10-01-2002 18:07									#1
	Late Forum tedium - serious Suffering from ads?

Isnt it tedious to say:
ONE BY ONE
all over again and again?

I mean after all that shouting and raging and bashing and criticising (both constructive and destructive) they either IGNORE YOU AND WILL CONTINUE TO DO SO _or_ ALREADY KNOW IT!!!
Personally I believe the latter.
Wether or not they do something about it is not affected by repeating it all over again.
The more you rant the more everyone gets annoyed

The Civ3-General Forum used to be something different!!!!

All the whining is completely for nothing as Firaxis either already knows or ignores you.
You got to take the consequences! And I am very serious about that.
For me the consequences look like following:
* Keep on playing, but on smaller maps and more relaxed (not much of a consequence for the hardcore civer though)
* Put the game onto the shelf and wait till Firaxis fixes the things you most worry about.
* Use the game for other purposes (some that satisfy you more) than originally intended (whatever comes to your mind, I wont go into that)
* Sell the game on ebay/to your friends or return it if still possible.

ata

P.S.: As it gets tedious for me too (counter-criticising the criticisers), I simple leave it with this thread. Promised. Besides here some real solutions to end your problem. If Firaxis doesnt do, so do you have to!
P.P.S.: I hope nobody feels annoyed. This wasnt my intention.

	10-01-2002 18:19									#2
	Support Apolyton buy from Amazon

I think if there is a problem it makes sense to work towards a solution ... this tends to involve mentioning the problem ...

Wouldn't it be better from your angle to start threads discussing the things you want to talk about?

Anyway, I too want to see threads about late game tedium disappear! That is why I make threads about late game tedium.

	10-01-2002 20:34									#3
	Support Apolyton, buy Civilization: The Boardgame

People like to vent their frustration. Posting a critique here is probably the next best thing to giving Sid a punch on the nose.

You don't have to read every thread Atahualpa, let alone take it upon yourself to counter-criticise.

Bkeela.

	10-01-2002 23:02									#4
	Suffering from ads?

Bkeela: of course not
But the whole thing is stuck. And there is nothing new from the criticisers comming than all the known arguments.
Because everything about the problem is said already.

nato: As said, more threads will not make the problem go away. It depends on Firaxis and they know already.

Everything is said already.
Now the ball is at Firaxis. You can do nothing about it anymore.
And if you think Firaxis makes a foul than as said: take the consequence.

Sincerely,
ata

	10-01-2002 23:08									#5
	Support Apolyton, buy GURPS/ Alpha Centauri

ah yes Bkeela I forget to say: Punching Sid on the nose all the time makes him sure never visit this place again.
I guess this is not the intention of anybody here.

Thats why it is important to stop and return to normal life. I am confident Firaxis will do something about it.

Just because they dont make an announcment every now and then doesnt mean they are sleeping.
Maybe they are just too busy

ata

	10-01-2002 23:10									#6
	Support Apolyton buy from Amazon

Ata you're absiolitely right. I'm going to do my best to stop counter-sniping too. The only advantage it has is wrapping the vitriol up into one or two big threads instead of seeing a couple of new ones spawn each day.

The difficulty at the moment is in finding many constructive areas to post about instead. I don't theink the overall forum noise has risen appreciably, just that the quantity of other posts has dwindled.

	10-01-2002 23:35									#7
	Support Apolyton, buy Galactic Civilizations: Deluxe Edition

I disagree.

More threads will help make the game better if they analyze it, reveal things, and help create ideas for solutions.

To stop talking is pretty close to stopping thinking.

You made this thread to mimic mine I think, since it is similar in title and popped up immediately afterwards ... did you even read mine and see the content, or did you just complain based on the title?

I've never posted a whine, vitriol, or a "snipe". I've posted some analysis and some ideas to try to improve the game.

Anyway, since the thread title is clear, ignore it if you're not interested.

Why not instead start a thread about a "legitimate" topic you want to discuss? Since you started this thread, it seems you want to discuss what you are complaining about ... who is whining?

	10-01-2002 23:39									#8
	Tired of ads?

