08-12-2001 23:29									#1
	Bugs in Patch Get a bigger avatar today!

I downloaded and installed the v1.16f patch last night on a Windows 98 machine, p400 processor and adequate RAM (thoug the precise number escapes me). I have since noticed the following bugs and one unannounced new feature.

BUGS:

1) Settler radius no longer displays. I have only had a chance to observe this in the ancient area, but I'm quite certain it's true throughout.

2) Lines of relation do not display on the foreign advisor page when you load a saved game. NOTE: I do NOT mean they do not display when you load a saved game from a previous version. I started a game under the patch last night, then reloaded it this morning, and the lines of relation were gone. ALL saved games will probably experience the problem. It's almost certainly a side effect of the fix disallowing display of relation lines involving civs you haven't met.

3) The Civil Disorder popup does not always display. I can't figure out what conditions are required for it to show up.

4) The Golden Age end message now displays a turn late.

5) The message indicating that a ship sank in treacherous waters does not display when a galley sinks in the ocean after the Great Lighthouse is built.

6) The upgrade message ("Our ship has become elite") displays over the ocean square where the enemy was destroyed and disappears before the boat concerned moves into it.

7) Notification of resistance does not always display.

UNANNOUNCED FEATURE

1) When taking a city of size 1, you are no longer given the option to occupy or raze it. The city is destroyed automatically.

Would people please do me the favor of trying to verify these? Firaxis folks, do you know anything about these?

	09-12-2001 00:24									#2
	Lose 30 kilos (of popups)

The settler radii and advisor lines are minor graphical errors caused by the bad initial version of the patch. To help everyone out, could you redownload the patch from Apolyton, run it twice (the first time uninstalls the bad patch, second installs the proper patch), and check these bugs? Most will probably not exist in the correct v1.16f patched game.

	09-12-2001 02:12									#3
	Support Apolyton, buy Call to Power 2

Another possible bug:
I captured Washington (which had the Pyramids and Great Library) but after the resistance ended and the city returned to normal, neither wonder is accruing any culture points. Has anyone else noticed this?

	09-12-2001 02:16									#4
	Support Apolyton, buy Civilization III: Complete

i've stopped getting the "your people want to expand the palace" message, but i'll go to view the palace from the button on the bottom right, and i can do like 5 upgrades at once...

	09-12-2001 03:44									#5
	Support Apolyton or Terrorists Win

Captured wonders are not supposed to produce culture. This is normal.

-Sev

	09-12-2001 04:12									#6
	Re: Bugs in Patch Put an end to popups!

For the record, I have the second version of the patch.

quote: Originally posted by Bad Ax BUGS: 1) Settler radius no longer displays. I have only had a chance to observe this in the ancient area, but I'm quite certain it's true throughout.

Partly true. The radius displays, but itīs not centered on the settler. For me, it displays a couple of tiles down and to the right.

quote: 2) Lines of relation do not display on the foreign advisor page when you load a saved game. NOTE: I do NOT mean they do not display when you load a saved game from a previous version. I started a game under the patch last night, then reloaded it this morning, and the lines of relation were gone. ALL saved games will probably experience the problem. It's almost certainly a side effect of the fix disallowing display of relation lines involving civs you haven't met.

This happened to me too when I continued a game started with the unpatched version and the continued after the patch. Once I started a game with the patch though, I havenīt seen it and Iīve saved and loaded the game a couple of times.

quote: 3) The Civil Disorder popup does not always display. I can't figure out what conditions are required for it to show up.

Havenīt seen this one. It seems to work for me and is really handy.

quote: 4) The Golden Age end message now displays a turn late.

Again, I didnīt notice, but that was probably just me

quote: 5) The message indicating that a ship sank in treacherous waters does not display when a galley sinks in the ocean after the Great Lighthouse is built.

This one I wouldnīt know...I donīt build the Lighthouse.

quote: 6) The upgrade message ("Our ship has become elite") displays over the ocean square where the enemy was destroyed and disappears before the boat concerned moves into it.

I havenīt engaged in that much naval warfare, so this one I havenīt seen.

quote: 7) Notification of resistance does not always display.

It has worked for me this far, as far as I know.

UNANNOUNCED FEATURE

quote: 1) When taking a city of size 1, you are no longer given the option to occupy or raze it. The city is destroyed automatically.

Verified. I noticed this too and I like it. Just like Civ2 and SMAC.

quote: Would people please do me the favor of trying to verify these? Firaxis folks, do you know anything about these?

OK

PS. I have to say that I really like the new prefs. for disabling/enabling some of the unit moves. The game flows much faster and sometimes itīs even to fast!

/Ced

	09-12-2001 04:13									#7
	The patch installing Full PM-box? Change here!

quote: Originally posted by Xentropy The settler radii and advisor lines are minor graphical errors caused by the bad initial version of the patch. To help everyone out, could you redownload the patch from Apolyton, run it twice (the first time uninstalls the bad patch, second installs the proper patch), and check these bugs? Most will probably not exist in the correct v1.16f patched game.

