16-11-2001 19:09									#1
	Plz dont release unfinished Increase Your PM Length

There have been too many games I have purchased lately the day it was released where I ended up being a beta tester. I can name a bunch off the top of my head. World War 2 online. Civ3. Pools of Radiance. Crimson Skies. Anarchy Online. etc.
So far the Moo series has been awesome, Just like the Civ series, however Civ3 has just a few too many bugs that just a little bit of beta testing would have caught. I wont buy Civ4 when it comes out because of this. If the developers read this, please, make sure the Game is released, at the very least, relatively bug free.

	16-11-2001 20:22									#2
	Support Apolyton, pre-order Civilization IV

We're going to do our best...

	16-11-2001 22:39									#3
	Increase the size of your Attachments

quote: Originally posted by Stormhound We're going to do our best...

Now that's something I never saw any Civ 3 designer to say here on Apolyton!

	17-11-2001 06:10									#4
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Also, I repeat myself, I'm STILL amazed on how much info they share with the fans - much more than Firaxis ever did. The better the chances then for a more balanced game with fewer minor bugs, depending on how serious will be the beta testing.

	19-11-2001 13:21									#5
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Please dont repeat Civ 3 and give us a Beta or plain lie about whats in the game

	20-11-2001 02:23									#6
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quote: Originally posted by Deathwalker Please dont repeat Civ 3 and give us a Beta or plain lie about whats in the game

So far as the latter point, did you dig back to find the thread where we announced certain features that were definitely being cut? We're trying to play straight with you folks...the fan community has been a crucial part of getting MOO3 done, and I suspect we'll be coming back to you on other projects as well (especially MOM2, if we get that project).

	20-11-2001 05:02									#7
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quote: Originally posted by Stormhound and I suspect we'll be coming back to you on other projects as well (especially MOM2, if we get that project).

Maybe you all could do civ4...

	20-11-2001 05:30									#8
	Avatar Enlargement: We've got the solution

quote: Originally posted by GP Maybe you all could do civ4...

Maybe you all could do civ3 ...

	20-11-2001 05:38									#9
	Got spare money?

Somebody needs to!!



And Alan Emrich is the MAN! Love his essay on strat guides!

With him leading a project, we might even be able to get some better done tie-in documentation.

	20-11-2001 15:11									#10
	Remove this text

I did not mean you lied, I meant Firaxis lied about Civ 3, multiplayer, scenarios and in box scenarios. All lies by a company that only cares about the bottom line. Not MOO3, I just dont want a repeat

	20-11-2001 21:24									#11
	Enter the AD-FREE zone

I didn't think you had said we lied...I was just making sure you saw that thread so you wouldn't have reason to say so later.

	23-11-2001 07:02									#12
	Tired of ads?

quote: Originally posted by Deathwalker I did not mean you lied, I meant Firaxis lied about Civ 3, multiplayer, scenarios and in box scenarios. All lies by a company that only cares about the bottom line. Not MOO3, I just dont want a repeat

Hmm, no offense, but if you have any inside information regarding exactly why those features were not included in the game, share them? My impression so far is that Infogrames are the ones to be flamed, not necessarily Firaxis, but I might have misunderstood the situation. I might indeed be living in a dreamworld, but frequently a developer team tend to consider their product their "baby" and want it to be as perfect as possible, while their publisher does not necessarily have to share that notion.

	23-11-2001 10:42									#13
	Lose 30 kilos (of popups)

I would love to know more about the relationship of developers and publishers (and the situation w/in integrated houses).

For instance, I could see the opposite happening too. The publisher pays a set fee (advance on royalties) and expects a complete project at a set time. And the developer could have an incentive to not deliver entire thing or to ask for extra time (as project runs into problems.)

	10-12-2001 19:10									#14
	Got spare money?

I have read a lot about the game from the designers on this game and i believe that moo2 was the greatest game made at the time of its release. Im crossing my fingers for Moo3. If Infrocrack tries to pressure u guys into releasing an unfinished product and u need somebody to lean on the a little bit dont hesitate to ask

	10-12-2001 22:17									#15
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quote: Originally posted by CB2034 If Infrocrack tries to (...)

Actually, that's InfoGreed...

	11-12-2001 22:16									#16
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I know it's easy to paint Infogrames as the villain in this situation, but just remember that nobody is completely innocent.

Thus far, I've been enjoying all the positive things about having a job in the gaming industry. Watching the events unfolding after the release of Civ3 has given me an awfully lot to think about, and is explaining some things I didn't really understand on a personal level about how the negative side of it can get to people. (If you know you're going to get raked over the coals by some people no matter what you do, there's a strong temptation to just say the heck with it. I suspect that giving in to that temptation is what ends one's ability to do worthwhile, daring and original work.)

There's a certain combination of both excitement and fear in releasing one's labor of love to the general public...and no matter how well we do, there will always be embarrassment at every single mistake. We'll do our best, folks, and we'll try to pick up our messes as best we can. You'll be the judge of how well we do.

I think that's about the extent of my useful commentary on the subject.

	14-12-2001 09:34									#17
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My concern is not so much that too many features are going to be cut; even with the regrettable loss of the Ethos system, the inclusion of IFP's is a unique enough inclusion in MOO3 that I doubt that the game will be MOO2.5. My concern is the same concern as I've got with Morrowind, the upcoming sequel to Daggerfall; Daggerfall was a great game that didn't work, and I'm worried that Morrowind will be the same way. If MOO3 is released with something substantive missing, like multiplayer, then I'll be upset but I'll deal with it. But if it's released like Daggerfall was, where it's so buggy that it just flat out doesn't work, then I'll be upset, but I'll also have serious second thoughts about buying the game. There's nothing more frustrating than a broken game.