24-01-2002 22:14									#1
	Unit/Advances wishlist for expansion Browse Apolyton AD-FREE

Long time reader/player but first post on this board...

I for one would like to see some units in an expansion that offer a bridge between the units of the Napoleonic/Victorian era and the more modern units of WWII. Specifically, I would like to see some of the modern units such as fighters come just a bit later in the game while inserting some units with a WWI flavor to them.

1) Biplanes before fighters. The old Red Baron/Sopwith Camel type aircraft that served more of a scouting/intel role with some firepower. Bombs were dropped by hand from these aircraft and they could have a bombard power similar to cannons. They would look cool and offer some aerial units prior to fighters.

2) Zeppelins would look great. I would see them having very limited combat abilities but unlimited range (not in reality but in game terms). Could give them unique abilities such as creating five of them adds to citizen happiness (a one time bonus due to increased prestige, tourism, and trade). Five zeppelins = 1 happier citizen in each city with no additional happiness benefit for creating more than five. Also creating ten of them could open trade with civilizations not linked to your trade network.

3) I would like to see Meteorology as an advance. A wonder could be a National Weather Center that adds to food output in all your cities the way the skyfarm satellites did in SMAC. It could also allow the unit of "weather balloon" which could allow one to receive weather forcasts which could be traded to other civs and also enhance food production in the city square of the city of origin. Civs with both the Weather Center and Intelligence Agency could have "falsify weather report" as an espionage option which would decrease food production in the civ on which it was afflicted for the next twenty turns. Civs burned once might still buy weather reports from you but offer much less in return.

4) Hot air balloon as a non-combat unit would be nice. They would provide scouting with an unlimited range but there could be a probablity of them moving in a random direction rather than the one selected each time they are moved.

5) Trench warfare: this advance could lead to a "advanced fortified state" that adds the defensive bonuses of a fortress without requiring a fortress to be built. Nice to not have to drag a worker out to a defensive point every time.

6) Mustard gas: similar to the nerve gas in SMAC (boy I miss atrocities)

7) Personnel carriers: ships are great to carry troops on sea but a land equivalent would be nice. Could allow faster reinforcement of positions with the risk of losing several units at once. Only Infantry type (non-mounted) units could be carried.

8) Op Center: an enhanced fortress that offers defensive bonuses of a fortress and offers Zone of Control in the 8 surrounding squares. Could help turns "choke points" back into real choke points.

I hope there is to be an expansion because there is a lot that could be done to make the later parts of the game as fun as the early stages IMHO.

	24-01-2002 22:24									#2
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Wonderful ideas! How sad.

	24-01-2002 22:43									#3
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quote: Mustard gas: similar to the nerve gas in SMAC (boy I miss atrocities)

This one is highly unlikely given that they removed planting nukes/poisining the water supply after September 11.

	24-01-2002 22:44									#4
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I forgot one....

I would like to be able to infiltrate MY workers into the population of the cities of rival civs. By adding my citizens to the population of their cities I should be able to increase the chance of a cultural "take-over" of the city. Basically it would be a way to get the effect of propaganda by using migrant workers rather than cash. Obviously its a double-edged sword since the takeover bid could bakfire and just increase their cities' populatiuon.

	24-01-2002 22:44									#5
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These are great ideas. Modmakers?

I fail to see anything sad about it.

	24-01-2002 23:21									#6
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Your call for modmakers to help with this gentleman's suggestions bears a spooky resemblance to calls for medics at Normandy.

	24-01-2002 23:26									#7
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quote: Originally posted by Libertarian Your call for modmakers to help with this gentleman's suggestions bears a spooky resemblance to calls for medics at Normandy.

Your analogy sux because in Normandy real people lost their real lives. You should be ashamed.


BTW,
You still (as usual) haven't addressed why it is sad.

	24-01-2002 23:33									#8
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[...drawing a picture for Shaggy...]

An innocent and naive newbie has shared his excellent suggestions. Their only possible fate is to be sucked into a swirling vortex of contempt for customer concerns behind a long, long list of other excellent suggestions. I find that sad.

	24-01-2002 23:35									#9
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quote: Originally posted by Libertarian [...drawing a picture for Shaggy...] An innocent and naive newbie has shared his excellent suggestions. Their only possible fate is to be sucked into a swirling vortex of contempt for customer concerns behind a long, long list of other excellent suggestions. I find that sad.

[.... drawing picture for Lib .....]

I find you sad. Who the hell are to imply that a "newbie"'s suggestion are sad? (Without being clear that is what can be infered.) Your condesending tone is sad. You can't support anything but negativity.




I renew my call for mod makers.

	24-01-2002 23:38									#10
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Click the Profile icon. Click "Add Libertarian to Your Ignore List". Then you will be happy.

	25-01-2002 00:02									#11
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*hugs SLIC*

	25-01-2002 00:04									#12
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quote: Originally posted by Libertarian Click the Profile icon. Click "Add Libertarian to Your Ignore List". Then you will be happy.