I found out that if you do not uninstall the entire game you loose some graphical boxes. The patch is crashing repeatedly on my machine. I build computers for a living I know my hardware is top of the line. I understand that Sid only put his name on the product really did not over see the programmers. Just gave general points of how the game play should be. I doubt you would hear anyone at Firaxis mention that. They lost all their major programmers when Brian and Tim left. I would be much happier if this DAMN patch at least fixed somethings. What is it with the Lighthouse wonder not allowing me to cross oceans? That was the whole point of the wonder (plus one extra movement point) I thought. Other major bugs if you play with the editor by say placing to many bonuses for a civ it will crash when you build a city.
I want to know who the hell is testing for them? Some idiot for sure, Alpha Centauri was riddled with bugs and after 3 patches it still has a few real annoying quirks. I sure hope they stick with this game and fix it. I want my moneys worth, buying the LE version was a mistake!

Desert Dog

	09-12-2001 05:21									#8
	Re: Bugs in Patch Support Apolyton, buy Civilization III: Complete

quote: Originally posted by Bad Ax UNANNOUNCED FEATURE 1) When taking a city of size 1, you are no longer given the option to occupy or raze it. The city is destroyed automatically. Would people please do me the favor of trying to verify these? Firaxis folks, do you know anything about these?

I don't like this "UNANNOUNCED FEATURE" either!

First, why would taking over a small city destroy it automatically, there should be a choice to either raze it or try to keep it under your control.
Come on Firaxis, get back to work and fix this, and a few other things Bad Ax mentioned.

I will say that I like most of the changes that the patch did implement, kudos on those, just get the other stuff working the way it was before.

	09-12-2001 05:51									#9
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The 'no diplomacy lines' bug is a confirmed and very serious bug.

	09-12-2001 05:52									#10
	Put an end to popups!

Significant, certainly.

	09-12-2001 06:00									#11
	Support Apolyton, pre-order Civilization IV

I was experiencing the Settler-Radius-Display Bug and the Foreign-Advisor-Screen-Relationship-Lines Bug, but after rebooting my machine these two features are working normally.

I have taken six size 1 cities from the Japanese and have had the option to keep them [and have kept them] each time. They didn't start out as size 1 cities, though; they were bombarded down to that size, and maybe that makes a difference.

I believe that the City Disorder Warning only comes up the first turn that the city enters disorder. Once it has told you the first time, I guess the advisor figures it's the boss' problem to worry about.

	09-12-2001 06:33									#12
	Increase the size of your Attachments

Soren suggested that if you have all of the enemy moves and animations and whatnot disabled that the endgame plays much fatster. Don't know that I can call this a bug, but it was still taking me 2-3 min between turns, approx where it was before the patch. (And yes, I actually did disable all of that stuff)

	09-12-2001 06:37									#13
	Re: Bugs in Patch Support Apolyton buy from Amazon

quote: Originally posted by Bad Ax UNANNOUNCED FEATURE 1) When taking a city of size 1, you are no longer given the option to occupy or raze it. The city is destroyed automatically.

I noticed this last night and was not pleasantly surprised by it.
I wanted to take a city and gift it to the Russians (Since it was theirs to begin with, but had been taken by the Persians). When I took it however, it was size one and vanished without any prompt whatsoever. Needless to say, I was not happy.

Can someone from Firaxis say whether this is a bug or a feature?

	09-12-2001 06:39									#14
	Avatar Enlargement: We've got the solution

quote: Originally posted by Taian Another possible bug: I captured Washington (which had the Pyramids and Great Library) but after the resistance ended and the city returned to normal, neither wonder is accruing any culture points. Has anyone else noticed this?

Captured wonders do not create culture.

	09-12-2001 08:47									#15
	Re: Re: Bugs in Patch Get a bigger avatar today!

quote: Originally posted by Gatlin I noticed this last night and was not pleasantly surprised by it. I wanted to take a city and gift it to the Russians (Since it was theirs to begin with, but had been taken by the Persians). When I took it however, it was size one and vanished without any prompt whatsoever. Needless to say, I was not happy. Can someone from Firaxis say whether this is a bug or a feature?

Probably not a bug, this was standard in civ 2, and also, it doesn't always destroy it. I think there is always now a chance of pop. loss when you kill a defender. No idea how big the chance is, but so far it seems to be at least 50%.

	09-12-2001 09:18									#16
	Reinstalling the game best option Support Apolyton buy from Amazon

quote: Originally posted by Ludwig I was experiencing the Settler-Radius-Display Bug and the Foreign-Advisor-Screen-Relationship-Lines Bug, but after rebooting my machine these two features are working normally. I have taken six size 1 cities from the Japanese and have had the option to keep them [and have kept them] each time. They didn't start out as size 1 cities, though; they were bombarded down to that size, and maybe that makes a difference. I believe that the City Disorder Warning only comes up the first turn that the city enters disorder. Once it has told you the first time, I guess the advisor figures it's the boss' problem to worry about.

