03-11-2001 18:36									#1
	!!!Civ3 HUGE earth map with historically accurate starting positions!!!! Support Apolyton

Hi,

Anyone know if it will be possible to set this up? Although I enjoy a game on a randomly generated world, I've waited years for Civ 3 and the ability to start off as the Americans *IN* America, not near Rwanda.... I looked through the editor and could find NO option to specify the civ to start in a specific place, just randomly chosen civs at a specific location. Anyone else looking for this feature?

	03-11-2001 18:55									#2
	Support Apolyton buy from Amazon

But Rwanda is nice this time of year.

	03-11-2001 19:48									#3
	Support Apolyton, buy Galactic Civilizations: Deluxe Edition

MMm...tse-tse files everywhere and malaria rampant...yes. Nice if you are a ZULU!

	03-11-2001 20:24									#4
	Enter the AD-FREE zone

There's a huge world map in the files forum.

As for set starting locations, no I don't think anyones found it yet if it's there at all.

	03-11-2001 21:54									#5
	Inflate your Upload Space

This is a monumental and inexcusable failure by the CivIII team.

	03-11-2001 22:41									#6
	Help yourself to an AD-FREE life

quote: Originally posted by n.c. This is a monumental and inexcusable failure by the CivIII team.

it would seem that way. i would guess they just barely finished the earth map (or maybe they didn't, considering there's no england) and didn't have time for starting positions

i'm sure they make a map for us soon though.....i hope. atleast before the mac version comes out

	03-11-2001 22:48									#7
	Support Apolyton, buy Civilization III: Complete

i'm sure lot's of people enjoy the huge maps and 16 civs, but what about some smaller earth maps too? It might be just me, but small maps are often fun for a quick game, compared to huge maps which will usually require your entire weekend to finish

	04-11-2001 00:07									#8
	Full PM-box? Change here!

These people dared to spoil the legend of gaming.

Firaxis did the same thing as Activision and Sid Meiers did nothing to prevent it from happening!

I have played civilization since it had been released. I played on Atari, PC, Sega Genesis. I played Civ, Civ2, Civ2MGE, CivTOT. I have spent thousand of hours on it.

Finally, after being hugely disappointed with Activisions Call to Power, I have been waiting for Civ3 for more than a year. Under no other circumstances, would I have said anything bad even about the word Civilization.

HOWEVER, now that the game is released, and I have spent 60$ on the collectors edition (of coarse money does not count in cases like this and I do not want to be reimbursed) , I am realizing that these people removed all the things (although some might call them small details) that made the simple Civ2 and even, possibly, Civ infinitely better than Activision's Call to Power and Sid Meiyers Alpha Centaury combined.

What are the these things?
-Infinite replayability due to virually unlimited scenario creating possibilities
- Historic accuracy, made possible by decent world maps and accurate starting positions.

Even the world map from Civ was decent. The world maps that come with Civ3 are horryfying. On the huge map, England is a small chunck of forest above a shady peace of land that, I suppose, we should call Europe?! Come on! Madagascar is twice is big as England? And Japon? Guys you will lough! Three times bigger?
There are no rivers in Europe. Rhine, Rhone, Danube, Thames? What the hell is wrong? Spain is covered with forests. Ha, Ha, Ha.

Whatever. I do not care. Really. There are lots of qualified people out there who dedicate hundreds of hours of their lives to making Civ better. We all owe these people at least as much as to the creators of the original Civilization. Captain Nemo, Alex the Magnificent, John Petroski, Michael Jeszenka to name just a few undeniable authorities in the civilzation community.
We do not care about the maps. Just give us the tools, the platform and we'll take care of ourselves.

Is not that simple? Yes or no?
I guess it is not. These people spoiled a great game by not incluing all the good stuff that made the legend of Civ2.

I cannot play Civ3 right now. I am just too pissed off. I cannot play on a real world map with random starting places. That's impossible.

I can play on a random map, but it does not have the same charm.

