of CivIII, if buying a game that may very well be the ruin  of us can ever be 'justified'.
|
|
| |
|
|
|
Wiglaf
|
|
Cambridge
Dec 2000
time: 23:15
|
|
quote:
But the 'pessimist' team isn't objectively criticising the 'product', but rather the developer's public relations. The whole argument was spawned out of the expressed disappointment of MP being delayed, but it quickly degraded into a criticism of Firaxis' lack of PR on the subject, and then further degraded into numerous character slurs and bashings. |
the product itself may well be awesome, but it's the 50-50-90 rule. if you don't know, it's more than likely not going your way. while we (they) can't argue about the game itself as the optimists magically can, pessimists have previous releases (smac, ctp, ctp2, tot) and various other options previously stated to go on.
quote:
This may be true, but then how is it possible for the pessimists to have enough info to criticise the game? |
the lack of info is one of the driving forces...with a lack of information and nothing but a laundry list of promised filler, it's only natural to argue with a bunch of fanatical supporters of the unreleased game, and attack the product itself for varying reasons (not enough dev time, etc)
quote:
And I, and many tens of thousands of others, have heard MORE than enough to justify a purchase of CivIII. |
namely?
|
|
| |
|
| |
|
|
|
Anun Ik Oba
|
|
Grace of God
Sep 1999
time: 00:15
|
|
And here we go again:
quote:
Originally posted by Wiglaf
the product itself may well be awesome, but it's the 50-50-90 rule. if you don't know, it's more than likely not going your way. while we (they) can't argue about the game itself as the optimists magically can, pessimists have previous releases (smac, ctp, ctp2, tot) and various other options previously stated to go on. |
If the pessimists have previous releases to go on, what makes you think the optimists don't have those SAME releases to base their arguements by?
quote:
the lack of info is one of the driving forces...with a lack of information and nothing but a laundry list of promised filler, it's only natural to argue with a bunch of fanatical supporters of the unreleased game, and attack the product itself for varying reasons (not enough dev time, etc) |
Very unfounded statements. Laundry list of filler? You are exagerating now.
The only lack of info we have had, is that MP was not going to be released with the game. However, I have to state that this info WAS actually given to us three weeks (roughly) in advance of CivIII's release. Now, I know that many people went on the Firaxis statement that MP was 'in' waaaay back when, but as I have said before- disclaimers were probably in place. Things change. Nothing is concrete, and all that.
Also, the product itself is taking a second place to Firaxograme's policies in the pessimists attacks (as I already have said).
Shall I post 500 screenshots, numerous interviews and comments by the devs, Civ of the Week, Ask the Civ Team, preview videos, etc., here for you?
Last edited by Anun Ik Oba on 16-10-2001 at 09:19
|
|
| |
|
| |
|
| |
|
|
|
Wiglaf
|
|
Cambridge
Dec 2000
time: 23:15
|
|
quote:
Shall I post 500 screenshots |
1) graphics don't matter
2) that's good, because civ's graphics aren't too hot
3) yes, please post all 500
quote:
numerous interviews and comments by the devs, |
find me one gaming company that conducts interviews saying "our product will suck. happy now?"
quote:
Civ of the Week, Ask the Civ Team, preview videos, etc. |
all straight from Firaxis. the civ of the week tells you nothing about how well the balancing is, the ATCT is a waste of canned answers, and the preview videos are hype with no gameplay at all.
quote:
Very unfounded statements. Laundry list of filler? You are exagerating now. |
and having 500 worthwhile screenshots isn't?
all the talk about trade, resources, super AI, etc...it all can't come together perfectly no matter how hard they try. the best chance firaxis has is to minimize the damage.
quote:
If the pessimists have previous releases to go on, what makes you think the optimists don't have those SAME releases to base their arguements by? |
if optimists base their case on how godlike ctp was, they lose by default anyway.
quote:
Yah I agree. I myself have been more sensitive recently because I want/need this game to be good! I don't want to consider the possibility that it might suck. |
exactly, thanks for being honest. now off to optimists anonymous.
quote:
Another thought. How come it's ok for someone to come on this site and say Firaxis sucks or the Civ3 sucks but when someone challenges "pessimist" on their statement it is immediately called "flaming" or "ganging up"? |
pessimists don't say "firaxis sucks"...but when it comes to pointing out glaring and obvious shortcomings, optimists always fall back on that "why don't they leave" garbage, and totally forget that civ3 is a game, and it has the same chance of being poor as all the other products out there, only given the extreme hype, even more so.
quote:
Thanks for trying to inject a bit of calm Wiglaf. |
the fanatics pounced on it earlier than I expected
|
|
| |
All times are GMT. The time now is 05:15.
Apolyton Time is 00:15. |
top of page
|
| archivepost |
|
Forum Rules:
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts
|
HTML code is ON
vB code is ON
Smilies are ON
[IMG] code is ON
|
|
|
|
|
|
16-10-2001 04:54
If someone wants to be happy and worship sid, its there oppinion, if they are trying to be positive what right do you have to tell them not to be
?
|