07-11-2001 01:05									#1
	diplomatic solution to AI encroachment Support Apolyton, buy Alpha Centauri

Yes, I've dealt with the problem of AI settlers trying to cross my land to get to a 1-2 square "open" spot in the middle of it. One frustration is when you finally get the diplomatic option to force them to leave, they are often placed right into the spot that they are trying to get to!

Here is the most straightforward and, I think, best solution. Once an AI crosses into your land, you can tell him to leave just like it is now. But after that warning, you should have the option to tell him, via the diplomacy screen, that any more encroachment into your land by military units or settlers will be considered an automatic DECLARATION OF WAR -- by them. This would be the exact opposite of the "Right of Passage" agreement.

That will keep out the AI 95% of the team, and it gives you the right to attack anyone that encroaches.

Of course, the AI will have the option to place the same restriction on you.

	07-11-2001 04:50									#2
	Full PM-box? Change here!

I must admit, I rarely have a problem with this. When the Computer decides he likes a little spot in my country and plops down a city, my borders usually swallow the city up.

	08-11-2001 02:19									#3
	Lose 30 kilos (of popups)

You can also simply place units on the "open" squares to prevent the AI settler from getting there. If there are too many open areas, you can just use 3 units to from a moving wall and prevent the settler from moving towards you.

Kinda cheesy, but think of it as providing an "escort" for their diplomats who are touring your lands...

	08-11-2001 02:22									#4
	Support Apolyton, buy Alpha Centauri

Double Post. Friggin connection....

Last edited by David Weldon on 08-11-2001 at 02:36

	08-11-2001 02:47									#5
	Re: diplomatic solution to AI encroachment Support Apolyton, buy Civilization 2

quote: Originally posted by Ray K Yes, I've dealt with the problem of AI settlers trying to cross my land to get to a 1-2 square "open" spot in the middle of it. One frustration is when you finally get the diplomatic option to force them to leave, they are often placed right into the spot that they are trying to get to! Here is the most straightforward and, I think, best solution. Once an AI crosses into your land, you can tell him to leave just like it is now. But after that warning, you should have the option to tell him, via the diplomacy screen, that any more encroachment into your land by military units or settlers will be considered an automatic DECLARATION OF WAR -- by them. This would be the exact opposite of the "Right of Passage" agreement. That will keep out the AI 95% of the team, and it gives you the right to attack anyone that encroaches. Of course, the AI will have the option to place the same restriction on you.

The computer players do have this option, I think. After multiple transgressions they will tell you that if you do not move it will be considered an act of war.

Hey, come my avatar doesn't show up on my posts?

	08-11-2001 05:54									#6
	Avatar Enlargement: We've got the solution

I still think they should add a Monroe Doctrine that would make it an act of war for the AI to place cities anywhere on your continent. But nobody else seemed to like that idea.

Xerxes

	08-11-2001 06:00									#7
	Support Apolyton, buy GURPS/ Alpha Centauri

Settlers become immigrants after 3 turns.

or diplomatically...

"Welcome to . A visa has been issued to you for a temporary stay within our borders. Your extended stay will be taken as a desire to immigrate."

Last edited by AceCiv on 08-11-2001 at 06:33

	08-11-2001 06:39									#8
	Re: diplomatic solution to AI encroachment Tired of ads?

quote: Originally posted by Ray K Yes, I've dealt with the problem of AI settlers trying to cross my land to get to a 1-2 square "open" spot in the middle of it. One frustration is when you finally get the diplomatic option to force them to leave, they are often placed right into the spot that they are trying to get to!

For all the complaining on the board, this is the ONLY thing that has really bugged me in my playing so far. It definitely gives me the feeling that I am playing a different game than my opponents.

I don't know about a solution, though, other than to consistently give the civ (human or computer) a choice between declaring war or being take back to the last square he passed through in his own territory.

	08-11-2001 07:36									#9
	Support Apolyton or Terrorists Win

There already is an option of telling them to get out or go to war.

The only sollution for this that I can think of is to make it so that when you tell them to go out, they leave the quickest way possible, and will not enter again untill the "get out of my land" wears off. (standard 20 turns) Maybe this should only happen with the get out or go to war option, though.

	08-11-2001 07:49									#10
	Re: Re: diplomatic solution to AI encroachment Support Apolyton, pre-order Civilization IV

quote: Originally posted by old dog For all the complaining on the board, this is the ONLY thing that has really bugged me in my playing so far. It definitely gives me the feeling that I am playing a different game than my opponents. I don't know about a solution, though, other than to consistently give the civ (human or computer) a choice between declaring war or being take back to the last square he passed through in his own territory.

While I unfortunately will have to wait until the Christmas holidays before I can play Civ3, I can honestly say this kind of constant micromaging fills me with dread. I don't want to have to keep track of countless encroaching enemy settlers *every turn* to shoo them out!!

	08-11-2001 10:07									#11
	Support Apolyton

After many many hours of playing, I've come to realize one thing. As much as we HATE the trespassing, the AI suffers the same way. Ok, so it demands YOU live HIS territory. You do. Next turn, you go back. He demands again, you leave. You go back. Repeat ad nauseum. He's unlikely to declare war over it, unless he feels he can stomp you a bit (much like you on him), but he can't stop you any more than you can stop him.

The difference is the AI has the patience. It doesn't mind demanding you leave every turn. In my last game, I made myself happy to demand withdrawal every turn, and things were fine.

	08-11-2001 10:35									#12
	Avatar Enlargement: We've got the solution

Personally, I think they need to check the AIs coding on borders, because the AI seems to have NO qualms what-so-ever with just tromping through your backyard, and building right up against your borders. It's about the only major problem I've found with the AI so far, and it makes me sad. I've gone to war in my games many times because some random civ wouldn't get the hell out of my territory, then after I toss them around some, and then make peace with them, the next turn they're running around in my borders again, and bam war is redeclared

I think the settlement rule should be changed so that its war to settle right along the border, because theoretically then you can get their city, but generally those cities really blow, and I, being a perfectionist about my cities, hate to have overlap because it's obnoxious when it comes to urban planning.

	08-11-2001 12:11									#13
	Avatar Enlargement: We've got the solution

Yes, I also don't like AI settling near my border or between my cities. But I do the same to HIM. And, I think only a settler is not considered a "troop"(worker also), so you can pass through his borders and found a city on his backyard.

	08-11-2001 13:58									#14
	Support Apolyton, buy Civilization III: Complete

whenever i ask AI to leave for the second time, it leaves, because there IS an option that further tresspassing is war.

	10-11-2001 14:34									#15
	Inflate your Upload Space

Two things:

1. Godeater, just my opinion, but I don't think it's as bad as Civ2 in this regard. I have often told a settler to leave twice, and after the second time seen it turn around and go somewhere entirely different, typically a totally undisputed area.

2. I think people are complaining about three entirely different things in this thread.

First, that encroaching settlers cause a lot of wars... I agree, but I see this as realistic and far better than "arbitrary" wars over nothing at all.

Second, that this encroachment causes a lot of micromanagement... I agree, but don't think it's that bad unless your map is so big that no particular area means that much to you, in which case I would blame the size of your map. (I like the idea of huge worlds, but they really make move-to-move decisions feel less important.)

Third, that settlers are jumping forward through your territory when told to leave... I really believe this shoud be fixed.