20-11-2001 06:52									#1
	absent resource, worldwide? Increase Your PM Length

Hmmm, I'm in a game right now where there appears to be no coal, in the entire world. Is this possible??

bone

	20-11-2001 07:21									#2
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Interesting! Never seen this in any of my games. There's alway's been at least 1 (on one of my games, just 1 saltpeter showed up... hehe)

I have had resources "appear" on me, after i've done some improving. One game, I deforested a square, and 3 horses showed up all around that square.. was damn nice! haven't seen it happen since tho!

Z

	21-11-2001 00:21									#3
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I've had that happen twice. No coal. Nothing in my borders. None of the other civs have any either. I got battleships and aircraft carriers but no railroads.

	21-11-2001 00:28									#4
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Could it be that you just haven't discovered the right technology yet? If I recall things correctly, it takes certain technologies to actually see certain resources, so that it would look like the resource suddenly appears out of thin air when you discover the technology.

	21-11-2001 00:47									#5
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hmmm... [sheepish grin] there was plenty, just very difficult to spot. Some of my neighbors still had a lot of jungle not cleared. Of course, none in my territory, but I have been able to trade the germans for 1 of their 3 deposits, so I'm good to go.

Interestingly, I noticed if you are missing any of the strategic resources, the best one to be missing is coal. It's cheap to get from another civ, and all you need it for is 2 deals, that's enough to get the railroads built. The era of ironclads is very short if you are geared up for research.

They need to make all the resources easier to spot. Sometimes, I can't find where I'm getting my own resources from...

bone

	21-11-2001 01:45									#6
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You say you found coal after you cleared some jungle? I never tried that. I'll give it a try. I've only been looking in the hills.

	21-11-2001 01:50									#7
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Coal is there, it just is the hardest resource to find.

1.It has the lowest Appearance Ratio at 120.
2.It EASILY can blend in with the terrain (jungle, etc.) making it appear as if it doesn't exist. Suggestion: Set your contrast on your monitor VERY high so it will be easier to see.


However, I wonder what would happen if you built cities on resources before they were revealed. Does that resource suddenly remain buried & unusable until the city is razed OR does the resource appear elsewhere on the map?

	21-11-2001 03:15									#8
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I just had the same thing happen to me in my first game. No coal whatsoever. Is this a bug?

	21-11-2001 04:08									#9
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AHO: neighbors did. I think it was already there, just impossible to spot in the fog of war. Once they cleared jungle, I could see it. I don't think it appeared because they were clearing jungle... I believe that is a myth.

Bismark: It's there, just difficult to spot. When I first encountered this, I though it might be a bug, but at the end of the day, it's just difficult to spot.

This game has become interesting as I'm playing it. The germans sold me coal for two deals, and I got ALL railroads built by my army of workers. Then, at the end of the second deal, a coal resource appeared in my territory (when I don't need it!! ) So I did not renew the deal, they declared war on me (bastards!), Aztecs joined in, and they are both now being roundly pummelled by my American self and the Irriquois, who sit between me and both of them How lovely for the dumb bastards!!... I have by far the most powerful military, but they took me on anyway... tanks are chewing up jaguar warriors for snacks

Cheers.

bone

	21-11-2001 04:08									#10
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Latent resources under your cities suddenly appear in the resources list of your Trade Advisor. No announcement; they just show up. Clearing forests or jungles, building cities, even global warming have no effect on the appearance or availability of resources. The seeds for these are obviously set at the beginning of the game.

Additionally, the developer claims the system is designed to provide at least one of every resource per civ on the map. May have been referring to strategic resources, but you get the drift. Oil and coal are very hard to spot. Additionally, civs that don't have the tech for them don't seem to be aware of latent resource existance. Add the fog of war, and some of them are very difficult to find.