It can be argued that I am making a big deal out of nothing. It is true that Civ3 remains a great game and there are lots of new great ideas, such as elite units and leaders, strategic resources, culture. Yes!
But if I cannot play WW2 scenarios I am not going to play at all. I have played so many times on random maps and went through the technology tree, that the minor changes in technologies and the effects of wonders are not going to lure me. My plan was to play a full game once on a huge world map just to get the feel of the new details and the interface and then to start making scenarios in the editor. This plan is screwed.

The dowline is: Util the game is fixed I am going to stick to CivTOT.

	04-11-2001 02:00									#9
	Support Apolyton, buy GURPS/ Alpha Centauri

I understand the fascination with recreating history and all, but you are undermining a fundamental part of Civilization. The exploration. It's not fun for me to know the entire map before I play.

	04-11-2001 02:22									#10
	Inflate your Upload Space

Some people don't want a world map, some do. Whatever you think, everyone agrees that there is a need for that map, so it should be in...

I'm sure someone will make it, but the starting positions are the problem. You can make starting positoonts, but you can't say what civ takes which point.

	04-11-2001 02:26									#11
	Support Apolyton, pre-order Civilization IV

I don't agree that there is a need for that map.
Done trolling.

	04-11-2001 02:29									#12
	Support Apolyton, buy GURPS/ Alpha Centauri

I agree, it's inexcusable that you can't set a starting location. It's a major deficiency in my opinion and I'm glad I didn't waste $50 on the game. If and when they fix this I will buy. And I hope they do, because I really, really wanted this game. I really don't care about the crappy world maps because I can always make my own; Firaxis/Microprose never made the best maps anyway, the fans did.

Another big disappointment is the lack of farmlands, with railroads reproducing this function as in Civ 1. Great, another reason to plaster the world with ugly railroads, just what I need.

	04-11-2001 02:32									#13
	Full PM-box? Change here!

Firaxis did the same thing as Activision and Sid Meiers did nothing to prevent it from happening!

You seem to imply that Sid had ultimate control.

That's probably news to him, Firaxis, and Infogrames.

	04-11-2001 02:37									#14
	Support Apolyton, pre-order Civilization IV

quote: fantomas:MMm...tse-tse files everywhere and malaria rampant...yes. Nice if you are a ZULU!

I was joking... obviously... at least to most people.

Regarding starting locations - I agree they should be included, but this is not as catastrophic as some seem to claim it is since the patch will most likely fix this. So you can't have the starting locations you want for 2months (longest it should take for 1st patch) - nothing "monumental" to cry over.

	04-11-2001 03:39									#15
	Americans in Rwanada Support Apolyton, buy Civilization 2

I have just found this forum and this is my first post. The reason I have sought out the communnity of civ lovers on-line is my utter dismay at the lack of historically accurate starting positions. Yes, the maps are not great - but they can be fixed or we can download better ones.

I implore the powers that be to fix this starting position problem(if possible) in the first patch!!! What's the point of playing a historically created civilization if you remove it from its geography?! Testing yourself in historically accurate scenarios was one of my great joys as a civ player and I fear if this goes unfixed I will put this one the shelf and go back to civ2.

How could the test team not "get it"?

	04-11-2001 04:30									#16
	Enter the AD-FREE zone

quote: Firaxis did the same thing as Activision and Sid Meiers did nothing to prevent it from happening! You seem to imply that Sid had ultimate control. That's probably news to him, Firaxis, and Infogrames.

Yeah! I think you are right. Sid has nothing to do with it!

I say thats a plot!
Bad people from Firaxis and Infogrames made a goal to destroy the Civilzation series by undermining Sid's reputation. They emprisonned Sid in a dongeon, stole everything he had planned to include in the game and just before the release changed the game so as to achieve their evil plans.
Let's not let it happen!
Let's deliver Sid from his prison and make him make another game. The one he has always wanted to make!

From now on I am starting a prived fund named: "Save Sid!"
You can send your donnations to my paypal account. I'll give you all the information you need to give me money if you send me an e-mail