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datakodin
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Russia
May 2001
time: 08:16
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quote:
Originally posted by Seeker
1. Crime reform: they put away too many people who essentially turn to crime because it is a relatively stable society and hope for advancement. The prison system they have nowadays must be destroyed. They must go after the big bosses, not the average joes.
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I do not really understand you. OK, destroy the prison and now what?
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2. Russia needs a Hollywood of its own. By that I mean a media, propaganda and entertainment complex like what one sees in America. The people need, essentially, to see a hero and to hear positive stories. The Hollywood of a country greatly influences the popular morale and morality.
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Are you speechwriter of Communist Party? Actually, most of us are happy we do not have Hollywood now. Cartoon hero can not protect you against a real attack but you neighbour in real life can. When a hundred of our paratroopers fighted knife-to-knife with a thousand of Chechen rebels, the last thing they dreamed was to be heroes of Hollywood-like movie.
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3. Russia needs a service economy. This means that it needs a 'service ethic'. Russia and Canada are quite similar in many respects, but this is a big difference. It needs a consumer electronics industry. It needs some small, risk taking banks to provide capital!
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Generally, we do not trust to banks now after the crisis of 1998. The amount of US dollars, what we have in our hands, is enough to pay our debts completely; however, we keep it at home. It is a real problem.
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4. Russia needs nerds!! By that I mean it needs the peculiar Western social and educational creature who does not merely fill but enjoys technico-creative occupations.
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We have already. More than you have.
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5. Russia needs fantasy. It needs fantasy in order to spark imagination and creativity. This is tied to #2.
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See previous answer.
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6. Russia needs an open relationship with China. In fact, Russia should concentrate on moving closer together with China as much as possible, especially in the area of trade and immigration.
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Thank you very much, you are so kind!
But we prefer Iran.
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How I see Russia now: A gigantic version of Flint, Michigan. |
I can find neither Flint nor Michigan of my map of world. Can you explain me where is it?
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datakodin
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Russia
May 2001
time: 08:16
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quote:
Originally posted by Cossack
Happy in Moscow
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It's an entirely Western and at times uneducated view.
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It does not seem to be strange. Russian view for West is an entirely Eastern and often uneducated one.
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However, the country effectively has no middle class especially in the provinces, you are either rich or poor.
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Right and wrong. The rich men in the provinces are equal to the middle class in capitals.
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Also Putin's true goals are not clear yet, he could be setting up a power base for his own people.
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Those 70% of Russians who supports Putin do not care.
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The country is trying to diversify its economy away from a strong dependence on oil and gas its major source of tax revenues. Recently a series of reforms have been passed in particular land reform which has been a contentious issue should set the stage for further significant reforms going forward.
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What reforms do you mean?!
We are not so depended on oil and gas. Nuclear industry export (Iran, China, India - for sure, Finland, Southern America - maybe). Weapon trade (Iran, India, China, a lot of other countries). Space industry (enough to say, Dennis Tito). Actually, our techology is very competetive in the third world. With near-to-Western quality, we propose much cheaper price.
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As a result people often lack initiative but will work tremendously hard if you give them a list of things to do.
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Not exact. What is the problem - if you want to make a business in Russia, you have to find some protective elements. I mean, the criminals, the police force, even FSB. If you succeed, you will not have any problem in the future. Not very good way, I agree.
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Middle management...
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Almost 70% of the wealth of Russia gravitates towards Moscow and St. Petersburg so these two cities are completely different from the situation in the rest of the country.
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This is some kind of bla-bla-bla typical for mass-media. Forget your BBC in Moscow! Money are widely distributed in Russia. Those regions who are involved in export are richer than others.
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As for Russian women, yes the percentage of beautiful/above average looking women is probably much higher than in the west.
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Russia is a great country with masses of freedom...
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Oh yes, we have the masses of freedom right now. Too much freedom, I have to say 
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However, if you can't live without a MacDonalds 10 metres from your house
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Do not make people confused. There are a lot of McDonalds in Moscow and Moscow regions. They are used by children and visitors from other cities. The problem is those BigMac are too bad for Rusian taste.
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The English Cossack (Happy in Moscow)
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Kropotkin
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of Ålidhem
Mar 1999
time: 06:16
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Have been at a seminar about the forest industry in the Russian economy the past week. I have to say that some of you peoples talks about the economic growth and the wonders of market economy after the communist era is amusing.
Russia is an economic black hole, lacking almost all forms of working institutions, laws and not least norms for a working market economy.
The seminar I mentioned above shows that the economy in many aspects is going backwards from a market economy since the early years. Although the empirical parts of the research is a bit weak it's still have a lot more empirical facts than most of those economic 'forecasts'. Applying simple models from the western world together with a few key statistics isn't doing it for the riddle, wrapped in a mystery trapped in an enigma that is Russia.
