29-01-2002 16:48									#1
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Ok, so Gunpowder and Mobile Warfare (I think?) render existing barracks obsolete. Which other techs have the same effect?

Carolus

	29-01-2002 18:53									#2
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Those advances don't really make barracks obsolete. They're sold off and you have to rebuild them. There are not any other advances that cause any other improvements to be sold off.

Other advances do have some effect on improvements. Communism reduces the effect of Cathedrals by 1.
Theology increases the effect of Cathedrals by 1.
Electronics increases the effect of Coloseums by 1.
Ceremonial Burial increases the effect of Temples by 1
Mysticism increases the effect of Temples by 1.
You have to have Monotheism to have cathredals work at all.

	29-01-2002 23:17									#3
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quote: Originally posted by Gothmog Those advances don't really make barracks obsolete. They're sold off and you have to rebuild them. There are not any other advances that cause any other improvements to be sold off.

Barracks are sold off when you discover certain techs, symbolising that the old schools of training military men are not fit for the present era. They are obsolete ("existing barracks are antique") and you have to rebuild them. But are there other advances triggering the selling off of barracks?

Carolus

	29-01-2002 23:24									#4
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quote: Originally posted by Carolus Rex But are there other advances that triggers the selling off of barracks?

No, I think you exhausted the list in your first post. It's probably worth noting, though, that each new version of barracks is more expensive to maintain: 1 gold/turn for ancient barracks, 2 gold/turn after gunpowder, 3 gold/turn after mobile warfare.

	29-01-2002 23:29									#5
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Hi!

Long time, no see.

Seems you answered my question while I was correcting my English. Thorough answer, as always. Thanks!

Carolus

	30-01-2002 21:13									#6
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Didn't understand your original question.
Gunpowder and Mobile Warfare are definately the only 2 advances that sell off barracks or makes them obsolete in your terms.

About the word obsolete; I was using it a very technical sense as CIV II uses it. Wonders and units, but not other city improvments are made obsolete by particular advances.

You used obsolete in a general sense, and I don't disagree with it.

	31-01-2002 03:40									#7
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quote: Originally posted by Gothmog Ceremonial Burial increases the effect of Temples by 1

Not quite ... you must have Ceremonial Burial to build Temples.

----------------------

SG(2)

	31-01-2002 20:25									#8
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quote: Originally posted by DaveV No, I think you exhausted the list in your first post. It's probably worth noting, though, that each new version of barracks is more expensive to maintain: 1 gold/turn for ancient barracks, 2 gold/turn after gunpowder, 3 gold/turn after mobile warfare.

Are we talking about Civ2????


Shade

	31-01-2002 20:38									#9
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quote: Originally posted by shade Are we talking about Civ2???? Shade

Yep, barracks definitely get sold off after gunpowder and mobile warfare, and increase in maintenance cost.

	31-01-2002 22:12									#10
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quote: Originally posted by Scouse Gits Not quite ... you must have Ceremonial Burial to build Temples. ---------------------- SG(2)

You're right. I make so many scenarios where I change around the pre-reqs so much that I forgot that.

	31-01-2002 22:56									#11
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Maybe you were thinking of Mysticism -- doesn't that double the effect of temples?

	01-02-2002 18:30									#12
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Since this thread has degenerated into a squibble about words I may as well continue...

Yes Campo, Gothmog was thinking of that. I even suspect that's why he mentioned it in his first post...

Carolus

	02-02-2002 00:40									#13
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quote: Originally posted by DrFell and increase in maintenance cost.

Howcome I never have to pay maintenance when I have Adam Smith's??
(btw I never found any refference to such thing in the game/manual)

Shade

	02-02-2002 04:25									#14
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1st barracks=1 gold maintainence
2nd barracks=2 gold
3rd barracks=3 gold.

Theoretically,Adam's would only pay for the first barracks since it pays upkeep on all improvements that cost 1 gold upkeep.

War Academy is good till the last barracks upgrade.A very good wonder when one considers all the possible maintainence that is saved...in addition to its normal benefits of allowing a flexible frontline.Too bad war academy doesn't give a barracks in every city(same landmass) like it does in Civ3

	02-02-2002 04:29									#15
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So why is there nothing about that to find in the game(ie Civ2.42)

Shade

	04-02-2002 16:15									#16
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I can't say whether you actually will find this info in the game or not. But hardly any game manual or in-game information covers everything.

