03-11-2001 05:10									#1
	Have Game, will review! Support Apolyton, buy Civilization III: Complete

So, I got the game, played it for a few hours and I say, IT ROCKS (what, you thought I was going to say it sucks ). No, actually, it was pretty damned good so far. I'm the English so far (on a random map), I'm on an island (with the English? Surprising ). with mostly tundra, so expansion is a bit hard. I'm playing on Warlord, btw, and it took a while, but I found the main continent and met up with with the Egyptians. They seemed cordial. They were impressed with my culture, so they were nice to me. It seems the higher your culture, the more impressed your neighbors are, and thus less hostile. Very cool!! Anyway, I'm still in the Ancient Era (and 480 BC, IIRC), so I'm still seeing what is going on .

I got the LE, and the tin was pretty nice. The tech tree was small, but pretty nice actually. Not as good as SMAC or Civ2, but pretty good. Missing the designer notes, even though it says it is there on the back of the box .

Oh, well... I'm still collecting research for my review. But all looks well. Graphics nice, haven't really seen the AI. Be back soon .

	03-11-2001 05:45									#2
	Full PM-box? Change here!

And alt-tab works amazingly! I've been posting and playing... very smooth transition!

	03-11-2001 05:59									#3
	Support Apolyton buy from Amazon

Imran,

Since you can't beat Civ2 on deity, how can we respect your reveiw...or you as a human being?

	03-11-2001 06:25									#4
	Support Apolyton, buy Civilization III: Complete

Bah! I play game to have fun... I don't put the be all and end all on winning and losing .

	03-11-2001 09:54									#5
	Support Apolyton buy from Amazon

First major problem:

Resources are spread too bare. There has to be a way to increase the amount of resources on the map. In my game as England, I'm on an island with NO strategic resources (I'm at gunpower). I have to trade silk to the Indians for iron, and I can't get saltpeter, because the Persians are the only ones that have it (that I know about) and they don't have any extras.

So, I'm just lying here, bored in my game, really. Hopefully all the oil in the world ends up where I am .

	03-11-2001 11:49									#6
	Full PM-box? Change here!

Map scrolling has been jerky all night. I assume it'll continue like this, but it isn't a big problem.

	03-11-2001 12:02									#7
	Support Apolyton, buy Alpha Centauri

Time between turns is getting insufferable. Glad they have alt-tab, because I'd go crazy if I was just watching the screen for a few minutes. At least I can post in between the long delay.

I just researched Democracy, to give you a feeling of the time passage. NO WARS yet. My culture must still be fairly high. And I don't want war... haven't been able to secure saltpeter, meaning no gunpowder units, also mean no Man-o-War . I'm missing out on my UU! Bad resource model! I'm sooo going to edit this.

	03-11-2001 12:08									#8
	Support Apolyton, buy Civilization III: Complete

Yes, I have seen the resource 'problem' as well, being stuck on an island only with one other civ. I realize I should send a boat around or something. I suppose I can see that as my fault. Still, it's a question mark for now.

I know what you mean about being bored and the turns taking too long the deeper you go. I'm still watching that element closely.

Wow. Imran with a balanced review ... and me, too! Look outside: Is it the end of the world? LOL

	03-11-2001 12:12									#9
	Avatar Enlargement: We've got the solution

It's the end of the world as we know it, and I feel fine .

DAMN, it is taking a long time (Anarchy wise) to switch from Republic to Democracy!

And I'm just playing through this game to see if, say, all the oil in the world is in my borders or something. Because it just isn't right, if this chunk of land (which has plenty of tundra, I'll admit) has NOTHING. So far the only thing on the island is silk, and I've used that to trade... that's how I can make iron units. But I think I've run out of silk to trade and no one has saltpeter to give.

Frustrating sure... but I ain't ending my game. Wouldn't get a good view of the game this way. Hell, I'm going to write a review. Play a good games with the bad.... but if I'm not on a continent next time...

edit: And did I say that the AI expands like bunnies?! WOW!

	03-11-2001 12:19									#10
	Support Apolyton buy from Amazon

Perhaps Pangea maps would have less of a resource problem, depending on the number of civs. My 'development time" testbed game without opponents actually involved some hunting around just to get the equipment for railroad.

	03-11-2001 13:44									#11
	Support Apolyton, buy Galactic Civilizations

Funny this is, even with lack of resources, and a pretty boring game I have going now... I can't stop playing .

How the Hell did it get to be 3:44! I'll go to bed after this turn... .

	03-11-2001 16:47									#12
	Tired of ads?

Yes, I also found that isolationinst play is virtually impossible, due to the fact that you won't be able to secure the needed resources. I am currently in a game with a sizeable Kingdom (Monarchy, heh) consisting of 9 cities without overlap... and yet I fear lack of resources later on.
I was deligthed to see horsies appear, under my roads even! Trade is difficult though, as the major centres are overseas.

Needless to say I hastened to build some galleys!