Many so called companies in Russia is still working with more goals than profits, using barters, lacking contacts with anything resembling a bank while the need for contacts in the nomenklature is essential.
Last edited by Kropotkin on 18-11-2001 at 18:41
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Seeker
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London Ontario
Jan 1970
time: 00:16
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Flint, Michigan was the stereotypical 'industrial city'.
The city was almost entirely oriented around one automobile corporation. During the economic changes of the 1990s (downsizing, Mexican outsourcing) Flint became obsolete. There were a series of harebrained attempts to revive it, but it has dropped from being a very prosperous city in the 50s to a post-industrial wasteland in the 90s.
About the whole Hollywood thing:
during the Gulf War (and in other recent wars) Fleer, baseball card manufacturer, immediately came out with cards simplifying the figures and equipment of the war with 'stats' what 'team' it was on, etc. There were also the usual deluge of magazines, video games, and movies, all strongly patriotic.
As a result of this media complex, the American public is much less cynical and is more united. When wars break out Americans line up to enlist. The popular and enthusiatic support of the American public is a force of almost infinite power. You could say that technology insulates the Americans from real war. Of COURSE it does, anyone who is not a fool wants to be as isolated from real war as possible. It is because of the relative unity and enthusiam of the public that military research is possible. And with the products of that tremendous unity and enthusiasm (team spirit?) the Americans can fight a 'push-button' war that does not disillusion the soldiers.
In contrast to the Russians...the public is not enthusiastic and united. In fact, they must use conscription and people fake sickness to avoid their duty. The mob of the common people is disillusioned, that is the problem I was getting at. A country can never be great if its citizens are cynical and suspicious and disunited. Look at the sort of films and literature produced during a modern Russian war about that war!! It is all intellectual and cynical....
The passions of the common herd are not enflamed by abstract intellectual concerns, the heart of the common man is reached only by simplifying a message into black and white, good and evil terms and then hammering the message home until it sticks. It is no wonder that there is corruption. The propaganda of the Soviet era was very ham-fisted and laughable, Russians should look overseas we have made great strides in influencing the general will in the western democracies.
Another contrast is religious. America is perhaps the most religious Western nation. Religion is an excellent way of uniting and spurring the people! It creates a team spirit, individual work ethic (not merely working hard like a washingmachine).
Bureaucracy: Why on earth so much bureaucracy?? Don't the police and officials know that they have no other purpose but to serve the customer and make them happy? Consider almost any procedure. Especially, in the modern world, travel. People from truly civilized countries travelling to other, supposedly civilized countries expect that once they have a visa approved thats that....not in Russia!! Each region, even city has nonsense. The level of professionalism is poor. The relatively free flow of goods and people across the US-Canada border is unimaginable in that land.
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datakodin
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Russia
May 2001
time: 08:16
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Seeker, thanx for Flint. I did not know this.
About Gulf war and others. Sorry, Seeker, but I think the hiding of real US military casualties is more important thing for the American society than anything other. Until the USA has loss-free wars or at least until US generals tell it, no problems would be with the unity of society and other things. But OK - no rumours until they attack one of Russian's evil enemy, Taleban.
Actually, we had already the excellent - not laughable - propraganda machine in Soviet Union. I can tell you it is not a panacea. That machine did not prevent the crash of the USSR.
Recently, we have an allergy for any attempts to manipulate us directly. Indirectly, yes, it happens still.
Conscription is not a real problem. The problem was the country did not paid well to our militaries. Now the situation is improving litlle by litlle. BTW we have enough people who are ready to serve in the military forces as the professionals. The stories about unfortunate conscripts are going to the past. Our special forces and paratroopers are quite well. Even heard about some "accidents" between Russian paratroopers and UK KFOR-soldiers in Pristina aeroport at the very beginning of Kosovo operation?
Religion? First of all, we are multy-religious country. In Moscow, there are at least 2 million of muslims. Paying attention to Orthodox Christianity, we are risky to have the civil war with the partisans of Islam.
Bureaucracy? Yes, you are right. It is the problem. And it is the historical problem. We were, are and will be the bureaucratic country. However, if you can not change the environment - change yourself. There are - and you can find it - the effective ways to do the business under such conditions even.
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Roman
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Bratislava, Slovakia
Sep 2000
time: 05:16
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quote:
Originally posted by datakodin
Roman, what's hell! Where do you buy this story about AIDS danger for Russia?
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See my link. I have done quite some research on this and there are plenty of sources. A good place to start is BBC website, or United Nations (especially World Health Organisation) websites. There are also many NGO's dealing with AIDS and they have plenty of statistics. Last but not least, you may want to check out the Russian health ministry and the Russian centre dealing with the fight against AIDS. There are 'only' somewhat over 150,000 registered people that are HIV positive in Russia, but the Russian authorities acknowledge that the real number is at least 20 times higher (after all if one doesn't know he/she has AIDS he/she is not going to register). That puts the total number of infected at over 3 million.