Carolus

	04-02-2002 19:41									#17
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quote: Originally posted by Carolus Rex I can't say whether you actually will find this info in the game or not. But hardly any game manual or in-game information covers everything.

==> this would qualify as crucial info...
(not paying->paying double->paying tripple(that's as much as a bank))
Still,I never noticed any of that.

Shade

	04-02-2002 20:00									#18
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Is it not in the civiclopedia
There's a lot to learn by reading it
The informations about barracks are definitely true.
And someone might correct me as I am not sure, but I think that in ToT barracks are sold immediatly when the upgrading tech is discovered while in previous versions you need to sell them before they simply disappear. For example just before gunpowder, you ought to sell all your barracks for 40 gold each, because when you discover GP you lose them all. Am I right

	04-02-2002 20:51									#19
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From CIV2README.TXT:

code:

-------------------------------------------------------------
Rising Maintenance Cost for Barracks
-------------------------------------------------------------
The maintenance cost for the Barracks improvement increases by one gold 
each time it is rendered obsolete by a civilization advance.   When 
first constructed the cost is one gold.  After the discovery of Gunpowder 
and the Barracks is rebuilt it costs two gold.  Finally, after the 
discovery of Mobile Warfare and the Barracks is rebuilt the cost is 
three gold.

code:

The development of %STRING0 has rendered all existing
Barracks obsolete.  Antiquated Barracks sold for %NUMBER0 gold.

	05-02-2002 20:11									#20
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quote: Is it not in the civiclopedia

not that I know of...I think I'll look it up...

No,its very strange to me,it's the first time I hear of something like that...
I know they get solde after the invention of certain techs...wich happens immediately in Civ2(that I know for sure,you get a popup=> the invention of XXX has antiquated your barracks are sold of for YYY gold)

Shade

	06-02-2002 00:12									#21
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quote: From CIV2README.TXT:

Ok I had the chance to go take a look in the civilopedia

Shade

==> this is what I get:

	06-02-2002 00:22									#22
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and this is the rest my civilopedia tells me about baracks...
==>So you see why I am so surprised...
this is something I never have heared of before...
(and my version seems to mention it nowhere )

Attachment: barraks2.jpg
This has been downloaded 145 time(s).

	08-02-2002 13:42									#23
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Let's knock this one on the head ...
An F5 shot from a game in which Gunpowder, but not Mobile Warfare had been invented ...

Attachment: barracks.jpg
This has been downloaded 120 time(s).

	08-02-2002 20:23									#24
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(I'll try that with cheat one of the days...This is so strange)

Shade

	09-02-2002 05:22									#25
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Here is my knowledge:
1) Barracks cost 40 shields (1 gold/turn maintenance cost before discovery of Gunpowder).
2) When Gunpowder is discovered, all your barracks are sold automatically (40 gold each). If you rebuild any, the cost remains 40 shields but the upkeep becomes 2 gold/turn.
3) When Mobile Warfare is discovered, all your barracks are again sold automatically (40 gold each). If you rebuild any, the cost remains 40 shields, but the upkeep becomes 3 gold/turn.

STWA replaces all barracks anywhere in the world until Mobile Warfare makes it obsolete (but it also makes ANY unit veteran after 1 fight won, which is VERY precious when you build ironclads without owning LH).

	09-02-2002 05:49									#26
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Actually,in civ2,the war academy does NOT count as a barracks.
Makes any new land unit veteran and any unit that wins a combat is updated to veteran.
There is no "fast healing" of a barracks.

	09-02-2002 15:12									#27
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That's right. No 'fast healing' with STWA. I forgot to mention that.

	11-02-2002 07:11									#28
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quote: Originally posted by Smash There is no "fast healing" of a barracks.

The Civilopdia says about barracks: "Repairs damaged ground units in one turn". This can be seen on the picture provided by shade. Is the Civilopedia wrong here? Are there other mistakes in it as well and in the manual?!

	11-02-2002 15:19									#29
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The unit has to be in a city with barracks, though (to heal in one turn).

Yes, there are other mistakes in the documentation. I think there is a post about the major ones somewhere... One of them concerns the effect of JSB. There are also dubious advice in the manual, like the "tip" to reload whenever a hut outcome is unsatisfactory.

Carolus

	12-02-2002 06:16									#30
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Theres lots of them.
Hoover Dam is wrong I think.Cope's and Sir Isaac are switched.
The Capitolization entry says "converts sheilds into trade"
It says settlers under Commie eat 1 food

I could go on for awhile.