But it is you that make me happy Lib!

	25-01-2002 00:10									#13
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quote: You can't support anything but negativity.

The fates were kind today to lay that delicious irony at my feet.

	25-01-2002 00:12									#14
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Hey ****gyRA....

Do you also hang out in the DoD forums? Just curious.

	25-01-2002 01:57									#15
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Actually, I kind of agree with Libertarian... it's sad, because the odds are, absolutely nothing will be done about it in the near future.

These are good ideas - and I've posted a few of my own in other threads - but I have seen little indication that this sort of debate can be anything more than purely rhetorical.

	25-01-2002 02:18									#16
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quote: Originally posted by FNBrown Actually, I kind of agree with Libertarian... it's sad, because the odds are, absolutely nothing will be done about it in the near future. These are good ideas - and I've posted a few of my own in other threads - but I have seen little indication that this sort of debate can be anything more than purely rhetorical.

That's why I think this would be best suited to the mod makers. Most of these ideas could be made in a mod.

	25-01-2002 02:46									#17
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Which ones?

	25-01-2002 02:55									#18
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quote: Originally posted by Libertarian Which ones?

1. could be done
2. could be made. The unique abilities couldn't be accomplished in the present editor.
3. could be done with the exception of weather reports
4. could be done with the exception of randomness
5. & 6. don't see how these could be done
7. could be done easy
8. could be done as a immobile unit but you would have to build some sort of land transport to carry it

	25-01-2002 02:59									#19
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So, that's 1 and 7, right?

	25-01-2002 03:00									#20
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quote: Originally posted by Libertarian So, that's 1 and 7, right?

Man you're dense.

	25-01-2002 03:05									#21
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Well, I might be dense. So let me look again.

...

Lessee, when you said things like "with the exception of weather reports", did you mean something else?

	25-01-2002 03:11									#22
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When Lib said it's sad, I think he meant the fact that his ideas are good but will never be acknowledged or implemented by Firaxis. Or mod makers.

When he said "Which ones" I think he was asking "Which mod makers?" Other than Vel and Korn (Who I think are pretty much finished with modding Civ 3) there's an uncomfortable lack of serious modders out there. I mean, the editor only goes so far...

	25-01-2002 03:17									#23
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Well, you're right about the first one. And you're right that the scenario makers, having been summarily shunned, are fading fast. But I did wonder which line items could be done. And it appears, at any rate, that only 1 and 7 can be done according to the OPer's specs.

	25-01-2002 03:19									#24
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quote: Originally posted by Libertarian Well, you're right about the first one. And you're right that the scenario makers, having been summarily shunned, are fading fast. But I did wonder which line items could be done. And it appears, at any rate, that only 1 and 7 can be done according to the OPer's specs.

Just trying to come up with ideas rather than being a naysayer.

	25-01-2002 03:22									#25
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There's definately a need for an expansion pack - that is, if the game creators have any interest in giving CivIII the kind of longevity that its predecessor enjoyed.

Then again, I've made no attempt at doing Mods or Scenarios myself, so maybe there's some means for game improvement already available to anyone who (unlike myself) isn't too lazy to do more than just whine about it.

	25-01-2002 03:24									#26
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quote: Just trying to come up with ideas rather than being a naysayer.

You might not yet have arrived, my friend, when I made my own list of ideas. And waited. And waited. And waited. It's sad, I tell you, when a decent person with decent input finds that he is doing nothing more than pissing in the wind.

Been there. Done that. Bought the t-shirt.

	25-01-2002 03:32									#27
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quote: Originally posted by Libertarian You might not yet have arrived, my friend, when I made my own list of ideas. And waited. And waited. And waited. It's sad, I tell you, when a decent person with decent input finds that he is doing nothing more than pissing in the wind. Been there. Done that. Bought the t-shirt.

And may that wind be at your back as you urinate within it...

	25-01-2002 03:35									#28
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Damn hurricanes.

	25-01-2002 03:37									#29
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Honestly, there's money to be made by t-shirts bearing the statement, "I tried to make Civ3 a better game and all I got was this lousy t-shirt". All you do is paste a picture of that girl from Starcraft somewhere and it'll sell like hotcakes in Korea.

Last edited by SixArmedMan on 25-01-2002 at 03:49

	25-01-2002 03:41									#30
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quote: Originally posted by Libertarian You might not yet have arrived, my friend, when I made my own list of ideas. And waited. And waited. And waited. It's sad, I tell you, when a decent person with decent input finds that he is doing nothing more than pissing in the wind. Been there. Done that. Bought the t-shirt.

Oh, I've been here at the Poly for almost 3 years. I saw your ideas, mostly aggreed, had nothing to contribute. Your just upset that you didn't get the recognition that you think (wrongly) that you deserved. Now when anybody has anything positive to contribute in any form you jump in with your whine. That's sad really.