21-01-2002 01:02									#1
	Anyone used subs in MP? Tired of ads?

I've been wondering about the deep pressure hull special ability. Specifically, has anyone on the boards used it in MP? Is it useful, or even worth it? Does it work the way it's supposed to? Any shared experiences or examples would be appreciated.

	21-01-2002 16:58									#2
	Avatar Enlargement: We've got the solution

I never used it, sorry. Nor in MP, neither in SP.
I heard that as the AI cheats, in that it always knows exactly where all of your units are, it is pointless to use subs in SP.
I never tested it tho in MP (also Repair Bay is broken, which makes that tech with 3 naval SA much less important, unless you really need Carrier Deck).

	22-01-2002 04:56									#3
	Support Apolyton buy from Amazon

Thanks MariOne.

If the ability works as advertised it could be pretty cool in MP. I think it would probably be more useful if it came with Doc:Initiative. Carrier decks too, for that matter. Nanometallurgy is kind of out of the way...

Anybody else?

	22-01-2002 05:02									#4
	Put an end to popups!

I use subs A LOT in sp - havent had the chance in mp as yet, so i'm waiting for more replies! hehe

	22-01-2002 05:46									#5
	Support Apolyton buy from Amazon

It's conceivable that the AI is just extremely rigorous about flying search patterns each turn to look for subs and/or units hidden in fungus, but I think that it has inside knowledge instead.

Humans can get some free inside knowledge like this by dragging as if to move a unit to various places. If there is a hidden obstacle to your movement, either because of fungus or lack of sensor info, the proposed path of your unit will be unusual or will not be shown at all (i.e. a straight line instead of tile by tile like if you drag a land unit across a few tiles onto a ship jsut offshore) and/or the distance shown will be wierd.

Unfortunately, the game's automatic movement routine will sometimes take unnecessary detours, like it will try to avoid paths where your unit would become adjacent to another factions unit, even if the shorter path would have been possible without ZOC problems.

	22-01-2002 07:26									#6
	Browse Apolyton AD-FREE

So basically, even if subs worked, a really meticulous human could essentially locate them, and any otherwise hidden units, just by clicking and dragging all over the place every turn? Man, that sucks. So much for hiding in the fungus, or using the cloaking device.
I appreciate you telling about that John. I for one had no idea, and it really imbalances MP against those who don't know such things. The more I find out about this game, the less I like it. The potential for a lot of cool strategies is just wasted by stupid things like that...

	22-01-2002 17:39									#7
	Tired of ads?

quote: Originally posted by vitamin j ... The more I find out about this game, the less I like it. The potential for a lot of cool strategies is just wasted by stupid things like that...

The incredible thing about SMAC is that the more stupid things about it you learn, the more you realize that it must ahd been a great game despite all the stupid things it has in it, which make you the more angry and happy at the same time... :sweet-sour: