15-02-2002 04:26									#1
	Undocumented chages in 1.17f Enter the AD-FREE zone

Since 1.16f had many undocumented chages (for ex. costs of some buildings & tech increased), have you seen any undocumented changes in 1.17f?

	15-02-2002 04:27									#2
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Editor could help a lot.
(comparing old and new bic files)

	15-02-2002 04:27									#3
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I noticed that the Settler area indicator is back.

	15-02-2002 04:49									#4
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Someone check the unit strengths. There was a "Unit Strength By Era" thread started by a Firaxian in the Strategy section.

	15-02-2002 04:51									#5
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quote: Originally posted by Slax Someone check the unit strengths. There was a "Unit Strength By Era" thread started by a Firaxian in the Strategy section.

That thread was main reson of making retreat less powerfull.

	15-02-2002 06:58									#6
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Building & pop bombard defense is increased to 16 (was 8 in 1.16f and 4 in 1.07f).

I guess it makes even harder to kill pop & buildings.

	15-02-2002 08:53									#7
	Changes to rules (BIC) file for 1.17 patch Suffering from ads?

Here are the changes I have found in the rules file (Civ3mod.bic) for the new patch (1.17) compared to the previous one (1.16). Some of these are mentioned in the readme file, but some are not.

Buildings and Wonders

• Coastal Fortress maintenance is now 0 gold/turn (was 1).
  
• Great Lighthouse now costs 300 shields (was 400).
  
• Forbidden Palace now costs 200 shields (was 300).
  
• Wall Street now costs 300 shields (was 400).
  

Last edited by Nero Would on 26-03-2002 at 17:47

	15-02-2002 10:34									#8
	Avatar Enlargement: We've got the solution

It's obviously too early to have completed anything approaching a statistically valid test, but it seems that it's now more likely to get settlers from goody huts. I started a game tonight and got 4 of them. Yes, 4 in one game. Not only that, two rival civs popped up cities suspiciously far from their base of operations, one of them close to me, which leads me to think they got goody-hut settlers, too.

Of course, it could be luck or coincidence. Only time (and maybe Firaxis eventually) will tell.

	15-02-2002 13:30									#9
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Great info Nero

It's just kind of information I was looking about.

	15-02-2002 14:34									#10
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Lucky it found its way to your eyes.

	15-02-2002 15:41									#11
	Full PM-box? Change here!

before the patch could you make a miltary academy after winning a single battle with an army? (or possibly it was just creating the army that did it).
salvor, out of half a dozen goody huts, i got 2 maps revealers, 2 techs, and 2 settlers.

oh and btw you can really stick it to the computer now that they cant trade techs during your turn.

	15-02-2002 16:05									#12
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quote: "Game" resource gives +2 food (was +1).

I think this makes Game one of the best starting resources, with both lots of food and lots of shields.

quote: Unhappiness from pop rush and draft now lasts 40 turns (was 20).

Together with the elimination of the "Despot-rush"-strategy pop rushing has become perhaps too difficult, IMHO.

	15-02-2002 19:11									#13
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quote: Originally posted by Hurricane Together with the elimination of the "Despot-rush"-strategy pop rushing has become perhaps too difficult, IMHO.

I think the unhappiness is meant by "eliminating despot rush"

	15-02-2002 20:04									#14
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quote: Originally posted by Libertarian I noticed that the Settler area indicator is back.

It was only lost in the incorrect 1.16f

	15-02-2002 21:14									#15
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Edit: Message removed because it was totally incorrect. Oops. Thanks to lockstep for providing the correct information.

Now I need to get some good Norwegian coffee.

Last edited by Salvor on 15-02-2002 at 21:32

	15-02-2002 21:23									#16
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In v1.17f, the military acadamy still requires a) the technology 'military tradition' b) a victorious army. The Pentagon requires 3 armies in the field.

	15-02-2002 21:28									#17
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Nero, your work continues to amaze me, here and elsewhere.

	15-02-2002 21:28									#18
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quote: Originally posted by player1 Building & pop bombard defense is increased to 16 (was 8 in 1.16f and 4 in 1.07f). I guess it makes even harder to kill pop & buildings.