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You know, I'm living in Russia long time, actually, from my birth. And I never heard about AIDS as a real threat for Russia.
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That is exactly part of the problem. Most Russians are not familiar with the fact that AIDS is increasingly rampant in Russia. As a result they do not take precautions against it. Even many that are aware have the "it ain't gonna happen to me" attitude, which is very dangerous.
AIDS only started becoming widespread in Russia in the mid 1990s. The incubation period is approximately 10-12 years. Hence the first mass deaths from AIDS will only happen 5-6 years from now and from then on it will be downhill. It will just get rapidly worse and worse with vast numbers of people dying. At the moment it is still not too late to avert a complete disaster, but little action is being taken and hence AIDS will probably become a major epidemic in Russia that will be killing the Russian nation. Please Russians, do something about it! 
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Drugs - yes. But you can fight it. In my town, the police forces destroy finally the drug seller network. Now those persons who can not live without heroin or I-do-not-know-what-else should go to neighbour towns, 10-15 km away. We dream the police departments of neighbour towns will also do their work and we would be drug-free zone.
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Drugs are part of the problem. Many people using narcotics share needles and this spreads AIDS even faster. When addicts are then put into prisons, they, ehm, pass AIDS on to their inmates too.
However, increasingly AIDS is being spread through Russia by unsafe sex as well as drugs.
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Roman
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Bratislava, Slovakia
Sep 2000
time: 05:16
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quote:
Originally posted by faded glory
Son of a b!tch 
that last post was meant for PBEM. I have to stop doing multiple replys in multiple windows.
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Lol, it happens...
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**** I feel bad for you then. This is the legacy of Communism in most EE states. I can imagine your country has to dig itself out of a hole in regards to the healthcare system
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Yep, Communism ****** us up. The healthcare system was actually reasonably decent during the socialist times, but it concentrated too much on cure and too little on prevention. Furthermore, it was only good at dealing with infectious diseases and trailed far behind West in areas like cancer treatement, or dealing with heart disease.
Anyway the Communist healthcare system was funded in an unsustainable way. The government took all of the (state owned, naturally) companies' profits and even 95% of their recapitalisation funds  to pay for the healthcare system, education, defense and whatever was left over was redistributed to industries according to either arbitary criteria, or in such a way as to support the most inefficient industries  to keep up employment. The system just had to collapse.
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Btw......I just checked the map. Forgive for my ignorance but when did Slovakia and Chezk republic split up  |
Czechoslovakia split up into Czech Republic and Slovakia on 1st January 1993. After Communism collapsed in November 1989, Czechoslovakia become a normal federation of two states - Czech and Slovak. The Slovak government, however, felt that Slovaks are being excluded from all the top positions in the Federal government and thought it would be better to become independent, or even better turn the arrangement into a confederation. The Czech government in turn thought that Slovakia's poorer economy is holding the Czech republic down and hence also decided it would be better to separate the two, but they rejected the idea of a confederation and went for downright independence. The two governments negotiated how to split federal property after the separation and decided that the split will occur on 1st January 1993. The matter was not put before the people in a referendum, because it would almost certainly have failed (see the case of Quebec in Canada for comparison).
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chegitz guevara
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Ft. Lauderdale, FL Communist Party of Apolyton
Jun 2000
time: 00:16
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quote:
Originally posted by faded glory
Ya I know how you feel. But the risk is too great. Sure, .3% isnt alot. But it sure sucks if your in that .3% especially when 30 million people or so will get flu shots.
Sorry, the Flu is an inconvience at worst. The Consequences of being in that .3% are morbidly painful. |
Influenza kills thousands of people each year in the United States. More die from related illnesses which they contract in their flu weakened state, such as pneumonia. Forty people in the US die each year from the flu vacine.
You are a statistical fool, Faded.
I myself almost died from the flu nine years ago. I was so weakened by the flu that I had a massive asthma attack, and I had gone through all my medicine and had to drive home to get more (about 40 miles away). It was New Year's Eve, everything was closed, and BAM! I had a flat tire. It was at that point I stopped breathing. Theben took over driving (about a mile, mile and a half) to a gas station that was fortunately open, where I staggered in and collapsed.
What was I doing out? I had thought I was well, I hadn't had any flu symptoms for a week. Apparently, I was wrong.
Don't be a fool. Flu kills, and it kills many, many people. World wide it is a major killer. And then there are those years with the really nasty flus, like 1918, 1976, 1992. It's not an inconvenience.
