12-08-2000 07:11									#1
	Further Proof. If any were needed ... Inflate your Upload Space

... that, despite theories to the contrary, Barbarians can wipe out your capital when it's your only city. Built my capital. Perfect spot on the water. Two whales. Next turn, Barbarians pile out of a boat and crunch the place. Ah well.

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finbar
Mono Rules!
#33984591

	12-08-2000 07:48									#2
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Besides saying "Bad luck" or "Stiff Cheddar" I'd ask if anyone has worked out the probability of that happening? Haven't suffered this fate myself after playing a dozen OCC (2.42) games at raging hordes deity.

Perhaps a landlocked capital is your way of avoiding the sudden early demise.
[This message has been edited by tonic (edited August 11, 2000).]

	12-08-2000 09:21									#3
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I don't think there's any way of working out the probability. Sometimes it just happens, though I'd concede that it's rare. It's about the third time it's happened to me in a couple of years.

There is, though, a theory around the traps that you can't lose your first city to Barbs when it's your only city. The major basis for the theory is that, with only your capital built, a weak defence unit - a warrior, say - can often withstand horrendous attacks by Barb units. Even multiple chariot attacks. In any other situation, the warrior would die. Because it's defending the civ's only city, it seems to survive and even achieve vet status.

Anyway, my bottom line is, don't trust the theory.

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finbar
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	12-08-2000 11:10									#4
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Finbar, when you say the turn after building your capitol, I assume that there was no defender in it? Because barbs will take an empty city. They just won't be able to kill a defender in your only city.

	12-08-2000 12:00									#5
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Paul, in the most recent case (referred to above) it was an undefended city. But on one of the other occasions it happened, a defender was wiped out and the city taken. I've had it happen all ways.

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finbar
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	12-08-2000 17:19									#6
	Remove this text

As far as I know :

Barbs can't defeat a defender in your first city if this city is your ONLY city (and maybe also the capitol).

That's why in OCC games, in the beginning there is no need in building good defensive units.

Edit: added the capitol note.
[This message has been edited by BuilderR (edited August 12, 2000).]

	12-08-2000 19:01									#7
	Avatar Enlargement: We've got the solution

Well, that's the theory. And the fact that so many warriors survive so many horrendous onslaughts when they're defending the only city suggests it's probably meant to be the case. But, as someone once remarked, there's always an exception. I know a couple of people who have suffered the fate. Could be a bug, who knows?

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finbar
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	12-08-2000 22:28									#8
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Although we think we know all the probabilities in the game, strange things keep happening! In recent games the following:
1) On founding a capital an extra ocean square was revealed - two out from the city's coast.
2) The Hanging Gardens appeared a turn before it was due - not complaining!
3) A city supplying a food caravan had no debit for the food lost.
4) The Zulus spent most of the game with no capital - good for bribing!

This is all 2.42/deity/hordes on a PC.
I can believe anything - even the Olympics in Sydney!
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SG (2)

	13-08-2000 07:48									#9
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Ah, bugs. Where would we be without them? How empty would some of these forums be without them?

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finbar
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	14-08-2000 09:17									#10
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did you notice that the most bugs happens in a software of a companies with names that are starting with "micro"???

	14-08-2000 09:38									#11
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Would that be Microsoft or Microprose or some other obscure company whose name starts with Micro?

	14-08-2000 05:35									#12
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Presumably there's a company out there somewhere called Microbug which manufactures same and licenses them to all the other companies called Micro(something).

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finbar
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	14-08-2000 17:05									#13
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I've seen barbs take an empty only city capital, but never once a defensive unit has been built.

finbar... do you play on a mac or a real machine?

	14-08-2000 20:29									#14
	Avatar Enlargement: We've got the solution

Like Ming, I think the invulnerable defender is hard-coded into the PC version. Many years ago, I used the cheat menu to drop several barb armor units next to my capital city. Not only did my lone warrior defender survive, he was completely undamaged. What are the odds against that happening by pure chance?

	16-08-2000 05:46									#17
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Mac or PC, Hodad?

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finbar
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	16-08-2000 06:19									#18
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Well Finbar, I didnt' think it possible but I now know that someone out there does have worse civ luck than me! woo hoo!

	16-08-2000 07:11									#19
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Thanks for the sympathy!

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finbar
Mono Rules!
#33984591