Go post in korn's Civ3 vs. History Challenge! thread. It's entertaining, non-offensive, and even educational!

	11-01-2002 00:15									#9
	Inflate your Upload Space

nato:
Sorry no relation to any thread.
I used the title because the main problem civ3 faces (from the posts) is "Late Game Tedium" and I thought I'd be ultra-creative if I would substitute Game with Forum
As I stated in my first post my intention was not to annoy anyone.

quote: More threads will help make the game better if they analyze it, reveal things, and help create ideas for solutions.

More threads just increases the time they have to spend on the forums to search for the information. It will only help if it is grouped into some threads which they can subscribe to.

Else why would you think there is a thread by Jeff Morris where he begs people to post stuff for the next patch there.

TinCow: Thanks for the tip, 90+ posts threads scare me away most of the time. But I'll look into it now. Thanks.

ata

	11-01-2002 00:29									#10
	Support Apolyton, buy Galactic Civilizations: Deluxe Edition

quote: Originally posted by Grumbold Ata you're absiolitely right. I'm going to do my best to stop counter-sniping too.

For a Brit your spelling abilities are stunning.

	11-01-2002 01:11									#11
	Increase Your PM Length

Oh ok then, I wasn't saying it wasn't ultra-creative, heh heh.

Well I guess its a different idea as to what the forums are for.

I don't think Firaxis reads every post, and I think they are only marginally interested in what we would have to say. I may be wrong, but I don't think threads are supposed to be organized solely for ease of reading by Firaxis.

I don't think conclusions will ever be rapidly arrived at. I think they should be discussed and debated out. Then if some great conclusion or idea comes up, that is what should be posted in a thread like Jeff Morris's.

I think ideas sent to Firaxis should be well thought out and very concise, so I agree about that. There is just no way Firaxis is going to listen to anything that is very long - they don't have the time or interest. Thats why I think threads are more for us players, not Firaxis searching for info ... that strikes me as funny.

I really do believe that people sharing ideas can come up with solutions that they could not on their own. Share your ideas, contribute!

Maybe there should be a forum for constructive ideas, but right now I think General is the only place for it.

Oh well, sorry for all that type, but theres my defense for threads like mine.

	11-01-2002 01:19									#12
	Slightly off topic, but... Support Apolyton, buy Civilization III: Complete

...just for the record...

Regardless of how much this forum turns into a flame-fest, and no matter how dissatisfied certain people are with this game, I'll wager it won't, and probably can't ever reach the level of vitriol in the Sierra forums a few years ago during the whole Front Page Sports Football fiasco.

To the best of my knowledge, that's the only dissatisfied customer flame-war that ever brought down a successful division of a software company.

BT

	11-01-2002 07:30									#13
	Support Apolyton, pre-order Civilization IV

outpost and daikatana

	11-01-2002 16:09									#14
	Support Apolyton buy from Amazon

nato: Your (late game tedium - discussion and solution) thread stands out of question because it isnt a flame thread and it only deals with the Problem and doesnt bash civ3. In fact I have to congratulate you for creating it.
Constructive Problem Solving Threads are sure what we need here.
It's the Civ3 Bashing and Denuncing Firaxis threads that we dont need here.

And besides maybe I havent made myself clear but I really appreciate that so many people are out there who record problems in the game and post them here in a constructive and discussing manner.

But I dont appreciate those who just come here to lift their anger and shout denunciations at Firaxis and what-else-not.

ata

edit: I have just posted a valuable argument in your thread nato

Last edited by Atahualpa on 11-01-2002 at 16:33

	11-01-2002 16:26									#15
	Get a bigger avatar today!

It's easy to post in a constructive and discussing manner once, twice, maybe thrice. That's exactly what I did. But by the umpteenth time, when you've not even been extended the courtesy of an acknowledgment, you tend to start raising your voice a bit.

	11-01-2002 16:34									#16
	Increase the size of your Attachments

Actually then its time to chill!

	11-01-2002 16:39									#17
	Browse Apolyton AD-FREE

quote: Originally posted by Ecthelion For a Brit your spelling abilities are stunning.

