16-01-2002 00:11									#361
	Post game playing - movement problems Increase Your PM Length

Well, I magically won my first full game in Civ 3. I played at Chieftan level until I get some experience with the new strategies in Civ 3 over Civ 2. At the end of a turn I magically won by cultural victory (will be turning that off in the future!). I went through the replay of the game, scoring, mutual praise party and final ranking (Lincoln the Cruel), and when the question came up to continue or stop, I chose to continue. I did that because I managed to play complete game with NOT ONE WAR among any of the Civ's. Now that the game was over I wanted to wreak some havoc among my neighbors.

Anyway, when the game resumed, all piece movement was horrible. The click-hold movement showed the path a piece would take, but it would not take it. All the movement buttons for the pieces were now on the right side of the screen instead of the bottom. When a piece was done moving, it still showed the white movement circle around it. I had to click on another piece to get to move it. I played about half a turn win this state. I then saved the game, exited the game, restarted and reloaded. Everything worked fine after that.

By the way, on another topic, I also noticed incredibly long delays from when I finished negotiations with another civ and the display updated, appearing to be locked up, but it was simply taking its good old time thinking about things before it had to update the screen. Once the screen was black for 30+ seconds...very disconcerting. But the game never locked up on me. This also happened in different points in the game, not just after negotiations.

Finally, a gripe. Why did they take out the "fast piece slide" option between Civ2 and Civ3? Turning off animation didn't help a lot as pieces still hesitate between moves. And turning off showing the piece movement makes me lose some pieces until they get done moving (transport ships moving to another island for example).

	16-01-2002 02:19									#362
	Enter the AD-FREE zone

quote: Originally posted by jbrians You may have a bad reputation for breaking deals, so that any deal that involves anything per turn (gold or resources) will be unacceptable. -Brian

This all happened during one turn, the Chinese just happened to be last. Part of the trading process was communications with all the other Civ's. I hadn't had a chance to break a treaty yet.

	16-01-2002 03:28									#363
	Re: Re: Re: Why can't I select to build a wonder? Got spare money?

quote: Originally posted by Goonk Well I haven't disbanded any units, but I may have chopped down a forest or two. Maybe that is the problem?

That would do it as well - you can't benefit from any speedups on building wonders except GLs.

quote: If that is the case then it really sucks, since you have to take in account whether you later want to build any wonder in that city when you control your workers (or worse if you automate them, you can get a nasty surprise).

Yeah. IMNSHO, the better thing to do would be for the game to keep track of normal and speedup shields, and give you a warning when you're about to switch to an improvement that can't use the speedup shields (like the warning you get with excess shields).

	16-01-2002 06:29									#364
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i've no idea if this was posted earlier cos i only read up to page 4 but the game crashes in some weird ways

firstly in 2 different games it has fatal errored when several cities go into civil unrest, but on one specific city it will crash. Reloading the turn and making sure the city doesnt go into disorder solves the problem entirely - although on one game another city in the many that went into unrest caused it to crash and i abandonned the game.

Also, occasionally (in teh same place repeatedly but in 2 different games) when i activate lots of units fortified in a city through the city menu it will completely hang if i accidentally click fortify on one of the units. So basically it hangs when i fortify a unit in a city using the menu.
I havent tested it much (not like i WANT my games ot crash ) but it has only done this when fortifying a unit in a big stack when activating others

its also displayed general weird crashes but only a couple and with no identifiable cause.

the patch fixed a lot of annoying things, thx firaxis, get the next one out quickly please

win2k on athlon 1.4 tbird gf2mx

	16-01-2002 13:16									#365
	Optimisation Suggestion Lose 30 kilos (of popups)

When trade-related improvements such as Harbours and Airports are built, the game lags after each building is completed as it recomputes the trade network. This lag can be quite significant in the modern era as a bunch of airports are built in the same turn and the game lags for 10-20 seconds after every airport is complete.

