26-11-2001 05:00									#1
	Father Beast's Non-Warmonger, Non-competitive Review of Civ3 Support Apolyton buy from Amazon

OK, here it is:

I got the game a few weeks ago and started playing before I had read more than a few pages in the manual:

GOOD: I could play without reading the manual. The interface comes really easily, and even though I didn't know how to use the "D" button down by the info box, I could also contact other civs by clicking on their pic in the foreign advisor screen. Multiple ways to do things abound in the interface.
BAD: we Really need a link to the civilopedia in the build queue and in the diplomacy screen. Maybe in a patch?.
DON'T KNOW: Corruption is always a problem. Even on chieftan. Even in the capitol. Even in the capitol with a courthouse and under a democracy. Also I found out quickly why I saw all those mined grasslands in the screenshots. I found myself on an entire section of continent with no rivers. I mined because I could not irrigate.

So I decided to take a day off and read the rest of the manual.

Then I returned to play at every chance I could for the next 2 weeks.

A lot of things are a bit different. The hunt for resources is a bother at first, but I got into it pretty quick. I had no Iron in my homeland, penned in by the Zulus, and I went to another continent and founded a couple of colonies there (at ruinous rates of corruption), and rush built the harbors needed to link it up. I even pushed out past foreign territory to get the saltpeter when it appeared. The coal was all in the babylonian heartland for some reason, but I was able to trade for it without much difficulty. Uranium I needed for a spaceship part at the end, but nobody had the tech for it but me, so I couldn't trade for it. I found a civ with some uranium, then sold them techs over the next few turns, getting outrageously rich. Unfortunately, when they got the tech they refused to trade any Uranium with me. I had to go get it some other way.

I worked hard to get all the spaceship parts, and finally launched in 2034. I was disappointed that the game ended with the launch, and I didn't get to race to AC.

Launched in 2034? And I was playing on chieftan? I must be a lousy player, but I must say this: when they said that chieftan is easier in civ3 than it was in civ2, they were lying through their teeth!

OK, the rundown:
Graphics: Do I care? I am a bit upset that I can't ell how many units are on a stack unless I right-click on it, or even if there?s more than one, like I could in civ2. Otherwise, they're fine.
Gameplay: I don't know how, but they've got it down. This is absolutely the most addicting game I have ever played! More so than Diablo or Master Of Orion. I find myself dragging my body out of bed at absurd hours because I have to try something I was dreaming about! My wife has learned to cover the screen if she wants me to hear her. I can't seem to stop playing. It is as fascinating as I have imagined.
Sound: Do I care? The Yanni concert in modern times gets on my kids nerves, though.
Diplomacy: except for a civilopedia link during negotiations, I can't think how to make it better.
Editor: I'm not sure, since I haven't had much time to play with it yet. I am a bit frustrated on how to get it to do things I want it to, though. Maybe I should read the help file?.
Stability: min specs are PII300, 32MBRAM, recommended PII500, 64MBRAM. PCGamer recommends PIII600, 128MBRAM. I Have PII450, 128MBRAM. It runs ok, though there is a slight pause in just about everything, like map scrolling. The civilopedia or advisors take a second to come up. The computer on a standard map never took more than a minute to take its turn. I did notice that it crashes after about 5 hours of playing. And I have to reboot after playing Civ3, because nothing else will run right afterward.

Allright, I like it. But I hadn't applied the acid test yet. I said I wanted a game that makes me think of Civ2 as "Civ3 lite". I started a game of Civ2.

I liked the wonder movies, and laughed at my high council's antics. I missed those things. Then I started getting frustrated. I couldn?t declare war except by provocation, those ZOC's look really silly, negotiations are limited. I was irritated that blocking resources made little or no difference to my opponents, because they really didn't need them. The goto function was unseen and stupid (sent my ironclad to circumnavigate the world when I wanted him to move 10 spaces west). It all seemed so simplistic and limited.
CIV3 PASSES!