Its my ability to actually hit the keys my brain is telling my fingers to which seems to be degrading. I have to type fast to fit these posts between chunks of constructive work but I really should have stopped and read that one through before hitting send

	11-01-2002 16:40									#18
	Lose 30 kilos (of popups)

quote: Originally posted by Libertarian But by the umpteenth time, when you've not even been extended the courtesy of an acknowledgment, you tend to start raising your voice a bit.

this is a fan forum, not an official firaxis forum....
when you post here, you are addressing other civ fans. if you get a reply from a firaxian, consider it an "extra service"

	11-01-2002 16:43									#19
	Support Apolyton, buy GURPS/ Alpha Centauri

ata - Oh yeah I agree with you totally.

I was only responding because your thread popped up right after mine, so I thought it was aimed at me ... bad timing I guess.

You're right, pure bashing threads are just useless clutter ...

They do seem to create forum "celebritites" so maybe that is their function!

	11-01-2002 16:45									#20
	Increase the size of your Attachments

quote: when you post here, you are addressing other civ fans. if you get a reply from a firaxian, consider it an "extra service"

I would in fact consider it a miracle.

	11-01-2002 16:50									#21
	Support Apolyton, pre-order Civilization IV

quote: Originally posted by Libertarian I would in fact consider it a miracle.

when you pray and your prayers dont "work", do you "start raising your voice"?

	11-01-2002 17:00									#22
	Remove this text

quote: when you pray and your prayers dont "work", do you "start raising your voice"?

Suppose you went to a friend's house at midnight, wanting to borrow three loaves of bread. You would say to him, `A friend of mine has just arrived for a visit, and I have nothing for him to eat.' He would call out from his bedroom, `Don't bother me. The door is locked for the night, and we are all in bed. I can't help you this time.' But I tell you this--though he won't do it as a friend, if you keep knocking long enough, he will get up and give you what you want so his reputation won't be damaged. And so I tell you, keep on asking, and you will be given what you ask for. Keep on looking, and you will find. Keep on knocking, and the door will be opened. For everyone who asks, receives. Everyone who seeks, finds. And the door is opened to everyone who knocks.

— Jesus of Nazareth, Luke 11:5-10, NLT

	11-01-2002 17:01									#23
	Remove this text

I believe you only need 3 verifiable miracles to qualify for sainthood so Dan and Jeff should certainly be elevated

	11-01-2002 17:01									#24
	Support Apolyton, buy Galactic Civilizations: Deluxe Edition

Well, you can start sacrificing the heretics in your tribe in the hope that it will please the (game) Gods...

	11-01-2002 17:11									#25
	Tired of ads?

oh jesus bible quotes

keep on knocking and you will be a pain in the ass

	11-01-2002 17:12									#26
	Got spare money?

quote: Originally posted by Libertarian And so I tell you, keep on asking, and you will be given what you ask for.

it doesnt tell anything about calling god a "corrupt and perfidious wealth-whore whom I had mistaken for the sweet and charming girl next door"....

	11-01-2002 17:17									#27
	Got spare money?

quote: oh jesus bible quotes

I defered to an authority on prayer. Prayer. You know, prayer? The thing Mark ASKED about?

Stop staring at me. Eat your checkers.

quote: it doesnt tell anything about calling god a "corrupt and perfidious wealth-whore whom I had mistaken for the sweet and charming girl next door"....

For true and righteous are his judgments: for he hath judged the great whore, which did corrupt the earth with her fornication, and hath avenged the blood of his servants at her hand. And again they said, Alleluia And her smoke rose up for ever and ever.

— Revelation 19:2-3

	11-01-2002 17:30									#28
	Support Apolyton, buy Galactic Civilizations: Deluxe Edition

So the revelation has started and you're God or something?

	11-01-2002 17:34									#29
	Avatar Enlargement: We've got the solution

Doth he not smite ppl in the forums?

	11-01-2002 17:38									#30
	Browse Apolyton AD-FREE

I think he's setting himself up as a false idol and is tempting the wrath of the real forum gods