07-02-2002 23:15									#1
	My 2 cents worth... Support Apolyton, buy Alpha Centauri

= Why can't you airlift workers and/or settlers? (logic please)

= I agree with the Great Lighthouse argument (and in part with the late build of explorers, though not entirely)

= I disagree with the loss of forests permanently generating shields after they are first cut down; I understand it can be abused with a multitude of say, Democratic+Replacable Parts American workers, but they are still costing $$$)

*** Stuff I'd Like To See

* stacked moves and mass upgrades
* fortified units stay so after upgrades
* prioritize workers/settlers until after units build/science/etc...
* Alphabetize the City List from CTRL-SHIFT-G (pleaseeeee)
* a wee bit less corruption under Communism (damn, I miss fundamentalism)
* automated pollution cleanup for workers

I just have to say that overall the game is amazing, though I am a little bit disappointed with quality control given the amount of time Firaxis had to package this game. Oh yeah, the first patch is a very good example of that lack of attention to detail.

J.

(my first post, so don't burn too badly)

	07-02-2002 23:26									#2
	Support Apolyton, buy Call to Power 2

No need to flame you. In fact, I expect everything you listed but stacked movement to be included in the next patch. (I hope that stacks will make it, too, but I don't expect it.)

	07-02-2002 23:29									#3
	Support Apolyton buy from Amazon

Hi, and welcome to 'Poly!

I think that IFE (Infinite Forest Exploitation) was basically a cheat more than anything else, and I'm happy it has gone away with the patch.

Apart that, I agree with all the rest, especially stacked movement (oh, how I want that...).

BUT... there is a short key for workers to clean up pollution automatically. (Shift-P or Ctrl-P, I really can't remember it now). Unless you mean something else.

	07-02-2002 23:33									#4
	Put an end to popups!

"Why can't you airlift workers and/or settlers? (logic please) "

Realism: The settlers/workers represent lots and lots and lots of people and/or lots of heavy, awkward and relatively fragile equipment.

Play: By not allowing you to airlift settlers and workers you have far more difficulty moving population to isolated spots, and setting up new cities in those isolated places. We can already teleport 1 military unit per other airport to an airport city - I think it's good that we have to go to the trouble of sea/land movement to get those workers and settlers Over There.

"I understand it can be abused with a multitude of say, Democratic+Replacable Parts American workers, but they are still costing $$$)"

How much money? IIRC, it required 7 workers to plant and clear a forest square in 1 turn. That's 7 bucks for 10 shields - an excellent deal.
Pretend the next sentence is all in BOLD: And that assumes the workers aren't captured.

Captured workers don't require any $$ for upkeep.

"* stacked moves "

Well, duh.

"and mass upgrades "

Do you know that SHIFT-U allows you to upgrade all eligable units of the selected type?

"* fortified units stay so after upgrades"

No argument there.

"* prioritize workers/settlers until after units build/science/etc... "

What do you mean?

" Alphabetize the City List from CTRL-SHIFT-G (pleaseeeee) "

That'd be nice.

"* a wee bit less corruption under Communism (damn, I miss fundamentalism) "

You can add Fundamentalism... but you don't have very many ways to differentiate it from the other govs.

I think it'd be good if they allowed the editor to adjust the overall level of corruption.

"* automated pollution cleanup for workers "

You know that SHIFT-P is automated cleanup? And that SHIFT-A workers have cleanup as a high prioroty?

You know the problem with both the above options? (Its that, post-patch, only 2 automated workers will clean up a square. You can assign more workers manual. IIRC, a Firaxis person said it was a bug.

"Oh yeah, the first patch is a very good example of that lack of attention to detail. "

I really hope the Air Superiority bug due to a lack of time, not because they missed it.

	07-02-2002 23:35									#5
	Support Apolyton, pre-order Civilization IV

quote: Originally posted by Alexnm BUT... there is a short key for workers to clean up pollution automatically. (Shift-P or Ctrl-P, I really can't remember it now). Unless you mean something else.

Yeah... shift P does that...
However, it could use some fine tuning. Right now, it will only send a maximum of two workers to a polluted square... which is fine if they are your own workers, and it's a grassland square.
But if they aren't your own workers, and it's a mountain square, it will take forever to clean it up...

	08-02-2002 08:20									#6
	Re: My 2 cents worth... Lose 30 kilos (of popups)

quote: Originally posted by infinityinc * stacked moves and mass upgrades

Shift-U will upgrade any unit that's in a city with a Barracks.

	08-02-2002 11:38									#7
	The Worker Fix Suffering from ads?

Simple and logical IFE fix for Civ 4.
No more than 1 worker can plant a forest and make it require 10 turns to grow or 10 to cut it down. Logically you could use a lot of workers in RL to plant a large forest or cut down a forest but you can't force something to grow overnight.
When a 2nd worker attempts to plant in the same square.

[A worker is already planting a forest in this square].

So for IFE you'd need 10 planters, 10 woodcutters, and 10 grassland/plain/floodplain spaces. And for 20 workers +10 production a turn seems pretty small comapred to making a Size 1 village a Size 21 Metropolis in a single turn.