15-01-2002 09:15									#1
	Civ3 Mac Performance Issues Get a bigger avatar today!

Well, I'm gonna try this again - something weird happened,

This is what I've got: Mac Os 8.6, G3 (333 MHZ), vmemory (64 MB), Built-in (32 MB), RAM (128 or 256 MB, can't remember and don't know where to look).

This is what happened: Four hours trying to get Civ3 running respectably - no luck. First, I had to upgrade QT 4.0 to 4.1.2 or higher. I went to QT 5.0. I was asked if I wanted the CD to install 4.1.2 but an error message came up everytime I tried, plus I never even saw it on the disc.

After clicking on the Civ3 icon, it took almost two minutes for the main menu to pop up. The whole time the screen is dark and the machine is grinding like crazy. I tried changing the refresh rate 3 - 4 times but only auto would work. When I made choices of what type of land, how many civs, difficulty level, etc. there was probably 30 - 40 sec. of grinding before I could move on. I got as far as building a city (Beijing) before I closed ot down.

I tried cranking my virtual memory up to 997K to see what would happen, but it only seemed worse. I allocated more preferred memory from 128000 to 200000, but I didn't notice any real differences. I left the minimum at 128000 because I had to increase virtual memory to compensate, I thnk. Its alla blur now.

Please advise. The ins and outs of computers is not really my bag. I guess when a game comes out that I really want and my computer meets the requirements, I just expect it to run reasonably well.

	15-01-2002 17:09									#2
	Re: Civ3 Mac Performance Issues Tired of ads?

quote: Originally posted by dojoboy Well, I'm gonna try this again - something weird happened, This is what I've got: Mac Os 8.6, G3 (333 MHZ), vmemory (64 MB), Built-in (32 MB), RAM (128 or 256 MB, can't remember and don't know where to look). ... Please advise. The ins and outs of computers is not really my bag. I guess when a game comes out that I really want and my computer meets the requirements, I just expect it to run reasonably well.

To be honest, I'm not sure at all your computer meets the requirements. You mention that you have 32M of RAM built-in (and some other confusing stuff about 128 or 256). I'm a bit confused, but if you have only 32M of real RAM and virtual memory jacked up to compensate, Civ3 will run like a complete dog. The minimum specs for the game are 64M.

You can find your memory amount by going to the Apple menu and choosing "About this Macintosh". It'll tell you the amount of built-in RAM and the amount of virtual memory. If the amount of built-in RAM is less than 64M, you're going to have big problems with thrashing. RAM is cheap - you can pick up 256M for a little under $50 at most places. That'd be the first thing I'd do if I were you.

Brad

	15-01-2002 21:43									#3
	Support Apolyton, buy Civilization: The Boardgame

Thanks for the reply bradman!

So what your telling me is that if I get, say 256 MB RAM then it will run better, regardless of having 32 MB built-in? I put in some RAM months ago but maybe I didn't get it in right.

I had some initial problems w/ SMACx running slow but it worked out really well in the end.

Also, what is the real prupose of virtual memory?

	16-01-2002 11:01									#4
	Support Apolyton, buy Alpha Centauri

quote: Originally posted by dojoboy Thanks for the reply bradman! So what your telling me is that if I get, say 256 MB RAM then it will run better, regardless of having 32 MB built-in? I put in some RAM months ago but maybe I didn't get it in right.

Possibly. If you know you put RAM in but the Apple menu only reports 32, then it's not registering with the MacOS.

quote: Also, what is the real prupose of virtual memory?

That's a complicated question with a long and semi-technical answer. The simplest explanation I can give is that it helps machines with limited real RAM run applications that require more RAM, at the expense of hard drive space and speed. It also helps Macs with plenty of RAM manage it more efficiently.

Brad

	18-01-2002 00:14									#5
	Support Apolyton, buy Civilization: The Boardgame

when i get my computer back from the mac-doctor, should i turn off virtual memory before i re-install civ3? i thouht i saw this recommended on a site for ctp.

	18-01-2002 01:25									#6
	Increase Your PM Length

quote: Originally posted by dojoboy when i get my computer back from the mac-doctor, should i turn off virtual memory before i re-install civ3? i thouht i saw this recommended on a site for ctp.

That depends on the amount of RAM you have installed. If you've got 32M in there now plus a 128 or 256M DIMM on the way (for a total of 160 or 288), then it's probably better to keep it turned on. The classic MacOS copes best when you have both a substantial amount of real memory and virtual memory turned on to the mimimum allowable setting (usually real + 1M).

Brad

	18-01-2002 04:17									#7
	Inflate your Upload Space

I've found significant performance improvement with virtual memory on, and I have 384megs base RAM. As pointed out above, real +1 seems to do the trick.

The game is still a bit sluggish, however, on my powerbook G4 400. Not unplayable, but there is just a general choppiness.

good luck
lester

	25-01-2002 08:51									#8
	Installed and Running! Support Apolyton

I finally got my Mac back from the mac-doctor today. Its now recognizing the RAM. I've got 288 MB RAM w/ virtual memory set at 289 MB on an OS 8.6 system.

Everything is playing fine, really fine.

After a couple hours of play, I cannot complain about anything. It appears to be really, really balanced. I'll go into more game-play chat on some other threads. But for now, Civ3 Mac is running smoothly on my set-up. Thanks for the feedback in my earlier posts here, bradman.

	05-03-2002 22:28									#9
	any chance of running civIII? Increase the size of your Attachments

This is only sorta related, but I didn't want to make a new thread.

Anyway, I know the system requirements are:
* MacOS 8.6 or higher or MacOS 10.0.4 or higher
* 300MHz iMac G3 or better (500MHz preferred)
* 64M RAM for the classic MacOS (96M preferred), 128M for MacOS X
* 500MB Hard disk space (650MB preferred)

but I'm wondering if there's any chance of getting CivIII running on a system like this:
* Mac OS 9.2.2
* 266Mhz G3
* 160 MB RAM (+ 400 VM)
* Enough Hard disk space

Has anyone got any tried running CivIII (for Mac) on a similar system?