To reduce the lag, the game should not recalculate the trade network until all the harbours and airports are complete. There is a problem if the recalculation of the trade network gives access to a strategic resource that was previously unavailable. Thus, we should change the code from:

for each city
* complete building
* recalculate trade network
* ask for next bulding
next city

to this:

for each city
* complete building
next city

recalculate trade network

for each city
* ask for next building
next city

This will also make the building and unit selections more accurate, because strategic resources that become available allow all cities to build units and improvements that use that resource, instead of just those cities that come after the city with the newly-finished trade link.

	17-01-2002 03:19									#366
	Support Apolyton, pre-order Civilization IV

My list of bugs in Civilization III

Sorry if I bring up bugs already mentioned by others, but I hope my view on them is still helpful.

Did you know that if I set my luxury rate at 0% (or anything else), I can hit F1 in the turn change inbetween city reports and crank it up again? This will give me a huge wad of cash while disorder is limited to the first few cities. If I'm in luck, my capital completes a project on that turn, and I hit F1 right after I OK the new project leaving me with just one city in disorder. It helps to have a slow computer, and I usually hit F1 several times to be sure. If I'm really nasty, I'll crank up luxury rate at the same time, and I get 'We love the President' über alles. This doesn't hurt science either, even if I'm at 100% luxuries. You might want to take a look at this problem.


JUMP SHIP!

I have a Caravel full of settlers, and move my three tiles. This brings my ship alongside another, empty caravel that hasn't moved yet this turn. So I activate the settlers and let them jump ship. Presto! Now I can get them where they should go twice as fast as the computer can. This is pretty silly when you think about it, because all units are supposed to start the turn at the same point in time - it's just their actions that are decided by the turn-based system. That's how I understand it to be. Doing what I'm doing is akin to travelling back in time.

THANKS FOR THE HELP.

During a war, I razed an enemy city and a few turns later built my own city on the same spot. Soon after I made peace with the enemy, but to my surprise a couple of workers wandered in and started irrigating around my new-found city. I didn't even have a right of passage agreement. The only reason I can think of is that they were ordered there before the city was raised.


ABOUT UPGRADING UNITS


After the player upgrades a unit, it should automatically fortify, particularly if the former unit started out fortified. I'm especially thinking of the time when I did a mass upgrade of my pikemen to musketeers - all 100 of them. If this had been in place I would have saved a lot of time. When doing individual upgrades it's just as bad because I get confused if this unit was supposed to go somewhere else or if it was recently upgraded.

	17-01-2002 15:12									#367
	Automated Workers Got spare money?

I use CTRL+A on all my workers.

With the patch, when there is no more to do for the workers they go to a city and sleep. That's good. If a square gets polluted 2 workers will wake and start working on the polluting square. Well, that's good too but I must ask why only 2 workers will run out and work when I have 10 other lazy workers just sleeping in my cities. Shouldn't all non working workers run to this square? I think it takes 12 workers to clean a polluted square in 1 turn.

And I still miss the old sentry command...

	18-01-2002 05:23									#368
	Support Apolyton or Terrorists Win

I'm sure this has already been said... but it would have been nice if the patch took care of the "Refresh=60" requirement for CivIII to run under WindowsXP instead of forcing users to plow through this forum to find that fix.

I have two machines running XP, and that fix was required on both (not like hardware, either...)

Although I am glad the patch fixes the problem with the Civilization3.exe executable being left running after the game exits...

	18-01-2002 08:55									#369
	Negative culture bug! Browse Apolyton AD-FREE

Ok, not sure that anyone else would've found this one.
When I created a new scenario, I doubled the culture for all culture buildings but to offset this I set Barracks, Granary, and Walls each to -1 culture.

Bug: Any negative culture buildings that are listed before the first positive culture buildings on the city screen are not taken into account when calculating culture.

Examples of city building lists:

Palace +4
Barracks -1
Granary -1
Temple +4
Walls -1
Total is -5, which it calculates correctly.

Barracks -1
Granary -1
Temple +4
Walls -1
Total should be +1 but calculates as +3, having ignored the first two buildings.

It doesn't matter what order the buildings are built in as they are always shown on the city screen in a fixed order and that is the order they are calculated in.

