03-11-2001 02:05									#1
	Strategically Use Forced Labor Under Despotism! Support Apolyton, buy Civilization 2

There is a small, innocent looking button next to the production storage box that can be used to great advantage. It's the Rushbuy/Forced Labor button. For those of you who haven't clicked it yet, you'll likely want to give it a try! Under Despotism, which lasts a loooonnnng time, you cannot Rushbuy a unit/advance, but you can use Forced Labor to finish a job immediately! Forced labor coverts population into shields. Limited experience seems to indicate that foreign nationals are used up first, thereby eliminating a drag on your cities' stability while at the same time giving a huge production boost. A single captured worker from the Indians to my North gave me a vital Temple that expanded my borders and gave access to Iron (and Swordsmen). On my lunchtime game, I had a key chokepoint held with a production 3 city (experiencing normal high corruption) and the full might of the Japanese was being put against this key city. I needed cheap defenders to maintain this critical bottleneck and at a cost of only one Worker and with a quick click of the Forced Labor button, I finished my barracks in a turn and *voila!* Vet Defenders and damage repair! Without the use of forced labor, the Japanese would have invaded the delicate heart of my civ, but now they are bottled up tightly and denied access to the vital resources for their continued advancement. Forced Labor is a great thing...!

	03-11-2001 07:01									#2
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Hmm, I presume this can also be used to provide shield for units? If so then you have some serious momentum potential.

	03-11-2001 07:06									#3
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Forced labor sounds cool! When I get the game (dont worry, that will be tommorow or the day after, im not part of that barbarian encampment known as Europe J|K) I plan to force labor a millitary together, use them to supress the inevitable revolts, then overwhelm my enemies. GOD, this game looks good...

	03-11-2001 07:52									#4
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And, another thought; is one worker enough to rush a granary? That's a potentially killer deal, hum? Assuming things work vaguely as in civII; wait for pop 2 with 20 food, then rush a granary. Pop falls to 1 but immediately rebounds to 2, and you have 15 food left...

Nah, I doubt it somehow. I should stop strategizing before I have the damn game.

	03-11-2001 16:55									#5
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quote: Originally posted by Simpson II And, another thought; is one worker enough to rush a granary? That's a potentially killer deal, hum? Assuming things work vaguely as in civII; wait for pop 2 with 20 food, then rush a granary. Pop falls to 1 but immediately rebounds to 2, and you have 15 food left... Nah, I doubt it somehow. I should stop strategizing before I have the damn game.

Hmmm I'll check that out. Maybe it *is* possible... don't remember anything that would prohibit that.

	03-11-2001 17:37									#6
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That granary idea sounds like a wonderful idea. I think the limiting factor on forced labour is that your popn hates you for a long time. How bad/long a factor is this? I'd find out for myself, but I'm in a 'barbarian encampment'

	03-11-2001 19:01									#7
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Depends on how much work you have done on the granary already. It costs 3 pop to rush buy a granary on it's first turn. (Iirc.) This drops pretty fast to 1 though, so if your granary is in it's proper place it should be possible to do it. One too many factors to do it consistently though.

But in general you want granaries, and you want them bad. They double the speed at which you regain lost pop from forced labour. And that is great indeed.

	03-11-2001 19:38									#8
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Just so everyone knows: a rushed citizen is worth 20 shields of production.

That's from the editor.

	03-11-2001 20:05									#9
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Haphazard: They hate you for 20 turns for it. And I think it's just one unhappy face. It's possible that it only ever is one unhappy face, and the timer is reset if you force labour again. I'll know for sure tonight, my next game is on deity, and going for communist. So I reckon I'll learn the rest of the forced labour nuances as they kill me tonight.

	03-11-2001 20:35									#10
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Anunikoba:

Peeking at the rules to get the number 20?

For normal-sized map, 1 citizen is worth 40 shields.

	03-11-2001 21:47									#11
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Yeah- the editor says 20:


Strange if you are actually getting 40 per hurry though.

Attachment: forcedlabor.bmp
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	04-11-2001 18:53									#12
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Hmmm.

All Random game, Monarch difficulty, Chinese, despotism.
Forced labour gives me 40 (or 39?) shields. Hope that you
can trust me on not posting a screen shot.

Differene for 20 shields and 40 shields are big enough to affect strategy. Bringing in worker then forced labour for ancient wonder race may be possible for 40 shields labour.

	04-11-2001 19:01									#13
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I think it is 20, but if you've built at least 1 shield (IE, don't rush first turn) the price is halved. Same with rush buying under civilized govts.

	05-11-2001 05:13									#14
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is it me or is it impossible to rush wonders (great or small) with forced labor or rush-buy? Maybe I didn't have enough population for forced labor (city was size 8, trying to build the pyramids, they were half-done iirc), or maybe 1200 gold wasn't enough for an almost done lighthouse?

	05-11-2001 07:47									#15
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quote: Originally posted by narmox is it me or is it impossible to rush wonders (great or small) with forced labor or rush-buy? Maybe I didn't have enough population for forced labor (city was size 8, trying to build the pyramids, they were half-done iirc), or maybe 1200 gold wasn't enough for an almost done lighthouse?

You can't rush-build wonders unless you use a leader.

	05-11-2001 16:52									#16
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weird, cause the Egyptians for example used a lot of forced labor to build their pyramids, did they not?

	05-11-2001 18:53									#17
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Forced labour behaves weirdly. You get 40 shields for the first citizen to go, but you definitely don't get 80 shields for two labourers. (A only slightly built courthouse costs 3 laborers to complete, and it requires 80 shields.)