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Roman
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Bratislava, Slovakia
Sep 2000
time: 05:16
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Im curoius to know what living under Communism was like. work, spare time, oppurtunitys, media...
was it all as American media said it was?A living hell? Or was our side just spittin propaganda.
Hmm, I have a tendency to give a very negative answer, because my family fared rather badly under the system. My grandfather was persecuted, imprisoned, tortured, forbiden to work, etc. He was a writer, who was not trotting the party line and the family suffered as a result. For example, the Communists did not want to admit my mother into high school (eventuallly they conceded) and then to university (yet again, eventually they said "ok" but she had to study something they assigned her [ie. Russian language]). Then they did not want to admit me into primary school claiming that I will be unable to write. Hence I had to learn to write at home before going to school in order to 'prove' that I can write. The list of their abuses to us just went on and on. We were spied upon by the STB. I don't even need to talk about confiscation of our property (and we never got it back even after Communism collapsed [our new government just privatised it to some of their family members ]). Not suprisingly I am not a great fan of Communism. Luckily, I only had to suffer it for 8 years of my life and hence remember only isolated incidents and these years were comparatively liberal compared with what went on before.
For most people, though, life was not a complete hell in the 1980s. The further back you go the worse life was. Of course, the freedom of assembly/expression issue was always there and we were constantly subjected to Communist propaganda in the media especially concerning the successes of the regime in agriculture . However, material standard of living reached relatively high levels by 1980s - lines for food became rarer and many families could afford to have a (poor quality, socialist) car. This was an era of liberalisation, though, under Gorbachev's Perestroika, when some limited private enterprise was already allowed. When Communism was at its height, life had been much much worse, probably something akin to what your media described.
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Roman
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Bratislava, Slovakia
Sep 2000
time: 05:16
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quote:
Originally posted by chegitz guevara
Influenza kills thousands of people each year in the United States. More die from related illnesses which they contract in their flu weakened state, such as pneumonia. Forty people in the US die each year from the flu vacine.
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If the 0.3% statistic is right and it is given to 30 million people each year, that would make 9,000 death from the vaccine each year. If immunisation were made compulsory for the nearly 300 million people in the US, that would bring the numbers up to 90,000. That is not an insignificant number.
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I myself almost died from the flu nine years ago. I was so weakened by the flu that I had a massive asthma attack, and I had gone through all my medicine and had to drive home to get more (about 40 miles away). It was New Year's Eve, everything was closed, and BAM! I had a flat tire. It was at that point I stopped breathing. Theben took over driving (about a mile, mile and a half) to a gas station that was fortunately open, where I staggered in and collapsed.
What was I doing out? I had thought I was well, I hadn't had any flu symptoms for a week. Apparently, I was wrong.
Don't be a fool. Flu kills, and it kills many, many people. World wide it is a major killer. And then there are those years with the really nasty flus, like 1918, 1976, 1992. It's not an inconvenience. |
Flu is only an inconvenience unless one is either in a weakened state (such as soldiers after WW I), or one belongs to a vulnerable group of people. Such people should indeed be given the vaccine as their risk of dying from a flu is greater. However, there is no point giving the vaccine to healthy people with good immune systems if it is so risky.
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faded glory
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This trash talking 2 bit dope dealer is about to learn respect for the law
Jan 2001
time: 05:16
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quote:
Originally posted by chegitz guevara
Influenza kills thousands of people each year in the United States. More die from related illnesses which they contract in their flu weakened state, such as pneumonia. Forty people in the US die each year from the flu vacine.
You are a statistical fool, Faded.
I myself almost died from the flu nine years ago. I was so weakened by the flu that I had a massive asthma attack, and I had gone through all my medicine and had to drive home to get more (about 40 miles away). It was New Year's Eve, everything was closed, and BAM! I had a flat tire. It was at that point I stopped breathing. Theben took over driving (about a mile, mile and a half) to a gas station that was fortunately open, where I staggered in and collapsed.
What was I doing out? I had thought I was well, I hadn't had any flu symptoms for a week. Apparently, I was wrong.
Don't be a fool. Flu kills, and it kills many, many people. World wide it is a major killer. And then there are those years with the really nasty flus, like 1918, 1976, 1992. It's not an inconvenience. |
No you are the fool.
You are creating an epidemic in the making. Each time you get a flu shot your body becomes immune to that strain. The strains eventually warp and get more sophisticated as each year goes by. Eventually when you do get the flu again, it will many fold worse than what it was the first time you got it. So you Che are the only fool here.... Eventually 30 years down the road...they wont be able to make a vaccine for it.
I also take issue with Anti-Bacterial soap. All your doing is creating super-bugs that have built up resistance.
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17-11-2001 20:44
(for the benefit of readers mostly and for myself when I look back)
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