	18-01-2002 09:32									#370
	Re: Negative culture bug! Suffering from ads?

quote: Originally posted by The Rusty Gamer Ok, not sure that anyone else would've found this one. When I created a new scenario, I doubled the culture for all culture buildings but to offset this I set Barracks, Granary, and Walls each to -1 culture. Bug: Any negative culture buildings that are listed before the first positive culture buildings on the city screen are not taken into account when calculating culture. Examples of city building lists: Palace +4 Barracks -1 Granary -1 Temple +4 Walls -1 Total is -5, which it calculates correctly. Barracks -1 Granary -1 Temple +4 Walls -1 Total should be +1 but calculates as +3, having ignored the first two buildings. It doesn't matter what order the buildings are built in as they are always shown on the city screen in a fixed order and that is the order they are calculated in.

Well of course, until you have a positive building, it's not going to be able to subtract anything. And the games not designed to go into the red on culture numbers.

	18-01-2002 11:31									#371
	Re: Negative culture bug! Support Apolyton buy from Amazon

quote: Originally posted by Willem Well of course, until you have a positive building, it's not going to be able to subtract anything. And the games not designed to go into the red on culture numbers.

It should add up the lot and only turn the culture value into zero if the total is negative, though it does lend to the possibility of, in certain situations (eg Your temple has been destroyed) of your culture shrinking! Why not? It would make more interesting gameplay!

	18-01-2002 11:35									#372
	Border culture exponential display problem Support Apolyton

I changed the border culture exponential using the editor from 10 to 5, just to see what it would do. Sure enough, my borders expanded when it reached 5 culture but the display said 5/10 when it should've said 5/25.

	18-01-2002 22:39									#373
	Pangaea option doesn't produce pangaea Support Apolyton buy from Amazon

I have tried many times to get a pangaea world map, but every time I choose that option I still get separated island continents. I also tried in the editor, which has an auto world creation feature, nad every "pangaea" map I generated had more than 1 land mass. This seems to me to be a bug.

	19-01-2002 05:31									#374
	Support Apolyton, buy Galactic Civilizations

Here is my email to and from Firaxis. I am running 1.16f, ed. 2. Very annoying error. I figured I'd just let the persians run around on their boat. Then I lost sight of them. I finally was able to make peace, and gave them 2 cities. neither one is a capital, so i am unable to establish an embassy or use spies to locate this runaway ship. if i destroy the gift cities, the persians are still alive. i cannot destroy them. this sucks.




ok, my hardware is not my issue. i am playing at chieftain level as babyl. I have destroyed all persian units except for one ship w/units on it. when i destroy this unit at the beginning of year 1852 AD, game crashes. game does this even if i go back and play the last few years or build a different naval unit to destroy the persian boat. this seems very software determined to me, not hardware. so what's up? am i the lucky finder of an easter egg? this error is, as stated, very repeatable. it would suck to have my game end this way.

It's got something to do with settlers on transports. In one case, Japan's last settler was on a galley that was destroyed. This caused another unit on the transport to be killed twice and the game thought Japan had -1 units. The bug doesn't occur everytime this situation happens and is actually quite rare.


Users with the newer (1400+) Ahtlon processors and Asus motherboards may be able to fix the problem by updating their motherboard BIOS. Some of the older BIOS versions do not fully support the faster processors, and the newer BIOS has fixed the problem for at least one customer.

	19-01-2002 05:34									#375
	Re: Automated Workers Help yourself to an AD-FREE life

quote: Originally posted by Master2000 I use CTRL+A on all my workers. With the patch, when there is no more to do for the workers they go to a city and sleep. That's good. If a square gets polluted 2 workers will wake and start working on the polluting square. Well, that's good too but I must ask why only 2 workers will run out and work when I have 10 other lazy workers just sleeping in my cities. Shouldn't all non working workers run to this square? I think it takes 12 workers to clean a polluted square in 1 turn. And I still miss the old sentry command...

I agree. It is annoying that workers go to sleep when automated despite there being lots of work to do still. Especially pollution clean up. And if I keep CTRL-Ping my workers, after the 4 or 5th one in a turn, i am not allowed to do so anymore. Why is there a limit on the automated pollution cleaneruppers?

	19-01-2002 18:40									#376
	Get a bigger avatar today!