Comments invited.

	26-11-2001 05:45									#2
	Tired of ads?

A good review there Father!! I'm also a bit annoyed with the wonder movies (or there lack of) in civ3. Firaxis claimed they didn't want to take the player out of the "immersive" game world. So, instead of giving us hundreds of frames of animation for a wonder, we get one frame - a still picture!! I feel like I'm getting taken out of the game world - so how would have including wonder movies done any more damage? This wasn't a design decision from Firaxis - it was a "we're lazy" decision. It angers me!!

That, really, is my only major gripe with the game!

	26-11-2001 21:05									#3
	Support Apolyton buy from Amazon

I agree - very good review - much like my experience of the game, and very modest patching requests!

My main gripe is related to your comment about stacks - on SMAC you got all information about the square under the cursor: units, terrain, and improvements.

Currently, if you are on a square with several workers, you have no way of telling what work the others are doing. Also, when you move a unit, you cannot see how many movement points are left.

I don't understand how they lost this from the interface - I thought they had worked from SMAC, but I don't see many useability lessions learnt from that game.

	26-11-2001 21:29									#4
	Tired of ads?

Fairly good review, but the game is so much better with war
At least Civ II was.
You should try war

	26-11-2001 22:03									#5
	Re: Father Beast's Non-Warmonger, Non-competitive Review of Civ3 Increase the size of your Attachments

quote: Originally posted by Father Beast OK, the rundown: Graphics: Do I care? I am a bit upset that I can't ell how many units are on a stack unless I right-click on it, or even if there?s more than one, like I could in civ2. Otherwise, they're fine. CIV3 PASSES!

You can see how many units are in a stack... but it's hard to see and if there are too many (more than 8 or 9) you won't be able to tell the exact amount. If you look at the map, where units are stacked you'll notice a series of small white horizontal lines next to the top unit in the stacks image. The number of lines indicates the number of units in the stack. When the stack gets to large the lines run together so that you can't get the exact number, but you'll be able to see that you're screwed if the stack of 10 war elephants is coming after your warriors

Hope this helps.

	27-11-2001 00:15									#6
	Support Apolyton, buy Galactic Civilizations: Deluxe Edition

Excellent review, thanks!

-quinalla

	27-11-2001 00:43									#7
	Support Apolyton, buy GURPS/ Alpha Centauri

You can tell how many moves are left. It's the penultimate number on the stats line.

	27-11-2001 07:40									#8
	Enter the AD-FREE zone

quote: Originally posted by fluffy I agree - very good review - much like my experience of the game, and very modest patching requests! My main gripe is related to your comment about stacks - on SMAC you got all information about the square under the cursor: units, terrain, and improvements. Currently, if you are on a square with several workers, you have no way of telling what work the others are doing. Also, when you move a unit, you cannot see how many movement points are left. I don't understand how they lost this from the interface - I thought they had worked from SMAC, but I don't see many useability lessions learnt from that game.

I have the same problem. I keep hgetting the feeling that when Bian Reynlods left the team, they scrapped most of it and started over, so as not to give Brian any credit for the game.

The stuff in AC, and for that matter in Civ2, that we thought should be in could be related to that matter.

	27-11-2001 07:42									#9
	Re: Re: Father Beast's Non-Warmonger, Non-competitive Review of Civ3 Support Apolyton, buy Galactic Civilizations: Deluxe Edition

quote: Originally posted by ScottVib You can see how many units are in a stack... but it's hard to see and if there are too many (more than 8 or 9) you won't be able to tell the exact amount. If you look at the map, where units are stacked you'll notice a series of small white horizontal lines next to the top unit in the stacks image. The number of lines indicates the number of units in the stack. When the stack gets to large the lines run together so that you can't get the exact number, but you'll be able to see that you're screwed if the stack of 10 war elephants is coming after your warriors Hope this helps.

I was wondering what those little white lines were for. Thanks. I appreciate the tip.