12-01-2002 00:51									#1
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So finally someone ask the forbidden question (or is it the uncanny question?);

Who are the best MP-player Apolyton has to offer?

Buster? Vel? Misotu? big_canuk? keygen? who?

thread now open for debate.

(a poll can be made later when some names surfaces)

	12-01-2002 01:21									#2
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I know very little about this, as I've only heard of certain players reputations... Do you mean only people who play currently and post on Apolyton? In addition to those you mentioned, I have heard that couslee and zsozso (sp?) were pretty good.

	12-01-2002 01:41									#3
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seems like people are either to shy or not interested enough to make a comment.

I haven't played enough against people here to vote but I have to say that Buster certainly gave me a lession. He eradicated my faction in less than 30 turns........

	12-01-2002 03:49									#4
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I have had convincing wins in most games so far. But in the only one against Buster (FW2), he trounced me. I want to play him some more to find out if that was an anomaly, or if he really is that good.

I have had a number of games against Misotu, and they have been the most competitive I have played. Unfortunately only one finished before she has temporarily (hopefully), left active play. I would give a small advantage to myself in those games, but she has had a much much larger number of games to her credit. (And I am sure she would disagree as to who had the advantage!) My (perceived) advantage may only have been luck. I have certainly learned how to do many, many things better, by observing her techniques, fighting against her, and collaborating with her in various games.

As to the old crowd, I am sure they were relatively much better than I am. However, techniques have been evolved, and refined over time, and I would welcome games against them. My goal is to win, but also to have great satisfying games. It is a privilege with my short time here, to even be mentioned with the likes of Misotu, Zsozso, and CousLee. (and we could name many other old time greats). Certainly among currently active players, Buster along with some of the ACOL players are formidable (MariOne, comes to mind).

Perhaps (but more likely not) this question will be better answered, as the FW series is played out. It is also interesting to note, that as my techniques become known, they become less effective, because people learn how to counter them. People also become more wary, so I may have less luck in the future. It is also possible (probable), that we have the situation that A beats B, B beats C, but C beats A.

Defining "the best" may never be possible. Whether my luck will be fleeting or more permanent has yet to be proven. Thanks for the chance to play with and learn from you all. I look forward to beating you all, but more importantly to have great, great games!

	12-01-2002 04:11									#5
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I am a relative newcomer to Apolyton, but I am in quite a few PBEMs at the moment. There are a lot of excellent players here.

I have not had the opportunity to play against Misotu (unfortunately), although she was a great source of wisdom and advice while she was here. And I echo big_canuk in saying that I hope that her absence is only temporary.

I am finally in a unique game with big_canuk where five humans are all playing alien factions. I am looking forward to learning from him as he trounces me roundly in that one.

In my short experience, I have played with many excellent players and I do not wish to slight any of them, but these games are not far enough along for me to truly evaluate the best.

However, I can say whole-heartedly that the best player I have encountered in a full MP game so far is Viriato. So, he has my vote as one of the elite players here on Apolyton.

Last edited by Qantaga on 12-01-2002 at 04:47

	12-01-2002 19:02									#6
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Thanks to b_c!
But I'd like to deny his credits to me.

As i like to define myself, I think I can be rated as a very skilled loser.
I apy a lot of attentio to certain details of the game (but not to others). And I am notoriously weak in "big picture" strategy (I often have not very well clear what's the best thing in a looong term frame), and specifically in the military domain (also from a strategic perspective - I can defend myself in existing troops deployment in a small theatre - it's called tactics I guess).

I have been playing with many players who are/were also active here in Apolyton as posters or pbem players.
Had I to name an overall best, who's still active here, I'd name JAMiAM. I only managed to beat him once, and it was a team game. He always showed a deep and wide comprehension of all the game aspects, and the ability to pu it in practice to get the best results. Once he was allowed by the rules of a pbem to use the free DW midturn upgrade feature, he could wipe out entire factions with almost his bare hands!

cousLee is also probably stronger than me, but he retired from active play. He excels in military too ("General cousLee"), where I am weak.
Long time ago, I had been soundly beaten by the mighty Pagan, who showed consistency over other games too. He was beaten by JAM once, but that was because of diplomatics (and my betrayal and double-crossing dumbness...).
Bingmann also showed impressive gameplay when I had the occasion to see him deploy his SMAC wisdom on the field (he was also the best CMN I've met ever)

Of the other players I had the occasion to meet, I rate more or less at my same level:
Aredhran, who is also famous here, although he is holding his turns since almost two months now!
Mongoose, who alas had disappeared abruptly from the community couple of summers ago...
Fistandantilus, my fellow countryman, which made the Italian SMAC teams unbeatable (well, at least unbeaten so far...)

I've never personally met or observed playing many Apolyton posters who tho I expect to be very strong, jusdging from their posts.
Of them all I regret I had not the occasion to meet Misotu.
Of cours also all the others reported above, and offhand I'd add for instance also Ogie Oglethorpe, or White Elephants, Sikander, Skanderbeg, RedFred, Fitz, and many others.

Currently, I'm hoping to get a little break too, but maybe over the summer I'll humbly present myself to meet the Apolyton SMAC/X pbem players who'll be still around (ACOL is definitely dead for that purpose)

	13-01-2002 00:24									#7
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Not worthy...not worthy...

But thanks for including me anyway, MariOne. I am a long time SP guy who recently converted. I got involved in MP very recently and I have only seen two games through to completion. So I know I am not in the same league as the other players mentioned.

From experience, I know that Misotu (sadly in retirement) and big_canuk are great players. I use my infiltration status to see exactly how they do things. I have learned a lot about the MP ICS from big_canuk and about the mechanics of the early pop boom from Misotu. Remarkable how quickly she can take her cities to the hab max.

For all the other players mentioned I know them only by reputation. Sadly, many of the greats have moved on to other games.