21-01-2002 08:01									#1
	Technology Options Support Apolyton, buy Civilization: The Boardgame

I've only played Master of Orion 1 and 2 briefly, but I believe in those games the technologies you can research are random. Does anyone know if this is the case in MOO3 (or if it is even the case in MOO1 and MOO2)?

I remember in MOO2 that I had three techs left. I researched one of them but then the other two disapeared. All I had left was the "advaced techs".

If it is true that you only get a subset of the total techs, I think it would be nice to have a game option that allows all players to research everything.

Last edited by Zig on 21-01-2002 at 08:32

	21-01-2002 08:08									#2
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In moo3 you can research every standard tech. Whether or not you're able to is entirely different.

As for Antaran techs, those are a little harder to get.

	21-01-2002 08:24									#3
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From the official FAQ (technology section):

quote: Will the tech changes every time you play, like in Master of Orion I? Yes. We will have factor randomness and luck in the tech tree.

I can't quite decipher this question and answer, but it seems to me that upon any one game you will only get to have a random subset of all available techs.

Then there's this:

quote: Will every technology be universally available to all races? Yes, there is no unique technology for each species. However, some species may be better in some fields. You can now see the the wheel of technology by clicking here.

So I am confused.

	21-01-2002 08:47									#4
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As Stormhound has posted over in the official forums, each tech has a primary, secondary, and even perhaps a tertiary fundamental technology requirement. These can be either hardcoded or random (as per the FAQ). Thus the requirements of techs (number undisclosed) will vary between games.

As for the second part, there are no racial specific technologies. Silicoids don't get unique to Silicoid tech, for example. However, some races are better at certain fields of research (Harvesters have bonuses in biological research, for example.)

Hope that helps.

	21-01-2002 15:23									#5
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quote: Originally posted by Zig If it is true that you only get a subset of the total techs, I think it would be nice to have a game option that allows all players to research everything.

You mean something like MoO 2's Creative race pick?
No need to in MoO 3!

	21-01-2002 20:56									#6
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So my Silicoids will be able to do biological research this time? That was always a pain in MOO2; it was extremely difficult to feed my captured population as a lithovore.

	21-01-2002 22:45									#7
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Your silicoids will be able to research anything, although they will probably be better at some fields than others.

	22-01-2002 22:08									#8
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In moo3 you can research every standard tech. Whether or not you're able to is entirely different.


I was really hoping for a Moo1 like research system where you did only get a subset each game.

The reason is in ship design. In Moo2 once I knew what techs and weapons were good all my ships were basically the same. In Moo I still had weapons I liked, like the auto blaster and pulse phasor, but don't always get them. That forces me to design different ships each game which is much more satisfying.

	22-01-2002 22:16									#9
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Well the Moo3 tech tree is so large that I honestly believe that you'll have a similar effect just simply because you shouldn't be able to research everything before you win the game.

	22-01-2002 22:22									#10
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quote: Originally posted by Garth Vader That forces me to design different ships each game which is much more satisfying.

That's really old news, man. MoO 1 didn't have MP, and in MoO 2 MP one big pain is still the time lost in designing new ships. Now imagine if you kept looking which specs were the best for your ships everytime you got a new tech in a MP game!

	22-01-2002 22:29									#11
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quote: Originally posted by Sencho Well the Moo3 tech tree is so large that I honestly believe that you'll have a similar effect just simply because you shouldn't be able to research everything before you win the game.

You are going to include a cheat for us to explore all your hard work, right Stormie?

	23-01-2002 03:08									#12
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quote: You are going to include a cheat for us to explore all your hard work, right Stormie?

Good one. Besides, you wouldn't need a cheat, you can just look at the data files.

One good point that's been sort of brought up here is the decision a player will have to make about racing up the fundamental side of the tree vs. picking up lots of applied techs. Since getting new toys is no longer automatic, you have to decide which is more important...getting higher to grab better toys, or getting the toys you can NOW in case you need them soon.

	23-01-2002 03:24									#13
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That's really old news, man. MoO 1 didn't have MP, and in MoO 2 MP one big pain is still the time lost in designing new ships. Now imagine if you kept looking which specs were the best for your ships everytime you got a new tech in a MP game!

Yeah but one of the best parts of MP is battles between human designed ships.

It's only a pain if you design new ships with every tech discovery. I only design ships when I need to, or once I get a number of advances.

From my experience the biggest time sink in Moo2 MP was micromanagement, and the computer just sitting there doing something. That and space battles. My experience is limited to 2 and 3 player games over a LAN.

	23-01-2002 17:03									#14
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quote: Originally posted by Stormhound Besides, you wouldn't need a cheat, you can just look at the data files.

I don't think you get it. What I really want to is to wack everybody in the early game with the game's latest technology!

Like pressing Alt+einstein in MoO 2. Get it?

This way you're sure everybody will be able to see all the hard work you had in designing the tech wheel!

	24-01-2002 08:12									#15
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Perhaps Stormie doesn't want us to see all of his hard work in a single game, as a long term reward the merrier it is. If the tech engine needs to be swindled along in its entirety by the player only after several and several complete games in order to appreciate each compound, then if that really extend the replay value.

	24-01-2002 23:27									#16
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But MM, even MoO 2 itself has a considerable big tech tree, and I hardly ever played it to the end of it! When I reached the point of having overwhealming power, I sometimes used the cheat to have farther techs than I had, just to have new experiences and fun with them, earlyer in the game than the game itself forces me to research them!
So shouldn't we expect to explore MoO 3 in its whole?

	25-01-2002 19:17									#17
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Then, perhaps Stormhound can tell us if it is needed to reach the end of the tech tree in MoO3 in order to make a specific kind of victory, or is it like you say Zealot: a good player can win by whatever means when reaching, let's say, two thirds of the tree - something like previous 4x games.

	25-01-2002 19:52									#18
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Two thirds?
MM, in MoO2 you can win some games with Nuclear missiles and laser beams! With refinements, of course!

	25-01-2002 22:37									#19
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No, there is no SMAC-style "end of tree" victory condition.

	25-01-2002 22:40									#20
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quote: Originally posted by Stormhound No, there is no SMAC-style "end of tree" victory condition.

Pardon me for the threadjacking, but which are the victory conditions for MoO 3, Stormhound?