I had the same problem plus many others. I had to reinstall the game rebooting had no effect. After that though my first game crashed on 230x230 map. (256 megs of ram - 1 ghz AMD Radeon All In Wonder (newest one))
I have had a settler, galley and one hoplite disappear after reloading a game. Workers will go into these dumb ass loops still. I will not list here, I have a long list already. I am seriously doubting they will even address half of these real bugs. I still will try to submit it.

Desert Dog

	09-12-2001 09:22									#17
	Help yourself to an AD-FREE life

Well, if it a design decision, then it is one I don't totally agree with. I mean, if we can choose to raze other cities we capture, why should the fate of a tiny city rest on a roll of the dice?

Consistency should take precedent over realism (after the battle the only thing left in the town is roads and burnt out or leveled buildings).

I hope I get my point across with this. It's late and I might not be posting clearly.

	09-12-2001 10:48									#18
	Support Apolyton buy from Amazon

quote: Originally posted by Gatlin Consistency should take precedent over realism (after the battle the only thing left in the town is roads and burnt out or leveled buildings).

I have a feeling this was a balance decision, because as it was there were practically no problems with bombarding the population down to less than 7 or even down to 1. I had been doing that to get rid of resistors. Now if you do that you run a risk of losing that wonder that the city holds, which, IMO makes sense. Before the patch, you do anything to the city and save the wonder if you selected to install a new governor.

	09-12-2001 10:54									#19
	er um Support Apolyton, buy Alpha Centauri

this diplomacy "bug" mentioned...is this different from the stated change that diplomatic relations are no longer shown if you do not have relations?

and a more serious possible bug is that scrolling is MUCH MUCH slower now.

I have a nvidia geoforce 2--the latest drivers sped the scrolling up dramatically. But this new patch has slowed it right down.

by scrolling i am talking about when a unit auto moves and the map scrolls with it.

	09-12-2001 16:17									#20
	Re: Re: Re: Bugs in Patch Increase the size of your Attachments

quote: Originally posted by barefootbadass Probably not a bug, this was standard in civ 2, and also, it doesn't always destroy it. I think there is always now a chance of pop. loss when you kill a defender. No idea how big the chance is, but so far it seems to be at least 50%.

How the hell do you know that? They don't know what they are doing how can you try to explain what they did in the patch? This is purely a case of BAD PROGRAMMING. To bad it was done by a TRUSTED game company like Firiaxis. Well really I blame all of this on Infogrames Interactive since they have been involved with this project.

Desert Dog

	09-12-2001 16:46									#21
	Remove this text

RE: killing size 1 cities

It does indeed appear to be a 50% thing.
I attacked a 2-city island, captured the first city, and it was burnt to the ground. The second is under my control as it should be...

Not sure whats going on with that

	09-12-2001 17:09									#22
	Where is Lincoln ????? Full PM-box? Change here!

I donīt know if this is related to the patch but I have played the game a lot and it has happened to me just after installing the patch that in the foreign advisor screen Lincoln never appears. Furthermore, there are two circles that take me to Catalina of Russia, the standard one and another empty one, just click on it and check by yourself... Please help if you can.

Note: I know the game well, I am not playing with more than wight civs where you have to change the faces you see manually, and I am not using any mod pack, nothing at all, just the game and the patch.

Attachment: where-is-lincoln.zip

Attachment: where-is-lincoln.zip
This has been downloaded 1 time(s).

	09-12-2001 19:25									#23
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For Civilizator;

Try and Shift + Right-Click on the "empty circle". You should get a list, containing leaders to contact. Lincoln should be the only one in the list. Pick him and he will the be in the "empty" circle.

HTH,
Ced.

	09-12-2001 19:31									#24
	Browse Apolyton AD-FREE

Ok..thanks Gatlin and Sevorak. I wasn't aware of that. I'm not getting the effects either though...is that normal? I haven't researched the cancellation techs yet.

	09-12-2001 20:53									#25
	Suffering from ads?

Deleted original post. Did not know there was a newer version of patch since friday. Damn I hate admiting I posted before reading the top thread

Last edited by napalm010 on 09-12-2001 at 21:51

	09-12-2001 22:29									#26
	Patch Support Apolyton, buy Galactic Civilizations: Deluxe Edition

I had a size 1 city plundered by barbarians and they got 43 gold I had to click the screen 43 times before it closed .Each time I clicked to close the screen the number of money they got went down one .This only happed to me once Over all I like how you dont have to hear the unit sound everytime you move, the games is much faster now.I did notice my battleship was attacking land to the right and its guns where firing left did it do this before? I cant remember

Last edited by Plumbean on 09-12-2001 at 22:37

	10-12-2001 02:27									#27
	Remove this text

quote: Originally posted by barefootbadass I have a feeling this was a balance decision, because as it was there were practically no problems with bombarding the population down to less than 7 or even down to 1.

Good point. The only thing is I wish they would have told us about this and not leave it as a surprise. I know it isn't much to just reload an autosave of the last turn, but what if it was one of the last actions of a long turn?
Also if they had told us, we could have adjusted our strategies accordingly. (ie. "Capturing a 1 pop. city has a x% chance of destroying said city, so use caution in bombardment and choosing which city to attack.")