Bug 1:Missing/Wrong attack-animations from Bombers
Description: When ordered to bomb a certain city the bomber sometimes does not "bomb" (the graphic for the explosions are not shown). Or sometimes it can happen that the bomber is not shown at all (or only at the tile where he exits his run).
This happens always with the same cities.

Bug 2: Ships bombarding - Wrong attack-animations
Description: The facing of the bombarding unit is sometimes not correct. Have seen this with ships. Again, it is reproducable because it is tile dependant.


Wish1: Advances get handled before cities gets handled
Description: At the beginning of a turn, first should there be the new advance handled (if there is any) and then the cities. Because when you get a better unit you cannot build it in those cities that pop up during the beginning of the turn. You have to manually change all this cities back afterwards.

Wish2: Better Diplomatic Handling
Description: Sometimes you really do not know why they are mad at you. In addition the advisor considers other civs friends that you (as player) surely do not considered this way.

ata

	19-01-2002 18:45									#377
	Support Apolyton

Wish 3 : Improve automated worker
Description : When automated, the workers change irrigated tiles to mine and my cities all begin to starve Automation to pollution handling only would be great improvement.

Wish 4 : Improve Governor
Description : When a square gets polluted and then cleaned afterwards the square may not be assigned to the city it earlier belonged. Even though that city is starving. If the square produces food and a city which is starving is in reach it should be assigned to it. If it produces no food, just assign it to the city that originally worked this tile.

Wish 5 : Option to disable some of the "Are you serious" message boxes

ata

	19-01-2002 18:49									#378
	Suffering from ads?

quote: Originally posted by Atahualpa Wish 3 : Improve automated worker Description : When automated, the workers change irrigated tiles to mine and my cities all begin to starve Automation to pollution handling only would be great improvement.

Try Shift-A instead. That automates the Worker without it doing anything to previously worked tiles.

	19-01-2002 19:21									#379
	Support Apolyton, buy Civilization: The Boardgame

Apologies if this has been posted previously.

I am playing the patched version of Civ 3 for the first time on Tutorial level. I have experienced the following crashes/ problems:

1. The game crashed when A. Leader (Barbarians ) contacted me for the first time. His image briefly before the crash was a very red looking Abe Lincoln.

2. On reloading, there is no image for the Barbarian leader on the foreign relations advisor screen.

3. When I attempt to contact the Barbarian by clicking the area where his image should be the game crashes.

Is this a previously known problem with a work around? If so, I would be grateful if someone could advise me of the solution.

Many Thanks.

	20-01-2002 04:15									#380
	Huh? Avatar Enlargement: We've got the solution

How did the Barbarians get hold of a city in the first place? Afaik, they only terrorise conquered cities; disrupt production, steal money etc.

	20-01-2002 04:41									#381
	Re: Huh? Support Apolyton, buy Civilization: The Boardgame

quote: Originally posted by MonsterMan How did the Barbarians get hold of a city in the first place? Afaik, they only terrorise conquered cities; disrupt production, steal money etc.

They should also be able to raze towns as well IMO. I like them, (I set mine to Raging), but I think they're rather lame. Except of course when a horde of about 20 Horseman descend upon me. They should at least be able to raze some size 1 town in the middle of nowhere.

	20-01-2002 23:42									#382
	Support Apolyton, buy Galactic Civilizations: Deluxe Edition

just to elaborate on my post above, the error happened again just now
here's what happens



and here's a savegame just before it if anyone has any idea how to fix this without having to sort out the cities causing the crash

http://www.ethno.co.uk/flight/flightciv3sav.zip

ps - it only just happened so i havent reloaded and tried getting past it so i dont know whether it will happen when another city goes into civil disorder or what

	21-01-2002 06:55									#383
	Increase Your PM Length

I think you have activated the choice of getting a pop-up when cities go into disorder. Try disabling that in the preferences settings. Or reload your previous save, find Nuremberg, open the city screen and click on the center (city) icon in the map. See what happens.

