11-11-2001 23:44									#1
	does double-price bribe protect temples, etc.? Support Apolyton buy from Amazon

Now and then I've noticed that temples, cathedrals, and courthouses do not always disappear when a city is subverted, and maybe when it's captured by force (I'm not sure about the latter). I've assumed that it was just a bug. But just now I subverted a "friendly" city for double price to avoid a governmental collapse, which I have rarely done before, and I noticed that the temple, cathedral, and courthouse all survived. Is this something that always happens when you pay double price? Has this already been noted before? The city was in disorder when I bribed it; could that matter?

	12-11-2001 00:52									#2
	Support Apolyton or Terrorists Win

no..everything in the city including improvements survive subversion intact.The only benefit of double price is you don't risk war as a result and get a collapse as a result.Only for Demo and Repub.

It says in the manual somewhere that approx 50% of improvements are lost when captured.Certain stuff goes first...there was a list in the manual iirc.

	12-11-2001 12:56									#3
	Support Apolyton

Actually this whole topic of improvements lost could use some Oedo research. I've been puzzled by the differences in damage with different cities and types of conquest. Does leaving the walls up help??

	12-11-2001 22:06									#4
	Support Apolyton, buy Call to Power 2

SlowThinker (iirc) recently posted somewhere the 3 categories of improvements, and under what circumstances they are destroyed upon city capture. Search for his recent posts, say the last month. It may have been at civfanatics, but I think maybe here...

	14-11-2001 09:07									#5
	Lose 30 kilos (of popups)

Nope, Smash, single-price subversion definitely does destroy the temples, cathedrals, and courthouses. I just verified that by testing when I saw your message.

There's no list in the manual (the manual only notes that temples and cathedrals are destroyed when a city is captured, but doesn't even acknowledge that courthouses are also destroyed). But ?SlowThinker? did recently reveal to us that there are two groups of improvements, and all of the members of one group or the other are destroyed on capture.

I subverted a bunch more cities at double price, and in every case the temple, cathedral, and courthouse remained. So, apparently, you do get a little something extra for your money when you pay double to avoid breaking a treaty.

ST, I guess this should be noted in your dips-and-spies thread.

GP, city walls don't prevent loss of improvements, just of citizens.

	15-11-2001 02:56									#6
	Support Apolyton, buy Call to Power 2

quote: Originally posted by debeest I subverted a bunch more cities at double price, and in every case the temple, cathedral, and courthouse remained. So, apparently, you do get a little something extra for your money when you pay double to avoid breaking a treaty. ST, I guess this should be noted in your dips-and-spies thread.

I am almost sure it is there.

quote: Originally posted by Marquis de Sodaq SlowThinker (iirc) recently posted somewhere the 3 categories of improvements, and under what circumstances they are destroyed upon city capture. Search for his recent posts, say the last month. It may have been at civfanatics, but I think maybe here...

My post is in the Info: Combat thread.

	16-11-2001 04:09									#7
	Got spare money?

well thats news to me.Admittedly,I often don't pay close enough attention and I bribe very little.

I could swear it was in the manual under capturing cities.Maybe it was GL.Alzheimers is kickin in