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Out4Blood
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Fighting a war on another continent can be a difficult experience. Here's a tip for making D-Day a little less tramatic by taking advantage of the AI's inability to wage war.
Once the AI has built railroads, he will respond to your invasion force IMMEDIATELY with almost every mobile unit in his entire arsenal. By fortifying your high defense infantry on a mountain with a railroad connection, you can pretty much wipe out his entire army in one turn. Make sure you are already at war with the AI, so he will attack your units on sight.
1. Split your forces in to 2 groups: Have a large invasion force ready - generally two full transports are necessary to be successful in modern ages. Also have a vanguard landing force - which is just infantry.
2. Make your large invasion force a large combined arms force: 1 part mech infantry (high defense), 1 part tank (high attack and speedy), 1 part artillery (bombardment). Make your vanguard just infantry (3-4 units, but large enough to withstand assault)
3. Drop the vanguard on the a mountain square, near an enemy town and one that is connected via rails (or roads, if no rail). Only drop your vanguard, in case he has too many units. You don't want to risk your artillery or high attack units.
4. The enemy will attack with almost everything he has. Since you are on the mountains, you will have a very high defense. Additionally, you will win may of the battles, and almost all of your units will reach elite status - you might even get a great leader out of it.
5. On the next turn, land your invasion force. The coast should be clear and you can now go on the attack without a horde of units coming after you.
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Dyrlac
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re: immediate attack of expeditionary force.
Entirely accurate. I now load up at least two full transports of mech infs/plain ole inf (gotta love the lowly spearman, which can be upgraded the whole way) alone. You have to be able to hold the ground. Armor is too precious with its double attack to waste in a non-offesnive capacity.
A deployment error in a recent campaign left a single mech inf fortified alone on a hill. The AI attacked with everything it had. My mech inf absorbed a massed attack of 8 tanks before finally dying as a hero.
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ken01
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LA, CA
Nov 2001
time: 21:16
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I've done the same thing, but my strategy is a little different.
Drop off a few mech inf on a mountain against a nuisance civilization that keeps declaring war on you for no good reason (e.g. Zulu).
He'll attack your troops til he's all out. He'll also likely draft troops as well. This will weaken him and eventually he'll give up.
Demand peace, and bam no more war.
Repeat as necessary.
When attacking, I do the same thing, except I don't bring any artillery and instead just take one city asap. Move some bombers in, and viola! you have an easy way to decimate his entire civilization. As he's throwing everything at you, you destroy all his improvements (both terrain and city) and send him back to the stone age.
Taking over other civilizations is worthless in civ3. Its just too much work and too little fun. Damn Sid for not allowing fighter jets to attack and destroy ground troops!
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Out4Blood
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Deity level now - but it's combat AI works the same on all levels, from what I understand.
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Fried_Onions
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Sorry OT but are you the O4B from AoE?
Last edited by Fried_Onions on 15-11-2001 at 02:21
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Out4Blood
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Yes I am the REAL Out4Blood :-)
(I normally make that statement as a sig - but then folks tease me making their sigs say things like - "who the hell is O4B" and stuff like that.)
You still play AOE? I have been playing Kohan, which is a marvelous piece of work. I am trying out Galactic Battlegrounds, but it is very confusing for a former AOK player - all the hotheys are screwed up! I am too lazy to reconfig.... SIGH.....
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Out4Blood
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Matty and I played quite a bit of AOK, in fact I was heavily involved in testing, both for AOK and AOK:TC. Matty was even interning at MS games during that period. Nice to see Fixit lurkers here, though.....
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napalm010
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3rd rock from sun, just down street from 7-11 :)
Nov 2001
time: 21:16
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Using the Right Of Passage to get your forces into position for suprise attack is mentioned in the manual several times. Starting the suprise attack while the ROP is in effect is said to have serious effect on how other civs deal with/ view u. How much a effect "serious" means i personally don't know.
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Sevorak
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Only thing about the RoP stab is that you'll only be able to do it once. The AI's have about twenty-five different ways to tell you off if you want to try it twice. I especially like "I'll give you a right of passage agreement - to hell!".
As for amphibious invasion, if you want to be able to do some things immediately, the key is marines. Yes, the marines' amphibious attack actually means something now, since unloading is a full-turn action now instead of a single move. It used to be that Armor could step out of a transport onto flatland and make two attacks right away. Since they can't do that anymore, a transport full of marines becomes a great asset.
How does this work? Just bombard one of their coastal cities into submission. When they're at pop<7, with most improvements piles of rubble and with all defenders bombed down to 1 hp, send in the marines. Eight vet marines should be able to take the city. The important point is to CAPTURE the city, not RAZE it. Then move your tank/artillery/otherlandunit transports in, and hit Unload, selecting to Unload All. The benefit of unloading in a city is that your units activate in that city, during the same turn, with all their movement points. Instead of simply using your first turn to dump vulnerable units onto terrain somewhere, you can seize the one city your first turn, and strike outward from that city, maybe razing a few more cities if they're close enough. Just add a couple carrierfuls of bombers to sever important rail links, and the turn-advantage this gives you can be enough to wreak desired havoc before reinforcements arrive.
-Sev
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Zorkk
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Great Underground Empire
Nov 2001
time: 22:16
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OT4B & Maimin' Matty... lol!
I was lurker on those forums, and on the AOK heaven forums too! familiar names!
I love these strategies, but why not one more.
Rather than a RoP-sneak attack, and rather than landing a full invasion force, whynot pull a feint & attack somewhere else.