	03-11-2001 20:36									#13
	I don't have the game yet... Full PM-box? Change here!

but if you are isolated, you should be going for a culture kill. Beef up the production with workers, and build temples libraries, world wonders etc. Civs that have neighbours have to spend resources on fighting and that seems to me might be the isolationist advantage.

If you have really high couture it might be impossible that some average sea invasion captures and keeps one of your cities.
Just curious. What do you think?

	03-11-2001 20:48									#14
	Re: I don't have the game yet... Full PM-box? Change here!

quote: Originally posted by OneFootInTheGrave but if you are isolated, you should be going for a culture kill. Beef up the production with workers, and build temples libraries, world wonders etc. Civs that have neighbours have to spend resources on fighting and that seems to me might be the isolationist advantage. If you have really high couture it might be impossible that some average sea invasion captures and keeps one of your cities. Just curious. What do you think?

This is a very good point. Don't mean to threadjack this review thread, but cultural warfare really doesn't require access to any resources, so if you're stuck in a place with few resources, you might want to consider trying to expand culturally.

It's also nice to get other civs to attack each other. I've had a few games where I survived a lot longer than I should have by pitting two civs against each other and then backing off and letting them waste all their production fighting each other.

Dan

	03-11-2001 21:01									#15
	Remove this text

i can't wait to try this out.
ugh another 13 days...

	06-11-2001 11:58									#16
	Support Apolyton or Terrorists Win

Just as I surmised!

When I discovered refining... 3 Oil resources were found in my territory! It sure makes up for having nothing else . Of course this could lead to unwelcome attention (ie, wars).

	06-11-2001 12:17									#17
	Support Apolyton, buy Galactic Civilizations

quote: I'm missing out on my UU! Bad resource model!

Imran, I hope you change your mind about the resource model. I have been thwarted as the English as well in my current game -- I picked them for Man-O-War, had saltpeter but no iron. And nobody -- NOBODY -- would trade me for it, not even if I offered them a small city (which, if you think about it, is the right AI move).

All this to say, it's given me a clear objective -- clearer than any Civ game so far that's for sure -- even if it's p***** me off, that's what kept me up til 5 this morning (!) So I have to applaud the resource model whole-heartedly.

	06-11-2001 12:41									#18
	Support Apolyton, buy Galactic Civilizations

My objection was to the scarcity of the resources. But since I can increase the number of resources, that has been solved.

I mean, saltpeter, coal, iron are found virtually everywhere!

	06-11-2001 13:09									#19
	Increase the size of your Attachments

Nah... go on Imran don't change it.

If you do you'll miss out on some of the competivity....... competitivity...... competition in the game for resources. If there is only one source of oil in the whole world ( you ) it means you can either become a trading monopoly for it or become everyone else's ***** as they go to war with you cause you won't just give it to them for free.

	06-11-2001 13:47									#20
	Enter the AD-FREE zone

Yes, but some of it is just too annoying. I probably won't change it, but it can get frustrating. After all, saltpeter & coal shouldn't be in such small supplies around the world.

	06-11-2001 14:11									#21
	Increase the size of your Attachments

um, but it makes you go out and fight some wars. and i really like it.
i just managed to start a world war in the medieval times. alliances formed around the strategic resources and the empires started battling it out. WW1 around 1500 and AI is really sending help and battling it out. Whoa, all that on Chieftain level

	06-11-2001 14:22									#22
	Help yourself to an AD-FREE life

Lol, the resource topic!

I thought it would be ok, but I just noticed I don't even have any iron. I just hope my culture rating will make up for that.

Playing on a sizeable continent (huge map, of course) too. Spanning 9 cities without overlap.

Oh did I mention the bloody computer opponents build their size 1 cities on every single tile they can get on *my* continent, RIGHT NEXT to my border. There are 4 opponents settling in right now. 4!!! This sort of thing is a sure-fire way to get me on my war-horse.

Aah, the first one eradicated. You're next, Abe!

	06-11-2001 14:29									#23
	Support Apolyton or Terrorists Win

quote: Originally posted by Grim Legacy Lol, the resource topic! I thought it would be ok, but I just noticed I don't even have any iron. I just hope my culture rating will make up for that. Playing on a sizeable continent (huge map, of course) too. Spanning 9 cities without overlap. Oh did I mention the bloody computer opponents build their size 1 cities on every single tile they can get on *my* continent, RIGHT NEXT to my border. There are 4 opponents settling in right now. 4!!! This sort of thing is a sure-fire way to get me on my war-horse. Aah, the first one eradicated. You're next, Abe!

hm, tokugawa tried that too but the awesome greek culture caused the inhabitants to start appreciating gyros a lot...i have two more cities now. roman one is still holding out

	06-11-2001 14:35									#24
	Increase the size of your Attachments

Bah I don't need their ill-placed camps in the wasteland. I raze them by default. Meanwhile, my borders creep up to cover all the land. That will keep them out.