I thought it was bad enough sending 10 waves of stealth bombers only to destroy a damn library.

	16-02-2002 01:12									#19
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quote: Originally posted by Nero Would Army unit gets Blitz and Zone of Control abilities

Can anybody clarify what exactly this means? Especially the blitz part?

Nero Would: Thank you so much for putting together that list!

	16-02-2002 01:24									#20
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Ok i didn't see this mentioned in the documentation but i've just come across it.

If you change governments as a religious civ you no longer have to wait until the next turn to select the government type, it's instantaneous right after the revolution is launched, and you take on the new form of government right away.

this is a big change and a really good one!!!

	16-02-2002 01:34									#21
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[QUOTE] Originally posted by Platypus


Can anybody clarify what exactly this means? Especially the blitz part?



Blitz means you can attack multiple times. Cavalry, for instance, can attack multiple times per turn but three cavalry in an army attacks only once per turn instead of three. They say this is changed but has anyone used the patch and seen this yet?

Zone of Control is when a unit passes an enemy unit and gets fired upon without a direct confrontation, less of a big deal than blitz, which I'm thrilled about if it's true...

	16-02-2002 01:43									#22
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i know blitz works, didnt see zoc happening. i made an army of several veteran cavalrymen and i could attack multiple times with it, just like a modern armor (which also has blitz)

	16-02-2002 01:47									#23
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quote: Originally posted by Mizaq i know blitz works, didnt see zoc happening. i made an army of several veteran cavalrymen and i could attack multiple times with it, just like a modern armor (which also has blitz)

Nice add-on for armies.

	16-02-2002 02:55									#24
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I'm a little confused. Calvary can blitz now, or have they always been able to blitz?

	16-02-2002 03:04									#25
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quote: Originally posted by jfox [Blitz means you can attack multiple times. Cavalry, for instance, can attack multiple times per turn but three cavalry in an army attacks only once per turn instead of three. They say this is changed but has anyone used the patch and seen this yet?

I haven't seen it in the patch, but from korn's blitz mod (which, IIRC, was the first to add blitz to armies) I can confirm that cavalry armies are able to attack multiple times. The problem - at least in Civ3 1.16 - is that any retreat costs one movement point (and movement points = no. of attacks per turn), therefore a cavalry army (3 movement points) that attacks a city with numerous defenders will only be able to attack two times per turn.

quote: Originally posted by Playa del Carmen I'm a little confused. Calvary can blitz now, or have they always been able to blitz?

A single cavalry still can't blitz, but an army composed of cavalry is able to blitz now.

	16-02-2002 03:06									#26
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quote: Originally posted by Salvor It's obviously too early to have completed anything approaching a statistically valid test, but it seems that it's now more likely to get settlers from goody huts. I started a game tonight and got 4 of them. Yes, 4 in one game. Not only that, two rival civs popped up cities suspiciously far from their base of operations, one of them close to me, which leads me to think they got goody-hut settlers, too. Of course, it could be luck or coincidence. Only time (and maybe Firaxis eventually) will tell.

Now that you've mentioned it, I believe I noticed the same thing. I can't be positive though. I thought I was just being very lucky.

	16-02-2002 03:09									#27
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quote: Originally posted by Gramphos It was only lost in the incorrect 1.16f

It still worked for me.

	16-02-2002 03:10									#28
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quote: Originally posted by lockstep A single cavalry still can't blitz, but an army composed of cavalry is able to blitz now.

Ah, thank you. That makes sense.

	16-02-2002 03:13									#29
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* Barbarians are allowed build all units except civ unique units (before they were only allowed Warriers, Horsemen and Galleys). I haven't checked to see if they really do build them.




I think this mainly affects units you get from goody huts. I found some goody huts really late in the game that hadn't been popped yet off on an isolated island and pulled a tank from one of them..

	16-02-2002 03:15									#30
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quote: Originally posted by jfox Zone of Control is when a unit passes an enemy unit and gets fired upon without a direct confrontation, less of a big deal than blitz, which I'm thrilled about if it's true...

Did you happen to notice whether it was more effective now? Before, the unit may or may not actually hit something. And if it did, it only did 1 hit point of damage. I'm really hoping they've improved it, but I haven't had a chance to see yet.