Using O4B's example, You could handle it like thus:
You want a city... for whatever reason, but you KNOW the AI has a huge army, and you'd rather not run into it. So pick a spot somewhere far away from your intended target to land your feint force... sometime like the 3 or 4 inf. Provided the computer does not have railroad, you need to make sure this initial landing point is far enough from your real target so that the enemy cannot move back in one turn.
So you land your distraction force on turn one, the AI will contact you, tell you to get out or go to war. Go to war. Once the AI engages the majority of his units at that location (usually in the next turn or two) then unload your boad near your actual intended target, and mow them down.
I've found this strategy can work very well, because once you land your second force, and attack a city, the AI will break off attacking your distraction force, to go deal with this new, and bigger threat. and you can either load em back up on the boat, and go garrison your newly won city, or move them on and try taking another. Either way, the AI should be in a bit of a quandry, since it now has 2 fronts, and not sure where to go. U on the other hand, have already gotten your original objective, and might just wanna think about a peace treaty. or whatever. I've found that this type of attack quite often opens the door for a large scale invasion, because all the AI units are mulling around.
If the AI does have railroad, then this get's a bit harder, but not impossible. You just need to find the right place for your Feint force. Somewhere where they'd have to leave the railroad to attack you, yet still somewhere that's threatening to them. Newly founded/conquored cities are generally the best bet.
Zorkk
Zorkk
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CyberGnu
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of the Virtual Serengeti
Apr 1999
time: 05:16
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There's an even better strategy in any age. Use the most fearsome unti of them all - the COMBAT SETTLER!!!
Load up a whole bunch of cavalry/tanks on transports, plus a settler for each city you want to take in the first turn. Move the transports to right outside the AI border. Next turn, move in, drop off the settler one or two tiles away from the city you want to take, and return to outside the border.
The AI will ask you to remove your unti from withing his border, and you tell him you will. Since the settler isn't considered an offensive unit, the 'move automatically' option doesn't pop up.
Next turn, declare war with the AI, build a city, and then move in the transport. Unload all, and you can attack right away.
Do this with five or so cities in one go, then sue for peace. Wait a few turns to consolidate your new conquests (or jsut raze them... since you have a nice newly built city), then do it again.
Due to the poor game mechanics in Civ 3, the AI will never realize that you use your settlers offensively... and due to even worse game mechanics, establishing a city even smack down in the middle of enemy territory instantly gives you a one tile border. And since the AI usually builds his cities four or five tiles apart, your one beachhead city can usually launch an attack on two cities at once.
It's hard to fail with this strategy, since the AI never gets a chance to respond.
As an unnecessary illustration, check out this screen shot:
www.nd.edu/~joxgaard/Extra/civ1.jpg
Those are my ten tanks and six or so mech. Inf. The city contains about 10 artillery. (Almost forgot about that... Additional bonus by having your own borders, your artillery can now move two tiles and shoot, since artillery has a two tile range... )
Hopefully this will get fixed in a patch...
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Roytheboy
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Yep the Combat settler works really well. See the thread Aggresive Use of Settlers I started last week for other aggressive uses of the settler (denying resources, gaining choke points and forcing enemy to attack you etc)
Never invade without a good supply of setlers
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martin3393
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Austin, TX
Nov 2001
time: 05:16
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Hey, I recently achieved a science victory in Regent mode in 1802, but kept playing the game so that I could learn how the contemporary units work (I keep winning before I complete the tech tree). After building up a pretty good army (8 radar artillery; 10 modern armor; 10 mechanized infantry; 8 marines), I invaded my neighbor (who was technologically far behind); everything was going swell until cities started deposing me.
I was conquering size 10-12 cities, getting 5-6 resistors, garrisoning plenty of units, quelling resistance in the second or third round, but then being ousted (after the resistance is over!) shortly thereafter.
What is really disturbing, of course, is the fact that I had about two dozen units (mainly bombers, transports, and healing offensive units) in the city at the time. I'm losing far more units to being deposed than I am to enemy action (five citizens evidently carry the day against an immense army)!
I'm wondering how people are dealing with this issue. Should I just be razing all my conquered cities and replacing them? That seems a waste. Should I just refuse to keep very many units in conquered cities? That seems inconvenient. What are my alternatives? Am I missing some sort of espionage option?
Thanks for the advice.
Martin
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rugbyprop3
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Milwaukee, WI, USA
Nov 2001
time: 23:16
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Does anyone know if you can bombard with artillery that are on transports? Cuz if you could you would have 8 bombardments possible from a ship that have range and power that = > than the battleship.
Just a crazy brainstorm while at work away from the game.
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Padmewan
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Cambridge, MA
Dec 2001
time: 05:16
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I've been doing some experimentation and found that starving high-culture cities will often keep them from reverting. You must be vigilant every turn to turn everyone into taxmen (the best use for them) until the city is, I dunno, half its starting size.
As a bonus, bring in workers and supplement the native people with yours.
I found this works by reloading whenever a city reverts and trying the starvation route... it's worked for me every time (only thrice, I admit).
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martin3393
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Austin, TX
Nov 2001
time: 05:16
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Starving them does work, it seems. I've been replaying my little invasion and with the following tactics, and I've taken six cities and not yet been deposed once.
1) I take the city and garrisoned a number of troops equal to the resisters. When the resistance is quelled, I make sure that virtually no units remain in the town (except one I don't mind losing); instead I establish my defensive lines outside the city.
2) Then I keep the town starving by setting most of the citizens to entertainers or other specialists. Of course, this means that the town is not in civil disorder either.
So far, this is working very well.
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14-11-2001 01:09
It would certainly be interesting if they changed the game so that wheeled and treaded units coudlnt' travers mountains either. Hmmm.
I tried out the swbg demo. That was fun. I love the thing that makes techs and units build faster! hehe.
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