	21-01-2002 13:32									#384
	Browse Apolyton AD-FREE

Willem: thanks

	21-01-2002 17:35									#385
	Support Apolyton, pre-order Civilization IV

Bug 3 : Negotiating in diplomacy
Description : When you ask the AI to make an offer, but then do not accept it and leave it on the table as they offered it and ask what the AI thinks off it, it says they do not accept. Even though its the offer they made. When you ask them again to make an offer they come up with the same offer which you can accept of course.

ata

	21-01-2002 17:43									#386
	Full PM-box? Change here!

quote: Originally posted by Atahualpa Bug 3 : Negotiating in diplomacy Description : When you ask the AI to make an offer, but then do not accept it and leave it on the table as they offered it and ask what the AI thinks off it, it says they do not accept. Even though its the offer they made. When you ask them again to make an offer they come up with the same offer which you can accept of course. ata

Here's another that just happened to me recently. I came across a Civ, who asked if I wanted to exchange World maps. At first I was going to accept but then I decided to see what would happen if I asked them what they'd offer for my World map. They gave me their World map, the original deal, plus Mapmaking and 530 gold. Not exactly Wall Street material that's for sure!

	21-01-2002 18:14									#387
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quote: Originally posted by MonsterMan I think you have activated the choice of getting a pop-up when cities go into disorder. Try disabling that in the preferences settings. Or reload your previous save, find Nuremberg, open the city screen and click on the center (city) icon in the map. See what happens.

i hadnt thought of disabling the popup, but after sorting out all my cities manually the crashes stopped for a few turns

but then, a little later, it just crashed after building a wonder

I read earlier in this thread that savegames can get corrupt and not have any noticeable effect until later in the game, well thats my guess for this reoccuring bug

if i knew where it created the error log would that be any help?

	21-01-2002 20:46									#388
	Re: What did they patch anyway Enter the AD-FREE zone

quote: Originally posted by mattbolas 4) The use of " Strategic resources" still does not work. Often the game goes back in time because you run out of rubber or whatever. When in real history has a nation had to make swordsman instead of infantry ? It is just not realistic, and badly cripples the game. I have taken to using the editor to allow the units to be built when the advance is meet, and ignore the "Strategic resource" nonsense. Hey Jeff, it just doesn't work !! The game in general is not balanced

Hey i disagree dude,I think resources add a very interesting extra to the game ... leave it be!
No uranium ... no nukes ... whats wrong with that!
No oil well then steam it is ... what else you gonna burn?

Firaxis ... good job ... my only negative comment : I want multiplayer pleeeeeessse!

	22-01-2002 01:43									#389
	Don't know if I'd classify it as a bug but... Help yourself to an AD-FREE life

Don't know if I'd classify it as a bug but...


I found something that is at least interesting and it may have occured before the patch as well, I just did not have the experiance with the game to notice it then.

If you have captured workers from other Civilizations, the rate that they are able to perform different actions IE: build roads irrigate etc.. seems to be determined by the style of government that their orriginal civilization is using not your civilization.

IE :

if I am the germans and I capture an english worker and I am in Democracy and the English are in despotisim or for an even more extreme difference Anarchy their workers will take much longer than mine to perform an equivilant action.

I could understand this more if I was an industrious CIV and they were just not getting the industrious bonus but in my experiance this does not seem to be the case.

Just my two cents worth.

	22-01-2002 01:58									#390
	Re: Don't know if I'd classify it as a bug but... Support Apolyton buy from Amazon

quote: Originally posted by Harper Don't know if I'd classify it as a bug but... I found something that is at least interesting and it may have occured before the patch as well, I just did not have the experiance with the game to notice it then. If you have captured workers from other Civilizations, the rate that they are able to perform different actions IE: build roads irrigate etc.. seems to be determined by the style of government that their orriginal civilization is using not your civilization. IE : if I am the germans and I capture an english worker and I am in Democracy and the English are in despotisim or for an even more extreme difference Anarchy their workers will take much longer than mine to perform an equivilant action. I could understand this more if I was an industrious CIV and they were just not getting the industrious bonus but in my experiance this does not seem to be the case. Just my two cents worth.

Captured Workers always take twice as long to complete a task as your own workers. The only exception as I understand is that, if you are an industrious civ, the bonus gets them working at the normal rate.